Russia v Ukraine

[Gnasher]

 

Nice of them if true, don't worry about the deaths,

 

 

[Red Phoenix]

Can't help but laugh at US politics at times.

 

 

 

[Bjornebye]

On 25/01/2022 at 09:00, YorkshireRed said:

Some relevance to the thread. Definitely a fabulous read.

 

 

Yep great book. 

[Section_31]

ha, fucking hell, what a hovel we've become. 

 

American officials fear that they will be unable to impose effective sanctions on President Putin if Russia invades Ukraine because of years of British tolerance of suspect money flooding into London.

Diplomatic sources told The Times that US State Department officials had expressed “dismay and frustration” at the British government’s failure to take tough action against the flow of Russian funds, particularly in “Londongrad”.

[Mike D]

Let’s bomb Russia!

 

 

Ps I do not condone bombing Russia or any Tory politics.

[TheHowieLama]

1 hour ago, Section_31 said:

the British government’s failure to take tough action against the flow of Russian funds, particularly in “Londongrad”.

Roman Abramovich does not like this.

[Arniepie]

I'm no conspiracy theorist and certainly no Putin apologist but I always get a bit wary when we are continually just given 1 side of a story.

[Section_31]

9 hours ago, Arniepie said:

I'm no conspiracy theorist and certainly no Putin apologist but I always get a bit wary when we are continually just given 1 side of a story.

Pilger framed it as the west overthrowing the legitimate government of Ukraine and replacing it with Nazis.

 

I'm sure Russia poisoned the one before that though, I lose track.

[Gnasher]

34 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Pilger framed it as the west overthrowing the legitimate government of Ukraine and replacing it with Nazis.

 

I'm sure Russia poisoned the one before that though, I lose track.

Remember a few years ago Trump got impeached (and somehow exonerated) for telling the then Ukrainian pm that if he didn't dish up some dirt on Joe Bidens dealings in the country he wouldn't sanction the 250 million dollar aid package promised by Obama? America has been poking around Ukraine for years, as has Nato and the EU..Its a country awash with guns, nazis, political fraud and right wing crackpots, no wonder the yanks feel a connection.

[s(k)aturation]

 

Cunts vs Cunts.

 

Like many a war.

[aws]

Ukraine has been crying "invasion is imminent" for nearly a year to get financial aid and weapons and to get Nordstream 2 stopped  but now the US and U.K. have joined the chorus they've started back-pedaling because the panic generated has tanked their economy. There'll be no invasion unless Ukraine's neo-Nazis can engineer an attack on the Russian-speaking regions of Ukraine.  

[Bjornebye]

Who shot that plane down a few years back? 

[Jairzinho]

2 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Who shot that plane down a few years back? 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

This is all a bit mad. 
 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/03/ukraine-russia-fake-attack-video-us-claims

[SasaS]

That is a normal day at the office there.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/30/russian-journalist-arkady-babchenko-who-was-reported-killed-is-still-alive

[Red Phoenix]

Ukraine have been actually trying to calm this down but the US (and the media) have been ramping things up for a while now. If there's any proof you need that they're causing most of this current shit it's that. Zelensky has literally been pointing out how stupid it's become.

[Red Phoenix]

Quote

While Russia has about 100,000 troops on Ukraine's borders, Mr Zelensky said he did not see a greater threat now than during a similar massing of troops last spring.

"There are signals even from respected leaders of states, they just say that tomorrow there will be war. This is panic - how much does it cost for our state?" he told the press conference in Kyiv.

The "destabilisation of the situation inside the country" was the biggest threat to Ukraine, he said.

This was a slightly surreal encounter. One after another, journalists asked Ukraine's president about the threat. But Volodymyr Zelensky batted away the questions, accusing the press itself of causing panic.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60174684

[Bjornebye]

21 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

Ukraine have been actually trying to calm this down but the US (and the media) have been ramping things up for a while now. If there's any proof you need that they're causing most of this current shit it's that. Zelensky has literally been pointing out how stupid it's become.

Is that a Biden dig? Are you falling for Russian propaganda? What explanation do you have for them amassing troops and war vehicles on the border? 

 

Boris is begging for a shell to be fired across the border right now. 

[Red Phoenix]

1 hour ago, Bjornebye said:

Is that a Biden dig? Are you falling for Russian propaganda? What explanation do you have for them amassing troops and war vehicles on the border? 

 

Boris is begging for a shell to be fired across the border right now. 

 

I think Biden is a massive clown but you can see what Zelensky is reported to have said in the post before yours where I pasted some of a BBC article. Maybe he's fallen for Russian propaganda too? I know they could attack at any time but why didn't we have all of this drama last year if a similar amount of troops were at the border like Zelensky says? Or maybe we did and I missed all of it.

 

If this passes without anything happening I suppose the Dems and media will be off to the South China Sea soon too and we can start that crap off all over again, it's been a while.

[M_B]

2 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

Ukraine have been actually trying to calm this down but the US (and the media) have been ramping things up for a while now. If there's any proof you need that they're causing most of this current shit it's that. Zelensky has literally been pointing out how stupid it's become.

The Russians moved a third of their army to the Ukrainian border. They didn't do it for a laugh.

[Red Phoenix]

1 hour ago, M_B said:

The Russians moved a third of their army to the Ukrainian border. They didn't do it for a laugh.

 

"Mr Zelensky said he did not see a greater threat now than during a similar massing of troops last spring." I don't think they'll have done it for a laugh then either. It's probably more serious this time with the demands they made from NATO but it doesn't mean that they're automatically going to attack.

 

If NATO and the US stop acting like idiots and actually accept that NATO now being right up at their border is completely fucking over the top things might settle down. I had to google the Minsk Protocol to check that I even got the right name for it so I don't really know anything about how it works, but I've seen that mentioned a couple of times in articles recently. Maybe they could go from there again and try to improve that or something.

[SasaS]

5 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

"Mr Zelensky said he did not see a greater threat now than during a similar massing of troops last spring." I don't think they'll have done it for a laugh then either. It's probably more serious this time with the demands they made from NATO but it doesn't mean that they're automatically going to attack.

 

If NATO and the US stop acting like idiots and actually accept that NATO now being right up at their border is completely fucking over the top things might settle down. I had to google the Minsk Protocol to check that I even got the right name for it so I don't really know anything about how it works, but I've seen that mentioned a couple of times in articles recently. Maybe they could go from there again and try to improve that or something.

The Minsk Protocol is about the reintegration of Donbas into Ukraine,I don't think it regulates NATO-Russian relations.

Ukraine probably feels it was pressured into too many concessions because it can create a de facto independent Donbas area, which they will probably never accept. The entire crises is apparently because Ukraine wanted to start a wider military  action, buoyed by shipments of some new weaponry and after reforming its military, which puts the US in a tough position of how to react if Russia invades as a response to Ukraine's attempt to regain its territory (similarly to what happened in Georgia in 2008).

Ukraine allegedly has some of the weapons successfully used by Azerbaijan recently against Nagorno Karabah (Turkish Bayaktar drone systems which have already proven very successful against Russian-supplied Syrian army some time ago in fighting for some key strategic town in Idlib in Syria) in greater quantities then reported so it no longer fears Russian armour all that much. The known unknown, as Rumsfled would say, is what do they have against Russian long.range missiles, air-strikes and electronic warfare, since nobody expects Russia would be conducting a widespread land invasion. They are apparently more likely just to destroy more sofisticated military installations and move the troups into Donbas, followed by a Krimea-like annexation.

[Red Phoenix]

36 minutes ago, SasaS said:

The Minsk Protocol is about the reintegration of Donbas into Ukraine,I don't think it regulates NATO-Russian relations.

Ukraine probably feels it was pressured into too many concessions because it can create a de facto independent Donbas area, which they will probably never accept. The entire crises is apparently because Ukraine wanted to start a wider military  action, buoyed by shipments of some new weaponry and after reforming its military, which puts the US in a tough position of how to react if Russia invades as a response to Ukraine's attempt to regain its territory (similarly to what happened in Georgia in 2008).

Ukraine allegedly has some of the weapons successfully used by Azerbaijan recently against Nagorno Karabah (Turkish Bayaktar drone systems which have already proven very successful against Russian-supplied Syrian army some time ago in fighting for some key strategic town in Idlib in Syria) in greater quantities then reported so it no longer fears Russian armour all that much. The known unknown, as Rumsfled would say, is what do they have against Russian long.range missiles, air-strikes and electronic warfare, since nobody expects Russia would be conducting a widespread land invasion. They are apparently more likely just to destroy more sofisticated military installations and move the troups into Donbas, followed by a Krimea-like annexation.

 

I'm not going to pretend I can understand all of what's going on there, I'll try and have a read up on what's been happening in the east of Ukraine though if I end up posting back on it. I really hope it doesn't come down to Russia entering Ukraine though and that something more peaceful can be worked out.

[M_B]

9 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

"Mr Zelensky said he did not see a greater threat now than during a similar massing of troops last spring." I don't think they'll have done it for a laugh then either. It's probably more serious this time with the demands they made from NATO but it doesn't mean that they're automatically going to attack.

 

If NATO and the US stop acting like idiots and actually accept that NATO now being right up at their border is completely fucking over the top things might settle down. I had to google the Minsk Protocol to check that I even got the right name for it so I don't really know anything about how it works, but I've seen that mentioned a couple of times in articles recently. Maybe they could go from there again and try to improve that or something.

The last time they did it they failed to move key support units so it was obvious it was a diplomatic bluff.

 

The support units are there this time, so either they are making more of an effort with the bluff or they mean business. 

[M_B]

9 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

If NATO and the US stop acting like idiots and actually accept that NATO now being right up at their border is completely fucking over the top things might settle down.

Isn't it up to Ukraine to determine it's foreign policy?