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Summer 2021 transfer thread.

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3 hours ago, Ronnie Whelan said:

I heard Bellingham is meant to be a really nice lad as well. Wonderful talent to boot.

 

I reckon Jurgen would be really keen on him. We seem to generally look out for lads who are sound and don't rock the boat. Sancho and Haaland seem a bit more individualistic, so not sure if Jurgen would be overly keen on them.

If we want to fantasise about Bellingham then why not just get Camavinga? Probably cost about the same and IMO even better.

 

I'd be a big fan of having 2 of the best U21 midfielders in the world on our books (Camavinga and Jones) to develop under Jurgen over the next few seasons.

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Different players arnt they? 

 

I could see us going for Giovani Reyna at some point. The owners would love a yank in the squad. Quite happy have him and Pulisic if Chelsea sell

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7 hours ago, John102 said:

Its crazy that Bellingham was smashing our u16's to bits just 2 years ago.

The defending in the bundesliga is about as naive as that level. 

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13 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

Some people confuse the ownership of the club with the team and your one of them. I'm glad you're happy with them, someone has to be. It's like fucking Stockholm syndrome. We all went mad when Hicks said we're just like Weetabix, yet that's what we are and there's loads of our fans lap it up. 


No I don’t. I support Liverpool FC, did before they came here and will after they’ve gone. 
 

Successful team = Happiness.

 

Unsuccessful team = Unhappiness.

 

If your wanting owners who love the club for what it is first, maybe we could get David Moore back? Or what’s Steve Morgan doing these days?

 

For better or worse, the world and the sport has changed. Deal with it.

 

This whole “Everything was better in my day” schtik is tiresome.

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It’s funny how people think we “allow” these players like Bellingham to go to other clubs as if they have no say in their own future.  A few intelligent players or their advisors have realised how beneficial it is at a younger age to go to a weaker league where they can start games and let the hype build.  Sancho is an absolute nap to come back to the prem at some point and be absolutely Shite.  In an alternate universe Minamino went to Leipzig for his release clause, banged a load of goals in and some genius on TLW is slagging the club for not paying his stupidly low release clause.

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32 minutes ago, The Guest said:

It’s funny how people think we “allow” these players like Bellingham to go to other clubs as if they have no say in their own future.  A few intelligent players or their advisors have realised how beneficial it is at a younger age to go to a weaker league where they can start games and let the hype build.  Sancho is an absolute nap to come back to the prem at some point and be absolutely Shite.  In an alternate universe Minamino went to Leipzig for his release clause, banged a load of goals in and some genius on TLW is slagging the club for not paying his stupidly low release clause.

This is spot on.

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On 02/04/2021 at 10:24, Scott_M said:


I don’t think Ardja deliberately misses the point, like me, I think he wants to understand what more people want?

A fucking decent centre back on January 1st would have been alright like

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15 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

Some people confuse the ownership of the club with the team and your one of them. I'm glad you're happy with them, someone has to be. It's like fucking Stockholm syndrome. We all went mad when Hicks said we're just like Weetabix, yet that's what we are and there's loads of our fans lap it up. 

 

Just trying to clarify what you meant by this. IIRC, when making that comment, Hicks' point was that Weetabix was purchased in a leveraged buyout, with the revenue generated by Weetabix being used to pay off the loan and interest taken out by Hicks and his partners to purchase the company. He said something like "If you are eating Weetabix, you're paying for our purchase of Weetabix".

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36 minutes ago, Daisy said:

A fucking decent centre back on January 1st would have been alright like

I agree that we should’ve got a centre half in January, but that’s a separate argument... there are a lot of things I reckon we could’ve done better, if it was up to me Bobby wouldn’t be leading the line for us, for example. That’s not what we’re discussing though. Slugtrail, Barry are arguing that we only limit ourselves to bargains using Taki and Shaqiri as evidence. I tried to counter that by saying that we paid £53m for Naby fucking Keita.

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10 minutes ago, aRdja said:

I agree that we should’ve got a centre half in January, but that’s a separate argument... there are a lot of things I reckon we could’ve done better, if it was up to me Bobby wouldn’t be leading the line for us, for example. That’s not what we’re discussing though. Slugtrail, Barry are arguing that we only limit ourselves to bargains using Taki and Shaqiri as evidence. I tried to counter that by saying that we paid £53m for Naby fucking Keita.

Keita had a release clause as well did he not? Prob not best argument to counter Barry's point 

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8 minutes ago, aRdja said:

I agree that we should’ve got a centre half in January, but that’s a separate argument... there are a lot of things I reckon we could’ve done better, if it was up to me Bobby wouldn’t be leading the line for us, for example. That’s not what we’re discussing though. Slugtrail, Barry are arguing that we only limit ourselves to bargains using Taki and Shaqiri as evidence. I tried to counter that by saying that we paid £53m for Naby fucking Keita.

It isn't though, both arguments are connected. The best thing for the on pitch side was to get a CB lined up and joining on the first of January. We limited ourselves to bargains by spending a couple of million at the end of January, if we sell Davies, another great moneyball signing that adds nothing to the on pitch side of the club. 

It shows exactly where their priorities lie.

 

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10 minutes ago, aRdja said:

I agree that we should’ve got a centre half in January, but that’s a separate argument... there are a lot of things I reckon we could’ve done better, if it was up to me Bobby wouldn’t be leading the line for us, for example. That’s not what we’re discussing though. Slugtrail, Barry are arguing that we only limit ourselves to bargains using Taki and Shaqiri as evidence. I tried to counter that by saying that we paid £53m for Naby fucking Keita.

Yeah but if it was up to you Bobby would never have led the line for us even when he was fucking amazing at it. We can all see how shit he's gone but he was a key part of us getting 97 points, winning the Champions League, then winning the Premier League the season after.

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3 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Keita had a release clause as well did he not? Prob not best argument to counter Barry's point 

Neymar had a release clause. Bargain.

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3 minutes ago, Scooby Dudek said:

It isn't though, both arguments are connected. The best thing for the on pitch side was to get a CB lined up and joining on the first of January. We limited ourselves to bargains by spending a couple of million at the end of January, if we sell Davies, another great moneyball signing that adds nothing to the on pitch side of the club. 

It shows exactly where their priorities lie.

 

We broke the transfer record for a goalkeeper and a defender, we spent close to £100m on Keita and Fabinho. £45m on a back-up forward in Jota, but apart from those I completely agree with you. 

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19 minutes ago, aRdja said:

We broke the transfer record for a goalkeeper and a defender, we spent close to £100m on Keita and Fabinho. £45m on a back-up forward in Jota, but apart from those I completely agree with you. 

We are all through the usual we only bought said GK and CB due to selling and I can point out numerous sales that would cover the other purchases.

 

We desperately needed at least one CB on 1st January irrespective of everything else. Not only did we not attempt to get a CB in, we were not intending to purchase on at all until the Matip injury, towards the end of the month. No matter which way you wish to view that,bit can not be argued that it was for the benefit of the on pitch performance of the club. Although some have.

 

We then brought 2 bargains in, which again could be argued did not prioritize on pitch performance. These appear to be low risk moneyball signings, with my point being that is the owners priority over on pitch performance.

 

When both sides align, great. When they don't, as a fan I want on pitch to be priority. As an owner, on pitch is second on that list, I understand that as an owner/business but I don't have to agree with it and will point out when I believe they are being disingenuous. 

 

 

Again just for clarification, saying when we have an emergency we should buy a player, does not mean I want us to be owned by an oil state.

 

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24 minutes ago, Scooby Dudek said:

We are all through the usual we only bought said GK and CB due to selling and I can point out numerous sales that would cover the other purchases.

 

We desperately needed at least one CB on 1st January irrespective of everything else. Not only did we not attempt to get a CB in, we were not intending to purchase on at all until the Matip injury, towards the end of the month. No matter which way you wish to view that,bit can not be argued that it was for the benefit of the on pitch performance of the club. Although some have.

 

We then brought 2 bargains in, which again could be argued did not prioritize on pitch performance. These appear to be low risk moneyball signings, with my point being that is the owners priority over on pitch performance.

 

Yep we should’ve got a centre half in, I’m completely in agreement with you there. I suppose my question to you is who do we need to sign for you to accept that we don’t only buy bargains? I’ve listed many examples of £40m+ players we brought in... is the magic number £100m, and the player must NOT have a release clause? 

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Athletic reporting that Liverpool are one of the clubs interested in £8m transfer of French midfielder Michael Olise at Reading. He won't sign a new deal in 2022. Bayern Munich, plus former youth clubs Man City and Chelsea interested too. 

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Doesn't every player on the continent have a release clause?

 

Looking at the big signings over the last few years it is only Hazard that moved without one. Maybe Ronaldo went for less than his clause but not sure, I know he cost a pile and there were a bunch of add ons.

 

Kepa, Joao Felix, Greizmann, M'Bappe, De Jong, De Ligt, Werner, Havertz those were all triggered by the clause.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, aRdja said:

I agree that we should’ve got a centre half in January, but that’s a separate argument... there are a lot of things I reckon we could’ve done better, if it was up to me Bobby wouldn’t be leading the line for us, for example. That’s not what we’re discussing though. Slugtrail, Barry are arguing that we only limit ourselves to bargains using Taki and Shaqiri as evidence. I tried to counter that by saying that we paid £53m for Naby fucking Keita.

I also said do you think we would have Signed Jota or Thiago if Wolves would have asked for 50%upfront or if Thiago wasn't in the last year of his contract. Naby had a release clause at 48m and we agreed to pay a small premium a year early to guarantee we got him. I'm not saying you can't get good players from that pool but I want us to not use that as the starting guide.

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55 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Keita had a release clause as well did he not? Prob not best argument to counter Barry's point 


Keita had a release clause of £48m. We agreed to trigger that a year early, with extras on top so he couldn’t be sold to anybody else. 
 

If RBL qualified for the CL, we’d have had to pay £58m. If they qualified for the EL, we’d have to pay £53m. If they finished outside of Europe, we’d pay the original £48m.


We ended up paying £53m.

 

We negotiated to pay the extra to ensure nobody else got him. 
 

So yes, Keita is a good example of us negotiating to ensure we got the player we wanted. What has happened after that is an immaterial to the conversation. 

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2 minutes ago, aRdja said:

Yep we should’ve got a centre half in, I’m completely in agreement with you there. I suppose my question to you is who do we need to sign for you to accept that we don’t only buy bargains? I’ve listed many examples of £40m+ players we bought in... is the magic number £100m, the player could NOT have release clause? 

No magic number. 

For me it is the string that broke the camels back. It is not one thing I can point at and say they are bad owners, it is whenever a decision has needed to be made, the priority has never been on pitch. 

 

The owners never take a risk. They buy "bargains" because they are low risk, if they add to the on pitch then all well and good, if they don't, it doesn't matter because they can be moved own without a great loss. Or moved on and money made to then spend somewhere else. 

 

I understand buying players and then selling at a profit should not be seen as a negative, but everything has a context. As others have pointed out, the issue is when these players can not be moved on, but add nothing on the pitch. However because they take a wage and a squad place, the low risk owners will not replace them until they are gone. So we have had the extreme this season, when the squad players have not suited the club but take a place and this then effects the on pitch performance negatively.

 

Davies appears to be a perfect example. Very cheap and will probably be sold for a profit in June. People will be called out for complaining about that. However, if he can't be sold because, ironically, because we want too much money for him, then he will potentially be fourth choice CB. This is fine if we have no injuries, but it will to the negative if we either have to play him or move a midfielder back because he is not good enough. We will point out this is what happens when you buy a "bargain" player and people will point out the unbelievable injury crisis. We are destined to play this game forever.

 

 A bit of a rambling post, this is because as I said it is not a single item but a build up, so it is not possible to just say, look at A, that proves you wrong.

 

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1 hour ago, Daisy said:

A fucking decent centre back on January 1st would have been alright like


Nobody has disputed that and it’s a separate matter to what’s being discussed.

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6 minutes ago, SlugTrail said:

I also said do you think we would have Signed Jota or Thiago if Wolves would have asked for 50%upfront or if Thiago wasn't in the last year of his contract. Naby had a release clause at 48m and we agreed to pay a small premium a year early to guarantee we got him. I'm not saying you can't get good players from that pool but I want us to not use that as the starting guide.

We paid just £2m less for Naby than City did for De Bruyne. He wasn’t close to being a bargain, with or without a release clause. 

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