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Atalanta (H) Champions League - 25/11/20 - 20:00


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7 minutes ago, sir roger said:

I reckon that a draw against Ajax would more or less get us through , even if we lost that game a win in Denmark takes us through.

Point is Sir Roger, I think Ajax is now going to be a very nervy game and before tonight, many were singing the praises of virtually being into the knock out round. Personally, I rate Ajax as a better team than Atalanta.

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Far too much analysis and whinging based on tonight's result. 

 

Klopp gambled. It didn't work. Did I like that he gambled? Not really. Do I understand why he gambled? Yes.

 

We are still in a great position to go through. Yes, it would have been lovely to qualify with 2 games to spare, but we rarely do so in the CL. Onwards to Brighton. That's the more important game.

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That stings....especially as we were so poor.

 

But it was always a possibility given team.

 

It is of course easy to point finger at Klopp, but his options are seriously limited at the moment and players have to be rested in this ridiculous schedule - i notice our 3 games this week starting with Leicester take place in pretty much the shortest possible timeframe (Sun Night through to Sat morning)

 

Shuffling the pack is understandable - the problem is he has nothing even like a full deck to shuffle.

 

Everyone (or most) would agree Robbo needed a breather - he has been flogged to death.

 

A lot of us would look at Matip and worry about his durability to play 3 games in a week.....Klopp made call to start him of course and he played in what was our 10th different centre half pairing this season....they were and they looked like strangers! How fit will Matip be Saturday now?

 

We'd look at front men and say someone needs a rest.....but then Origi is such a different type to any of the others...it nearly always looks unbalanced when he plays.

 

Wijnaldum has played an unbelievable amount of games over last week or so prior to tonight, he looked fucked because of it....flat and tired and lacking intensity.

 

Milner is 34....can he cope with back to back games and in different positions in a short few days....playing at RB on Sun up and down all day is hard then be asked to play against good opposition in middle.

 

The Williams kids shouldn't be anywhere near the level of playing in European Cup games yet, but we are forced to play them as options so short.

 

Robbo and Trent are absolutely integral to how we play...we are desperately blunt in terms of atracking width, creativity and pace from their positions when they aren't in side.

 

Midfield lacked control and ability to win ball and then dictate play once got it.....due to injuries though there were little to no other options...maybe Fabinho in there, but Klopp in back of mind must be thinking about him being needed at centre half or if Thiago and Hendo are not back weekend he'll be needed in middle and 3 games in a week just after injury might be too risky.

 

All in all this injury crisis was always gonna see us exposed at some point, we have done brilliant to manage as well as we have so far with it, but as soon as wanted to or needed to make changes with massively reduced options to do so we were really vulnerable and tonight that vulnerability was badly exposed.

 

Henderson

Thiago

Gomez

TAA

VVD

Oxlade

Shaqiri

 

All unavailable - imagine how different our rotation could look if they were available.

 

Hopefully we can get 2 or 3 of them back and keep them back for weeks and months ahead and then in Jan address the centre half issue...

 

Fabinho is boss in there but he also is pretty key to our midfield options and for me we need another centre half desperately so we aren't throwing Williams in at this level in knock out stages...or relying on Phillips in league/walking a Matip injury tightrope or struggling in midfield because Fab is needed at back.

 

Tonight stings and maybe Klopp could have done things differently, but for me he had to shuffle the deck, just damned shite luck that his deck is so depleted when doing so.

 

 

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Klopp slaughtering BT:

Easier to talk about a good game. We had moments but not real chances. It could happen to other teams. You ask us to go Saturday at 12:30, which is nearly a crime. That is nothing to do with the result, but congratulations to you.
"Thumbs up, no injuries and we go again."

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26 minutes ago, dockers_strike said:

Well, that was a poor performance. Love Jurgen and love the players. Im calling no one shit but let's get some facts straight.

 

This wasnt a game we could afford to lose especially as ajax were playing the danes so about as nailed on win for them as you can get. We play Ajax next with Atalanta playing the danes, another nailed on 3 points for them (Atalanta). Losing tonight doesnt seem as ok as it was before tonight's kick off if we lose to Ajax and Atalanta win, does it?

 

I said before the game go strong and take players off if we're 2 or 3  goals up. We have 5 subs in these games. But Jurgen decided to rest a lot of players as is his right and I wont criticise him for that.

 

What I did not like was that at half time, it was clear only one team was going to score and it wasnt us. It's pretty difficult not to be critical of anyone but Id exempt Alli, Tsimikas, Gini, Rhys Williams and Milner.

 

Sorry but Divock, Sadio, Mo, Neco and Curtis werent in the game all night. Might be a bit hard on young Curtis but I didnt think he did much of note. Ive never seen Sadio knocked off so many balls so easily. Mo also played Atalanta in when he came too deep and played a poor ball across field, just like he did in another game is I remember! Matip's passing was woeful. Neco was run ragged but didnt seem to learn even as the half wore on. Divock, cant you stay on yer feet lad? Fucking hell.

 

So yeah, Id have made changes at half time. Instead it got to 57 minutes before we saw signs of a change but as per, we take a fucking age to get the players ready to come on. Why do we spend so long showing the players these power point slides or whatever of where they should go on the pitch and where to run to?

 

Shouldnt they have been told all this before they actually get stripped to come on? I believe Buvac used to get a strop on with Achterberg for taking too long to get subs ready and on the pitch.

 

Even then, we missed an opportunity to make the changes or at least some of them when the ball went out of play. Instead the change was delayed due to showing the players these little power point slides by which time they'd scored. And like I said at half time, if they scored first, we were going to be in trouble.

 

2nd goal for them was well worked. Seen a few comments about the ref, didnt think he influenced the result one jot. He let a lot go for both teams. This result is one us and no one else. It was poor all round.

 

Disappointing.

Totally agree with you.

 

I think we are going to see many games like that , too many games, too many injuries.

 

It’ not that bad though, a draw vs Ajax and we are through.

 

But, with the current squad , I can’t see us being competitive on two competitions. 

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33 minutes ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

I think we now need 2 point from our next 2 games to qualify.  (If we finish on 11, that would put us level on points with the maximum that both Ajax and Atalanta can get.  If we're level on points with Atalanta, we qualify on head-to-head goal difference.)

 

I'm not pooping my pants yet.

Ajax and Atalanta need to play each other so both can't get maximum points.

 

So I think a draw vs Ajax guarantees we qualify. 

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44 minutes ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

I think we now need 2 point from our next 2 games to qualify.  (If we finish on 11, that would put us level on points with the maximum that both Ajax and Atalanta can get.  If we're level on points with Atalanta, we qualify on head-to-head goal difference.)

 

I'm not pooping my pants yet.

Pedantic I know but the 3 teams cannot all finish on 11. If we draw with Ajax then they can only get 11 if they beat Atalanta. Atalanta can then finish on 10 points maximum. 

We will qualify anyway and we will have a better squad to pick from in the next 2 weeks hopefully so less rotation.

3 games in 5 and a half days is fucking bananas and I'd say if Klopp had his time over he would still have rested players

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53 minutes ago, dockers_strike said:

Point is Sir Roger, I think Ajax is now going to be a very nervy game and before tonight, many were singing the praises of virtually being into the knock out round. Personally, I rate Ajax as a better team than Atalanta.

Doesn't matter so long as we beat the danes, as Ajax and Atalanta still have to play each other.

 

Beat the Danes and we're through. That was always the case, and that's why everyone is confident.

 

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5 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

A total nothing performance, like they didn’t play like they needed a win. 

 

Funny that.

 

Also, I kind of get the feeling this type of result nicely plays into Jurgen's current narrative of fixture pile-ups, 12.30 kick-offs etc...

 

Keeps everything nice and antsy.

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, m0e said:

Doesn't matter so long as we beat the danes, as Ajax and Atalanta still have to play each other.

 

Beat the Danes and we're through. That was always the case, and that's why everyone is confident.

 

Ah, so we've gone from getting qualification sorted after 3 games to now maybe leaving it to the last game?

 

Fingers crossed our injured players have all returned with no new injuries to others and we havent hit a bad patch of form then!

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38 minutes ago, Razoray said:

Pedantic I know but the 3 teams cannot all finish on 11. If we draw with Ajax then they can only get 11 if they beat Atalanta. Atalanta can then finish on 10 points maximum. 

We will qualify anyway and we will have a better squad to pick from in the next 2 weeks hopefully so less rotation.

3 games in 5 and a half days is fucking bananas and I'd say if Klopp had his time over he would still have rested players

Ajax and Atalanta can both finish on 11 if they both win their next game and draw against each other, cant they? We could finish on 9, 10 or 12.

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