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AngryofTuebrook

Liverpool Women’s FC

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It's a bit shit the way they've gone from back-to-back champions to relegation in just a few years. 

 

Quite a few suggestions that the owners just don't take the team seriously enough, which strikes me as commercially short-sighted.  

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53427855

 

There are suggestions that they might start to put this right, by allowing the women to use the new facilities in Kirkby, etc. I fucking hope so. I don't follow them, but I do want every Liverpool team to be successful. 

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The way we have managed and treated the womens side over the last few years has been really weird and neglectful - not sure why when they were doing so well and commercially, especially in the states, having a strong womens team is always a good thing. This has been written about a lot by lfc fans and others over last few months  - the guardian article is stark - the womens team only have 10 full time staff including coaching and playing staff. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/jun/05/liverpools-relegated-women-underfunded-and-in-disarray

 

https://theathletic.com/1763857/2020/04/24/liverpool-women-fc-wsl/

 

 

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I was involved in the female side of the club for a couple of years over a decade ago and my mate was first team manager who got them promoted to the WPL. It was always a fight to get any kind of funds for the women and the girl's centre of excellence. The first team women did already train at Kirkby back then but were playing at Prescot(I think?) at the time. 

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6 hours ago, SlugTrail said:

Have you got the financial figures to back that up? 

Oh I'm sorry, I don't have them to hand!

 

It's blindingly obvious, they threw money at the womens team for a few years after the creation of the wsl and it worked big time, two titles in a row. Since then they've had players tempted away quite easily by City, Chelsea, Arsenal, and even Man Utd when they started up again a couple of years ago. Because of that they've been slowly but surely dropping further and further down wsl1. If you followed the results last season it was obvious after a couple of games they'd struggle to stay up.

 

Not to mention that you've had managers walking out after a few weeks and describing the set up of the club as amateurish and stating that the owners don't seem to take the womens team seriously.

 

If they're not going to take it seriously that's fine, but they should stop the pretence!

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Just now, Creator Supreme said:

Oh I'm sorry, I don't have them to hand!

 

It's blindingly obvious, they threw money at the womens team for a few years after the creation of the wsl and it worked big time, two titles in a row. Since then they've had players tempted away quite easily by City, Chelsea, Arsenal, and even Man Utd when they started up again a couple of years ago. Because of that they've been slowly but surely dropping further and further down wsl1. If you followed the results last season it was obvious after a couple of games they'd struggle to stay up.

 

Not to mention that you've had managers walking out after a few weeks and describing the set up of the club as amateurish and stating that the owners don't seem to take the womens team seriously.

 

If they're not going to take it seriously that's fine, but they should stop the pretence!

Your second paragraph describes exactly,from personal experience,the LFC women's set up has been run. All except a few years when you rightly say they threw some money in.

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If all the teams that “should” our time and effort and money into the women’s game did so, you’d end up with the same club names at the top of the women’s divisions as you do in the men’s. Other than money being pumped in, why’s that good?

 

 

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52 minutes ago, Bob Spunkmouse said:

If all the teams that “should” our time and effort and money into the women’s game did so, you’d end up with the same club names at the top of the women’s divisions as you do in the men’s. Other than money being pumped in, why’s that good?

 

 

Because women's football is the pinnacle of girl's football. If there is nothing more than 'Park' football for girls to aspire to then girls are simply not going to play for more than a few years at best. Nobody is saying to give them millions like the men but how can you claim to be about 'the community' and 'inclusive' if you alienate a large amount of said community?

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In those 2 years when the team won the league back to back, one of the telling things was that we were the only side that were full time. All the other teams were semi-pro, and that's what attracted some decent womens players to the club. Once the ikes of Arsenal, Chelsea and City went full time aswell, our competitive advantage was eroded. Not only that, but unlike us they were attracting some top players from around the world. They eventually started taking our best players too. We didn't react, instead just letting things slide to the point where even the players and coaching staff got the impression the club didn't care. When the plans were drawn up to sell Melwood and expand the academy site to include the men's first team facilities, there was nothing about including the women's teams.

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3 hours ago, Trumo said:

In those 2 years when the team won the league back to back, one of the telling things was that we were the only side that were full time. All the other teams were semi-pro, and that's what attracted some decent womens players to the club. Once the ikes of Arsenal, Chelsea and City went full time aswell, our competitive advantage was eroded. Not only that, but unlike us they were attracting some top players from around the world. They eventually started taking our best players too. We didn't react, instead just letting things slide to the point where even the players and coaching staff got the impression the club didn't care. When the plans were drawn up to sell Melwood and expand the academy site to include the men's first team facilities, there was nothing about including the women's teams.

Most criticism of the women's game,and they have a point,is the lack of quality coaching. The problem is that if you are a half decent coach and you cannot paid say even travel expenses for women's football then you will be forced to move somewhere where you do,eg men's football or just continue in a regular job. This is why lots of coaches within the women's game are enthusiastic parents or volunteers. 

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3 hours ago, VladimirIlyich said:

Because women's football is the pinnacle of girl's football. If there is nothing more than 'Park' football for girls to aspire to then girls are simply not going to play for more than a few years at best. Nobody is saying to give them millions like the men but how can you claim to be about 'the community' and 'inclusive' if you alienate a large amount of said community?

I don’t disagree with the general point, but if the teams at the pinnacle are Sunderland, Villa, Lyon and Benfica for example, and there are a good number of well run teams making the standard better than it was yesterday, what’s wrong with that?

 

if Liverpool don’t want to invest in their womens team, they are fair to criticise but the fact their men’s team is successful is neither here nor there in that criticism for me.

 

 If all that happens in women’s football is it becomes a money spinning PR routine where the biggest and most financially strong men’s teams also have the biggest and most highly funded women’s teams, and it’s Barca, Real, Bayern, Liverpool, Man U & City at the top table, but seriously lower standard than their men’s teams wouldn’t that be a sad place to end up?

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4 hours ago, Bob Spunkmouse said:

I don’t disagree with the general point, but if the teams at the pinnacle are Sunderland, Villa, Lyon and Benfica for example, and there are a good number of well run teams making the standard better than it was yesterday, what’s wrong with that?

 

if Liverpool don’t want to invest in their womens team, they are fair to criticise but the fact their men’s team is successful is neither here nor there in that criticism for me.

 

 If all that happens in women’s football is it becomes a money spinning PR routine where the biggest and most financially strong men’s teams also have the biggest and most highly funded women’s teams, and it’s Barca, Real, Bayern, Liverpool, Man U & City at the top table, but seriously lower standard than their men’s teams wouldn’t that be a sad place to end up?

Why bother at all then? Why does it matter who the top teams are? It would be nice for a different selection of teams to be involved in women's football compared to mens in my opinion. If you are going to associate something with your 'brand' it would be better to keep that part of the business at least as well run as parts of the overall business I would have thought.

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There’s no money in it clearly.  If UEFA and the premier league can’t control City and Chelsea spending infinite money in the men’s game and the media want to continue to pretend that it’s a not a problem at all then Liverpool are going to have to put every ounce of their concentration, time and money into that.

 

There’s been a few articles and politicians sticking their oar in on this demanding we “invest” in the women’s team which in other words means run at a loss or an even bigger loss than they’re being run at now.  Completely ignoring the fact there’s not much expenditure in the men’s team either.  If City and Chelsea are going to just buy the league  in the women’s game as well then what is the point in even bothering at all.

 

The reality is that the women’s teams are nothing to do with men’s.  The fans couldn’t care less despite some people pretending that they do when something significant happens like a league win or relegation.  The only thing that’s related is the name.  If the women’s team lose a game nobody gives a shit.  It’s the same for every team.  You can’t just make people be bothered about something whether you stick their club name on it or not.

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It can't be that expensive to run a women's side surely? What kind of transfer fees and wages does it command these days? You could probably build a side for a year on a month's of Lovren's wages. 

 

If that's the case, then it can't simply be a case of investment, the Messi of women's football for instantce, who is she and how much would she cost? 

 

Maybe it's more about the individual personalities involved behind the scenes, coaches/managers and the relationship they have with the business sides of the clubs. 

 

In fairness, most aspects of this club were a clusterfuck for a long time, including the youth setup and even the reserves when they were a thing.

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17 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

It can't be that expensive to run a women's side surely? What kind of transfer fees and wages does it command these days? You could probably build a side for a year on a month's of Lovren's wages. 

 

If that's the case, then it can't simply be a case of investment, the Messi of women's football for instantce, who is she and how much would she cost? 

 

Maybe it's more about the individual personalities involved behind the scenes, coaches/managers and the relationship they have with the business sides of the clubs. 

 

In fairness, most aspects of this club were a clusterfuck for a long time, including the youth setup and even the reserves when they were a thing.

It isnt very expensive at all,and thats the point. If the club dont want to do it then they shouldnt but they seem to just want to use it as a vanity project without doing anything with it. The truth is,most likely,that they simply want to do it to tick a box with the ruling bodies and their 'inclusivity' stuff.

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I'm ignorant to the challenges that Women's football is facing to be honest. I can only speak about my approach to it and also understanding the expectation that people have. 

 

I only consume the 1st team, and maybe a little bit of the youth side of football. I don't watch anyone other than Liverpool unless there is a big game, and I have never really sat down to watch the women's game. Mainly because I care for it very little, in the same way I care for Cricket very little. I am not trying to be-little it, but the women's game really isn't on my radar and I don't think it will ever be.

 

What is important however as a women's side is that we are well represented, well run and competitive, the challenge you've got is that the fact the side was relegated means very little to me. I'm just not bothered though even if the above is or isn't the case. I can't replicate he intensity I have for the 1st team for the women's side. 

 

There has been some success with a women's football club down south which isn't affiliated with the mens side, and is competing at the highest level in women's football. That is not to say there shouldn't be mainstream support from the mens Football League, but I do wonder if to build the affinity for the women's game, actually trying to establish that out of existing mens sides is probably not the way to do it.

 

I don't quite know where I am going with this but in short

 

1. I don't watch women's football

2. I didn't really care that they got relegated

3. I think if we have a women's football side it should be well run, supported and competitive, but if it isn't and the men's side is successful then its a non issue for me

4. Perhaps the City of Liverpool should establish a Womens Football Side with investments from Liverpool and Everton and grow the game that way - if indeed the ultimate ambition is to have women's football in the spotlight

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On the basis that dropping it is unacceptable politically, I am happy that we spend as little on it as we can get away with. 

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I don't see how they're not turning a profit on it. A bit of investment to get the team winning again should be enough to draw sponsors who can't afford the rates demanded by the men's team, but who are willing to pay to be associated with the Liverpool name.

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