Russia v Ukraine

[TheHowieLama]

19 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

Just popped in to say men can’t become women.  

 

It's the hope that kills you.

[Rico1304]

7 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

 

It's the hope that kills you.

Sorry - couldnt resist. 

[Bobby Hundreds]

How to say you've never seen Miss Doubtfire without saying you've never seen Miss Doubtfire.

[Gnasher]

If any of the signatories of this letter expressed their veiws on here they'd probably also be called Putins rats. 

 

 

 

 

From yesterday's Financial Times. 

 

 

 

Of course the tratiors above know fuck all about international geo politics when compared to the likes of Mugface and Curlylocks on a football forum. 

 

[Section_31]

You having this one Gnasher or what?

[Gnasher]

4 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

You having this one Gnasher or what?

 

 

Or this one  

 

 

 

 

followed by this one. 

 

 

[SasaS]

1 hour ago, Gnasher said:

If any of the signatories of this letter expressed their veiws on here they'd probably also be called Putins rats. 

 

 

 

 

From yesterday's Financial Times. 

 

 

 

Of course the tratiors above know fuck all about international geo politics when compared to the likes of Mugface and Curlylocks on a football forum. 

 

 

Not sure you would personally choose to march under the same banner with Victor "Make Europe Great Again" Orban and his fans.

[Gnasher]

12 minutes ago, SasaS said:

 

Not sure you would personally choose to march under the same banner with Victor "Make Europe Great Again" Orban and his fans.

 

Victor Orban is not one of the signatories of the letter published in the FT. Anyway being in agreement on one subject does not mean you agree on all. 

[SasaS]

2 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Victor Orban is not one of the signatories of the letter published in the FT. Anyway being in agreement on one subject does not mean you agree on all. 

 

 The letter was prompted by Orban's bizarre tour (which created no momentum they talk about, since Putin told him he is not interested in peace talks), repeats his points and argument on Ukraine, using his language.

 

And as always, it is up to Ukrainians to decide if, when and how much of their own land they are willing to give to their invaders, in the hope they would then leave them alone.

[Gnasher]

11 minutes ago, SasaS said:

 

 The letter was prompted by Orban's bizarre tour (which created no momentum they talk about, since Putin told him he is not interested in peace talks), repeats his points and argument on Ukraine, using his language.

 

And as always, it is up to Ukrainians to decide if, when and how much of their own land they are willing to give to their invaders, in the hope they would then leave them alone.

 

Peace talks do not have to start or end with Orban. As for Ukraine they'll have a much harder decision to make if they stop receiving western handouts. 

[SasaS]

5 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Peace talks do not have to start or end with Orban. As for Ukraine they'll have a much harder decision to make if they stop receiving western handouts. 

 

They are "receiving western handouts" because they are being invaded by Russia and fighting to defend their country.

[Gnasher]

8 minutes ago, SasaS said:

 

They are "receiving western handouts" because they are being invaded by Russia and fighting to defend their country.

 

Yeah I know.

 

As I said if we chose to stop the handouts they would have a more difficult choice to make. So in reality it's not entirely 'up to them' unless they chose to fight on without western money and weapons. 

[SasaS]

9 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Yeah I know.

 

As I said if we chose to stop the handouts they would have a more difficult choice to make. So in reality it's not entirely 'up to them' unless they chose to fight on without western money and weapons. 

 

They fought on when America paused its assistance, mostly because they have little choice. Russia only increased attacks during that period, pause in assistance didn't bring peace any closer.

 

It's up to them to decide if they want to admit defeat, give up their land and hope Russia will stop at that. It's up to their allies to decide if they want to stop supporting them.

 

 

[Gnasher]

12 minutes ago, SasaS said:

 

They fought on when America paused its assistance, mostly because they have little choice. Russia only increased attacks during that period, pause in assistance didn't bring peace any closer.

 

It's up to them to decide if they want to admit defeat, give up their land and hope Russia will stop at that. It's up to their allies to decide if they want to stop supporting them.

 

 

 

Technically correct. In reality he whom pays the piper choses the tune. Ukraine won't be hearing much music without western aid. 

[Strontium]

2 hours ago, Gnasher said:

If any of the signatories of this letter expressed their veiws on here they'd probably also be called Putins rats. 

 

 

 

 

From yesterday's Financial Times. 

 

 

 

Of course the tratiors above know fuck all about international geo politics when compared to the likes of Mugface and Curlylocks on a football forum. 

 

A bit of background on Lord Skidelsky

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Skidelsky

 

In March 2014, it was reported that Skidelsky was a director on the board of the Russian state-owned company Rusnano Capital. After Russia annexed Crimea in 2014, Skidelsky declined to resign from Rusnano, criticised sanctions that targeted Russia and argued that the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine should be given an opportunity to separate from Ukraine.
 

Between 2016 and 1 January 2022, Skidelsky was a non-executive director on the board of Russian oil company Russneft.
 

On 28 February 2022, he signed a letter to the Financial Times on the subject of Ukraine, along with David Owen and others, that stated: "NATO governments have rightly said they are willing to address Russia's security concerns, but then say in the same breath that Russia has no legitimate security concerns because NATO is a purely defensive alliance. Whether we like it or not, a NATO that now borders Russia and could in future border even more of Russia is seen by Russia as a security concern."
 

On 17 April 2022, he argued against Finland's joining NATO and shortly after against the imposition of economic sanctions on Russia following the invasion of Ukraine. In June 2023 Skidelsky attended a party held by Russian embassy in London and later explained he wanted to show "respect and affection for the Russian people on their national day, especially in these circumstances".
 

On 22 November 2023, following a recommendation put forward two weeks previously, Lord Skidelsky was suspended from the House of Lords for one month after it was found that he had breached the House's Code of Conduct while acting as Chair of the Centre for Global Studies, an economics think tank.

 

Little more than a Russian shill.

[Gnasher]

13 minutes ago, Strontium said:

 

A bit of background on Lord Skidelsky

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Skidelsky

 

In March 2014, it was reported that Skidelsky was a director on the board of the Russian state-owned company Rusnano Capital. After Russia annexed Crimea in 2014, Skidelsky declined to resign from Rusnano, criticised sanctions that targeted Russia and argued that the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine should be given an opportunity to separate from Ukraine.
 

Between 2016 and 1 January 2022, Skidelsky was a non-executive director on the board of Russian oil company Russneft.
 

On 28 February 2022, he signed a letter to the Financial Times on the subject of Ukraine, along with David Owen and others, that stated: "NATO governments have rightly said they are willing to address Russia's security concerns, but then say in the same breath that Russia has no legitimate security concerns because NATO is a purely defensive alliance. Whether we like it or not, a NATO that now borders Russia and could in future border even more of Russia is seen by Russia as a security concern."
 

On 17 April 2022, he argued against Finland's joining NATO and shortly after against the imposition of economic sanctions on Russia following the invasion of Ukraine. In June 2023 Skidelsky attended a party held by Russian embassy in London and later explained he wanted to show "respect and affection for the Russian people on their national day, especially in these circumstances".
 

On 22 November 2023, following a recommendation put forward two weeks previously, Lord Skidelsky was suspended from the House of Lords for one month after it was found that he had breached the House's Code of Conduct while acting as Chair of the Centre for Global Studies, an economics think tank.

 

Little more than a Russian shill.

 

Give over. You've been reading to many John le Carre books .The others all reds under the beds as well? Anyone who tries for peace gets muck raked. We were bessie mates with both Russia and China till a few years ago. David Cameron kindly to the Chinese president down the pub whilst idiot George Osborne was letting slip all our secrets. They even dressed Katie Windsor all in red for the banquet. We embarrassed ourselves. 

[SasaS]

23 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Technically correct. In reality he whom pays the piper choses the tune. Ukraine won't be hearing much music without western aid. 

 

You seem to think it's a bad thing to support a country defending itself from invasion.

[TheSire]

1 hour ago, Gnasher said:

 

Yeah I know.

 

As I said if we chose to stop the handouts they would have a more difficult choice to make. So in reality it's not entirely 'up to them' unless they chose to fight on without western money and weapons. 

Of course its up to them. I see your point, but it's still there choice and nobody else's. 

[TheSire]

19 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Give over. You've been reading to many John le Carre books .The others all reds under the beds as well? Anyone who tries for peace gets muck raked. We were bessie mates with both Russia and China till a few years ago. David Cameron kindly to the Chinese president down the pub whilst idiot George Osborne was letting slip all our secrets. They even dressed Katie Windsor all in red for the banquet. We embarrassed ourselves. 

Come on. Fucking hell. Don't take it personally. 

[Gnasher]

4 minutes ago, TheSire said:

Come on. Fucking hell. Don't take it personally. 

 

I'm not. 

[TheHowieLama]

Two Indian men fighting for Russia in its war against Ukraine have appealed to Indian authorities to help them get back home as they described the “horrific” situation on the frontlines, with one of them saying 13 of 15 non-Russians in his unit had been killed.

The meeting earlier this week between Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Russian President Vladimir Putin in Moscow, during which the return of Indians fighting in the war was discussed, had raised the men’s hopes of getting back home.

Neither man joined the Russian military of their own volition. Gagandeep said he had gone to Russia on a tourist visa on the advice of someone who said an increased travel history would help him get work in England. In Russia, he said he and some of his friends took a taxi to Belarus, where they had an argument with the taxi driver who ultimately left them stranded on a road and left. He said they were picked up from there by police, who told them they did not have the requisite visas to be in Belarus, and eventually handed them over to the Russian military.

 

https://indianexpress.com/article/cities/kolkata/bengal-man-urgen-tamang-duped-into-russian-army-hopes-swift-return-9448678/

[Ne Moe Imya]

Really going to be a sad day for the world when Trump wins in November, but mostly for the poor Ukrainians.

 

Now that he's picked the most rabid Gnasher-type out of the Republicans as his running mate, it is very clear what his position is on Ukraine.

 

The aid will stop immediately, the Ukrainians will be forced to fight on with just what Europe can give them, and maybe after another year or two of war (all the while Trump insisting that there's a "peace plan" - i.e. capitulation to the Russian demands - on the table) they'll give up and sign some sort of armistice.

 

All of which will result in thousands of Ukrainians being tortured and raped in dark basements in Russian-held territory and Russia re-arming itself over the next 5-10 years to attack again to finish them off.

 

The world is a horrible, horrible place sometimes.

[Anubis]

1 hour ago, Ne Moe Imya said:

Now that he's picked the most rabid Gnasher-type out of the Republicans as his running mate, it is very clear what his position is on Ukraine.

Gnasher is nothing like Vance. Behave.

[HazelyCosmicJove]

Does Europe really have a choice not to defend Ukraine? Should the Russians succeed then surely we will have a refugee crisis as millions of Ukrainians seek safety in neighbouring countries? What sort of behaviour can the people who remain expect from a triumphant Red Army which now includes many convicted criminals? If Trump withdraws from NATO does the clock start clicking towards the day when Russia has re-armed/re-equipped and has a pop at a NATO country? 

[Section_31]

9 minutes ago, HazelyCosmicJove said:

Does Europe really have a choice not to defend Ukraine? Should the Russians succeed then surely we will have a refugee crisis as millions of Ukrainians seek safety in neighbouring countries? What sort of behaviour can the people who remain expect from a triumphant Red Army which now includes many convicted criminals? If Trump withdraws from NATO does the clock start clicking towards the day when Russia has re-armed/re-equipped and has a pop at a NATO country? 

 

The Italians are pro Putin and possibly the French will be soon too. 

 

You have to take your hats off to the Russians, they've used our own weaknesses against us and completely dismantled our political and social way of life in less than 20 years. 

 

It's impossible to watch the Republican convention and not think that's a beaten country.