I am fucking done. FUCK VAR

[Barrington Womble]

Come on lads. It's all very evertonian bringing up bad decisions from years ago.

[johnsusername]

Just watching the rugby - the referee is miked up and clearly explains his decisions for everyone to hear. Also, he's fluent in English and French so he can explain his decision to both sets of players. 

 

Is it too much to ask for this kind of competency in the world's biggest and best sport?

 

[Barrington Womble]

2 minutes ago, johnsusername said:

Just watching the rugby - the referee is miked up and clearly explains his decisions for everyone to hear. Also, he's fluent in English and French so he can explain his decision to both sets of players. 

 

Is it too much to ask for this kind of competency in the world's biggest and best sport?

 

They don't want that type of scrutiny. 

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

10 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

Come on lads. It's all very evertonian bringing up bad decisions from years ago.

The Kompany one was not long back and the question was asked of the ref Baz.

[Barrington Womble]

2 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

The Kompany one was not long back and the question was asked of the ref Baz.

Lee mason is years ago though.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

5 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

Lee mason is years ago though.

Yeah it’s more about Manchester based officials. It still stands we have been royally shafted before and even more so now.

[Guest]

The biggest problem with VAR is that it was introduced to assist referrees in making the correct decisions to correct 'clear and obvious errors'. If it was being used as described I'm certain this would be seen as a very positive thing. The offside for their goal was a million miles away from being described as a 'clear and obvious error'. Even if technically a player is onside or offside, it surely should only be changed from the original decision if it's a 'clear and obvious error'.

 

VAR appears no longer being used for this purpose. It's appearing to be used to actually make decisions over the top of the referree and linesmen. A linesman should only raise the flag at the end of a play, even if it's blatantly obvious it's offside? That surely means VAR is making the decisions. If a linesman isn't certain, they should still make a decision and VAR could be used to rectify 'clear and obvious errors'. I've seen many examples where the player receiving the ball is clearly offside and also seen examples where the flag goes up when it's not obvious at all.

 

It's appears it's being misused rather than being used fraudulently and the longer it goes on, the deeper down the rabbit hole the system will go and there will be no turning back. With fans inside the grounds, that could lead to even bigger problems.

[Barrington Womble]

10 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Yeah it’s more about Manchester based officials. It still stands we have been royally shafted before and even more so now.

Everyone gets shafted at some point. We just remember when it's us. I do think this season appears to be really bad for us. But equally I do think we're not complaining enough - as someone pointed out with that mane foul yesterday, nobody is appealing it or at the ref. We seemed to go through a period after Kiev where we wised up. That seems to have gone now. 

 

I'd actually like some of these free loader journalists we have who spend all day earning a living sucking at the tit of the club to write some articles about it. But obviously that would actually require some work and effort and it's much easier to just parrot some shite about some 13 year old kid is going to save us millions in 10 years. 

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

11 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

Everyone gets shafted at some point. We just remember when it's us. I do think this season appears to be really bad for us. But equally I do think we're not complaining enough - as someone pointed out with that mane foul yesterday, nobody is appealing it or at the ref. We seemed to go through a period after Kiev where we wised up. That seems to have gone now. 

 

I'd actually like some of these free loader journalists we have who spend all day earning a living sucking at the tit of the club to write some articles about it. But obviously that would actually require some work and effort and it's much easier to just parrot some shite about some 13 year old kid is going to save us millions in 10 years. 

I said on another thread Baz that something should be done by the club, put it out there. I also believe our leading role in a breakaway league might not have helped as others have mentioned.

Oh and the ref who stopped Sadie going in on goal v Utd. From Wigan haha. Think I need a lie down.

[Halcyon Days]

4 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

I said on another thread Baz that something should be done by the club, put it out there. I also believe our leading roll in a breakaway league might not have helped as others have mentioned.

Oh and the ref who stopped Sadie going in on goal v Utd. From Wigan haha. Think I need a lie down.

Are we talking Moyes style video dossiers here?

[Barrington Womble]

4 minutes ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

If a linesman isn't certain, they should still make a decision 

If a linesman isn't certain, his flag should stay down, it's not even a decision. The problem though is what defines "clear and obvious"? Ifab claim the technology makes all the decisions var makes on offside to be clear and then as a consequence if it is clear, it is also obvious. The bottom line is do we want offside to be judged like this? I would argue most of us don't - the spirit of the law was to stop goalhanging. For the 100 years or whatever we've judged offside based on the simultaneous action of the players position as the ball was kicked. In nearly all cases it's impossible for the lino to see both. We've accepted offside as this very best efforts guide to prevent goalhanging. And what ifab have done is try to turn it into an exact science and introducing armpits and t-shirt sleeves to try and make the science work. There's a bunch of ways to do it differently, but for me until technology can provide the answer with the same accuracy as goaline technology (which may be impossible because offside is often subjective), then we should just allow offside to be awarded by the onfield officials and VAR shouldn't come into it. 

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

1 minute ago, Halcyon Days said:

Are we talking Moyes style video dossiers here?

Michael Owen style video brochure Bring it into the 20’s.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Barrington Womble said:

If a linesman isn't certain, his flag should stay down, it's not even a decision. The problem though is what defines "clear and obvious"? Ifab claim the technology makes all the decisions var makes on offside to be clear and then as a consequence if it is clear, it is also obvious. The bottom line is do we want offside to be judged like this? I would argue most of us don't - the spirit of the law was to stop goalhanging. For the 100 years or whatever we've judged offside based on the simultaneous action of the players position as the ball was kicked. In nearly all cases it's impossible for the lino to see both. We've accepted offside as this very best efforts guide to prevent goalhanging. And what ifab have done is try to turn it into an exact science and introducing armpits and t-shirt sleeves to try and make the science work. There's a bunch of ways to do it differently, but for me until technology can provide the answer with the same accuracy as goaline technology (which may be impossible because offside is often subjective), then we should just allow offside to be awarded by the onfield officials and VAR shouldn't come into it. 

Allowing play to continue is a decision, if a referree can't make the decision then there should be a conversation between the linesman and VAR. If it's clear and obvious offside and the linesman hasn't given it, VAR should get involved. Otherwise as you say it's a one hundred year old rule that shouldn't need to be decided on the size of a gnat's nostril.

[Halcyon Days]

12 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Michael Owen style video brochure Bring it into the 20’s.

Or maybe a Bielsa style PowerPoint presentation. Over Zoom of course.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

9 minutes ago, Halcyon Days said:

Or maybe a Bielsa style PowerPoint presentation. Over Zoom of course.

Of course. Get Steve Hunter to present it then no cunt will watch it.

[Halcyon Days]

1 minute ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Of course. Get Steve Hunter to present it then no cunt will watch it.

And get Dave Kirby to write a pre-presentation poem just in case.

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

If a linesman isn't certain, his flag should stay down, it's not even a decision. The problem though is what defines "clear and obvious"? Ifab claim the technology makes all the decisions var makes on offside to be clear and then as a consequence if it is clear, it is also obvious. The bottom line is do we want offside to be judged like this? I would argue most of us don't - the spirit of the law was to stop goalhanging. For the 100 years or whatever we've judged offside based on the simultaneous action of the players position as the ball was kicked. In nearly all cases it's impossible for the lino to see both. We've accepted offside as this very best efforts guide to prevent goalhanging. And what ifab have done is try to turn it into an exact science and introducing armpits and t-shirt sleeves to try and make the science work. There's a bunch of ways to do it differently, but for me until technology can provide the answer with the same accuracy as goaline technology (which may be impossible because offside is often subjective), then we should just allow offside to be awarded by the onfield officials and VAR shouldn't come into it. 

And regarding the definition of clear and obvious, that's what VAR was introduced for. If they don't know what is defined as clear and obvious, why did they introduce it in the first place? 

[Liverpool lad]

The biggest problem with VAR is the state of the freeze frames 

 

My dad put up cameras on his house to catch people who don't clean up dog shit, he caught some scruffy cunt with some high quality footage 

 

He paid 300 quid off ebay 

 

The best league in the world needs to get on ebay

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

6 minutes ago, Halcyon Days said:

And get Dave Kirby to write a pre-presentation poem just in case.

Things aren’t going are way these days and the powers that be are to blame,

I can only think of how it was in the 70’s walking the game,

Me arl fella told me of no offsides and pushing goalies into nets,

Of running the bookies before the game and putting on some bets.

 

Shankly, Dockers, Thatcher etc etc etc

 

 

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

6 minutes ago, Liverpool lad said:

The biggest problem with VAR is the state of the freeze frames 

 

My dad put up cameras on his house to catch people who don't clean up dog shit, he caught some scruffy cunt with some high quality footage 

 

He paid 300 quid off ebay 

 

The best league in the world needs to get on ebay

They would buy it, receive it say they never got it. Give us our money back.

[Barrington Womble]

17 minutes ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

And regarding the definition of clear and obvious, that's what VAR was introduced for. If they don't know what is defined as clear and obvious, why did they introduce it in the first place? 

Yeah, but they've said offside doesn't have the clear and obvious applied by the VAR himself, because the technology is capable of saying if it is offside and therefore it's makes it both clear and obvious. I'm not saying that's right, I'm just saying that's what they've applied. 

[Halcyon Days]

Just now, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Things aren’t going are way these days and the powers that be are to blame,

I can only think of how it was in the 70’s walking the game,

Me arl fella told me of no offsides and pushing goalies into nets,

Of running the bookies before the game and putting on some bets.

 

Shankly, Dockers, Thatcher etc etc etc

 

 

Haha quality We hate Tories, school of hard knocks in the Boys Pen the days when footy was played by real men.

 

Shankly’s best, big Ron’s vest we wear the badge with pride on our chest etc etc 

[VladimirIlyich]

11 hours ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

Yeah I agree but you've got to admit we always seem to be on the punishing end of it. A pen shout for us is barely looked at when it's potentially against us they bring in Columbo. 

Just watching Columbo now. Each episode is an hour and a half but he still solves it quicker than VAR.

[s(k)aturation]

5 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

The Bamford one finished me off. I was fuming with those 2 incidents yesterday in the opening 15. Both more easily a pen than the wellbeck thing you mention. 

Was actually referring to that pen against us at Brighton.

But that's the thing... there ar so many contentious ones, you have to be very specific when citing them.

 

[Red Shift]

10 hours ago, Jack the Sipper said:

No, the game was being ruined by bad decisions before VAR, VAR was supposed to lessen instances of bad decisions but has instead added another layer of bad decision making (which is even more inexplicable given refs now have the benefit of replays and hindsight), the rules surrounding VAR seem to have changed mid-game without any announcement, and all this while slowing the game down and making fans wary of celebrating goals because of VAR pulling play back two minutes later.

 

I'm not sure how you can say nothing has changed since its introduction.

What I meant was, it hasn’t solved the initial problem. Sorry