Migrants

[CapeRed]

3 hours ago, Jairzinho said:

Decades of being ignored by the Labour party. Towns up and down the country looking like Detroit. A complete disinterest or annoyance at the focus on social policies. The complexity of left wing positions compared to those on the right.

 

Couple all of this with the worst media in western europe and you have the perfect conditions for some right wing bullshit. Some simplistic ideas that many people were primed to believe. Many of the people who did/do so are indeed complete idiots. But it shouldn't have ever got to this point. These people should have been represented by the Labour Party, and they haven't been. Hence many people who should be voting Labour don't, and should have voted remain but didn't.

 

They rolled the dice, because they felt they had fuck all to lose. As incorrect as they were.

 

 

I left the UK when Thatcher was slowly destroying industry in Liverpool but my view from here is that the Labour party of today is possibly closer to the Tory party of the eighties.  Back in the 80's many labour mps were from working class backgrounds and worked for the people. Todays mps have gone into uni with the sole aim of becoming a politician and making loads of money and a lot of them really dont give a fuck about Joe Public. I could be miles out here as I never see anything about grass roots stuff.

[Anubis]

The local fishermen association are saying that the lifeboat tried to launch down a different arm of the dock than normal and there was a row about the fishing boat blocking it that wasn’t related to migrants, but that a lorry driver shouted something about migrants.

 

This guy says differently.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

9 minutes ago, CapeRed said:

I left the UK when Thatcher was slowly destroying industry in Liverpool but my view from here is that the Labour party of today is possibly closer to the Tory party of the eighties.  Back in the 80's many labour mps were from working class backgrounds and worked for the people. Todays mps have gone into uni with the sole aim of becoming a politician and making loads of money and a lot of them really dont give a fuck about Joe Public. I could be miles out here as I never see anything about grass roots stuff.

There are some decent grassroots Labour MPs in Liverpool these days (since some of the New Labour appointees got spooked by Democratic Socialism and fucked off to Nando's): Ian Byrne, Kim Johnson, Paula Barker & Dan Carden. There are, no doubt, others elsewhere in the country. The Deputy Leader came from a working class background and was a trade unionist before becoming an MP.

 

Unfortunately, these are the people being squeezed by the party leader and his clique.

[Captain Willard]

1 hour ago, Jairzinho said:

The editors argue they are only reflecting the views of their readers. It’s a circular discussion, readers buy the paper that reflects their views and in turn it amplifies them. I think it’s naive to think if the right wing press went away overnight, the anti immigration hostility would magically stop, it’s much more ingrained in people’s brains than that. 

[Jairzinho]

Just now, Captain Willard said:

The editors argue they are only reflecting the views of their readers. It’s a circular discussion, readers buy the paper that reflects their views and in turn it amplifies them. I think it’s naive to think if the right wing press went away overnight, the anti immigration hostility would magically stop, it’s much more ingrained in people’s brains than that. 

The editors are lying fucking cunts. It isn't a circular discussion at all. That is a pitiful cop out, that even they don't believe. 

 

Of course it's ingrained, there have been decades and decades of this poisonous shit. It would probably need a generation to cleanse society of this mendacious cuntery. 

 

Who has said anything about "magically stopping"? 

[CapeRed]

28 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

There are some decent grassroots Labour MPs in Liverpool these days (since some of the New Labour appointees got spooked by Democratic Socialism and fucked off to Nando's): Ian Byrne, Kim Johnson, Paula Barker & Dan Carden. There are, no doubt, others elsewhere in the country. The Deputy Leader came from a working class background and was a trade unionist before becoming an MP.

 

Unfortunately, these are the people being squeezed by the party leader and his clique.

Good to see it needs to happen in other places too if Labour are to appeal to the working man again. 

[Arniepie]

25 minutes ago, CapeRed said:

Good to see it needs to happen in other places too if Labour are to appeal to the working man again. 

It still blows my mind that people see the likes of Farage and johnson as 'men of the people'

[Strontium]

37 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

The editors argue they are only reflecting the views of their readers. It’s a circular discussion, readers buy the paper that reflects their views and in turn it amplifies them. I think it’s naive to think if the right wing press went away overnight, the anti immigration hostility would magically stop, it’s much more ingrained in people’s brains than that. 

 

Hard to disagree with any of this. Hostility to "foreigners" and "immigrants" is centuries old and pre-dates not just the right-wing media, but universal literacy. Organs like the Daily Mail undoubtedly have a role today in fuelling these sentiments, but you can't fuel a fire that doesn't exist, and it would not be possible if they weren't reflecting something that is in society already.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 hour ago, Captain Willard said:

The editors argue they are only reflecting the views of their readers. It’s a circular discussion, readers buy the paper that reflects their views and in turn it amplifies them. I think it’s naive to think if the right wing press went away overnight, the anti immigration hostility would magically stop, it’s much more ingrained in people’s brains than that. 

That persistent propaganda fuels false fears of being "swamped" and baseless envy of all the riches which are supposedly lavished on asylum seekers. The hate-rags print lies consistently and people assume that there's at least some truth to it. That's what drives the absolute worst excesses of anti-immigrant/anti-refugee actions in the UK.

[Captain Willard]

30 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

Hard to disagree with any of this. Hostility to "foreigners" and "immigrants" is centuries old and pre-dates not just the right-wing media, but universal literacy. Organs like the Daily Mail undoubtedly have a role today in fuelling these sentiments, but you can't fuel a fire that doesn't exist, and it would not be possible if they weren't reflecting something that is in society already.

Fully agree. I think it’s psychologically comforting to blame the right wing media for xenophobia because it implies that it can be somehow stopped. I think it’s much more ingrained in humans to distrust and be hostile to other groups and as you say, it pre dates widespread literacy let alone the daily mail. Pogroms against the Jews have gone on for centuries. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

4 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

Fully agree. I think it’s psychologically comforting to blame the right wing media for xenophobia because it implies that it can be somehow stopped. I think it’s much more ingrained in humans to distrust and be hostile to other groups and as you say, it pre dates widespread literacy let alone the daily mail. Pogroms against the Jews have gone on for centuries. 

I don't think anyone is claiming that the racist media and politicians are 100% the cause of hostility to immigrants and refugees: the point is that that hostility is much more widespread and dangerous than it would be if the hate-rags didn't promote it.

[Jairzinho]

24 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

Fully agree. I think it’s psychologically comforting to blame the right wing media for xenophobia because it implies that it can be somehow stopped. I think it’s much more ingrained in humans to distrust and be hostile to other groups and as you say, it pre dates widespread literacy let alone the daily mail. Pogroms against the Jews have gone on for centuries. 

How curious that it appears to manifest itself more in countries that have a particularly unpleasant media.

 

[Strontium]

I had no idea Jairz was an expert in world media. You learn something new every day.

[Captain Willard]

35 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

How curious that it appears to manifest itself more in countries that have a particularly unpleasant media.

 

I’m genuinely interested in which countries you think don’t have a xenophobic minority ? 

[Bjornebye]

20 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

I’m genuinely interested in which countries you think don’t have a xenophobic minority ? 

I can think of a few that have a xenophobic majority 

[Section_31]

That fisherman stuff is a new low, smelly bastards, I hope they sink and die, write a shanty about that you turtle neck cunts.

[Harry's Lad]

22 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

That fisherman stuff is a new low, smelly bastards, I hope they sink and die, write a shanty about that you turtle neck cunts.

The same lifeboat crew would undoubtedly risk their own lives to save them as well.

Shameful stuff from those fishermen.

[Section_31]

4 minutes ago, Harry's Lad said:

The same lifeboat crew would undoubtedly risk their own lives to save them as well.

Shameful stuff from those fishermen.

There's supposed to be a code of the sea that you come to people in distress, regardless of any other concern, it's like Bushido shit that you just don't fuck with. They're rats.

[Arniepie]

6 hours ago, Anubis said:

The local fishermen association are saying that the lifeboat tried to launch down a different arm of the dock than normal and there was a row about the fishing boat blocking it that wasn’t related to migrants, but that a lorry driver shouted something about migrants.

 

This guy says differently.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wonder where that hostility to a profession based on saving lives comes from?

[Bjornebye]

4 minutes ago, Arniepie said:

I wonder where that hostility to a profession based on saving lives comes from?

The likes of Farage, Hopkins etc calling the RNLI a taxi service 

[Arniepie]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

The likes of Farage, Hopkins etc calling the RNLI a taxi service 

Exactly.

Nigel man of the people Farage.

 

[Jairzinho]

3 hours ago, Captain Willard said:

I’m genuinely interested in which countries you think don’t have a xenophobic minority ? 

None. Hence the word "more".

 

Why do you insist in pretending this is an either/or thing? That's utterly ludicrous. 

[Arniepie]

I'm not sure if it's an inherently human thing but we do seem to have a particular strain of superiority in this country,which is probally a legacy of our colonial past.

I think that certainly plays a part.

[Bjornebye]

2 minutes ago, Arniepie said:

I'm not sure if it's an inherently human thing but we do seem to have a particular strain of superiority in this country,which is probally a legacy of our colonial past.

I think that certainly plays a part.

And a very arrogant attitude when abroad. It’s not exclusive to the British though 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

7 hours ago, CapeRed said:

I left the UK when Thatcher was slowly destroying industry in Liverpool 

Fucking economic migrants, coming to steal our jobs. Send the buggers back!