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Keir Starmer


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Just now, Jairzinho said:

Yeah, I get that. But it isn't like the man invented a political ideology. 

 

What if you largely supported the policies but didn't think he was a very good leader?

 

What if you didn't even support the policies but wholeheartedly supported him when he was leader? 

 

Exactly the same views, but never wanted him as leader?

 

Etc, etc. 

 

Or is it just a catch all term of insult for anyone that has reservations about the direction of the party now?

 

Like centrist or Blairite are the other way.

 

I’ve no intention of insulting anybody I honestly don’t care enough these days but I think the terms are reasonable rules of thumb, if you disagree that’s cool.

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18 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

Yeah, that doesn't mean anything. 


It does, it means that there are two versions of Corbyn. 
 

The ones his supporters cling to which never actually existed as they co-opted various things they’d like to see in a person, community, country based on their own predilections, and things he actually wanted to achieve, which again were never concrete. Both combined leave only cognitive dissonance.

 

Corbyn was an amazing idea which sparked people in to action, but if you chip away at what he actually wanted most would find a vast chasm of problematic, to their own, political compass leaning.

 

The reason for the idea? 
 

Everybody wanted change and they projected the hopes that their change would be the one that Corbyn in actuality enacted.

 

Narrater: It was not. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Section_31 said:

 

I'm not into politics or personalities enough to devote myself to a particular leader (captain Kirk and Ken Barlow would be the only notable exceptions)

 

I'm not even particularly into labour, I just see them as the only alternative to the s

tories. I'm a pragmatist and feel you have to play the historical and societal cards you're dealt if you're trying to get into government.

 

As far as Corbyn was concerned my opinion went back and forth depending on how I felt he was doing. I buzzed off the fact he won as he was a disruptor and I was tired of the same old suits, then I started to suspect he was a bad leader creating a lot of bad blood, then I felt like he started to grow into the role and looked good against May in the 2017 election, then the old flaws re-emerged and I was genuinely freaked out that him and people around him seemed determined to hold on regardless of the clear fact he had no chance of winning, as someone who felt ordinary folk would suffer as a result of that, my personal opinion of him for allowing that to happen plummeted.

Negged for the outrageous Roger Moore omission 

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26 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

 

I'm not into politics or personalities enough to devote myself to a particular leader (captain Kirk and Ken Barlow would be the only notable exceptions)

 

I'm not even particularly into labour, I just see them as the only alternative to the s

tories. I'm a pragmatist and feel you have to play the historical and societal cards you're dealt if you're trying to get into government.

 

As far as Corbyn was concerned my opinion went back and forth depending on how I felt he was doing. I buzzed off the fact he won as he was a disruptor and I was tired of the same old suits, then I started to suspect he was a bad leader creating a lot of bad blood, then I felt like he started to grow into the role and looked good against May in the 2017 election, then the old flaws re-emerged and I was genuinely freaked out that him and people around him seemed determined to hold on regardless of the clear fact he had no chance of winning, as someone who felt ordinary folk would suffer as a result of that, my personal opinion of him for allowing that to happen plummeted.

I just can’t believe people who are clearly intelligent hold this sort of nonsense view.  It’s like they suddenly become completely braindead over and over again whenever the topic of discussion on him raises its head.  You’ve got numero talking that shit about him not being a leader as if that’s an even relevant point and things like this about holding on to power.  Ironic shouts about wanting the tories in perpetuity. We’ve fucking had Tory policy and behaviour in govt since forever because people like you can’t see the wood for the trees.

 

Labour is infested with economically right wing people who don’t want to be accountable.  I’m sure you know this already because I’m sure I’ve seen you post about it.  They’ve spent decades filling up the party with candidates that think the same way or at least are happy to take the pay cheque and follow orders.  It’s just a production line of suits out of oxbridge or any sellout they can find that grew up on a council estate who’s managed to find themselves working their way through a union which is run by the same fucking suits.  There are very few economically left wing politicians left in labour and therefore parliament despite the fact the country is left leaning economically.  The few left either are hanging on from before this tactic was implemented or have snuck through the door recently.

 

They’ve filled the MPs up with this type because they know that’s where the power lies.  This idea he was a shit leader is comical.  These people would prefer to see a Boris Johnson or Theresa May led Tory government in power than a Corbyn led one.  You can’t lead people like that. No matter how he would have approached it.  The funniest ones I hear were he should have had an alistair Campbell figure controlling the media and the MPs.  He had no power to do anything like that.

 

The only reason he got to be leader was because these suits got complacent.  They were that arrogant that they couldn’t be ousted and things couldn’t be changed that they allowed him on the ballot.  After a couple of election defeats to a right wing party when it was right wing policy that labour had implemented that people were sick of, the Labour Party were clueless.  Where do they go?  You can’t go more right wing.  They tried that by abstaining to hard right Tory policy and it failed.

 

They decided to allow a lefty on the ballot because they thought it would energise the local party’s as the party was clearly dying not thinking for a second he would win.  After he did win they basically then spent the next 4 years shitting themselves and trying to do anything and everything they could to oust him.  Leadership challenges, keeping him off the ballot, adding rogue new positions to the NEC to get a majority, fake antismeitism claims and hysteria, “electability”, undermining party processes and telling him it was fine.

 

Nothing else mattered.  Not the tories winning and not a hard brexit.  They caused it all because they wouldn’t compromise.  The left wing economic manifesto was very close to winning an election and would have done had these cunts not behaved that way.  He was fucked in the next election by the liberal whining over the brexit position from everyone in and out of the party.  The day the party backed a second referendum was the day they lost the election and every fucking liberal cunt knew it and they also knew what that meant.  They didn’t care though because all that mattered was getting the economic right back in charge of labour and Corbyn out.  He never stood a chance in 2019.

 

It will take lot of people a long time to realise but it has set the country back decades if not longer.  By the time they get complacent again the likelihood that there will be an incorruptible left wing person like Corbyn in the party to actual become the leader is basically zero.  Every time the Labour Party shifts right the Tory’s get further right.  The idea that any labour govt is better than a Tory one is so short sighted and it’s what’s led to the country being in the position it’s in.

 

He clung on because he knows that’s the reality and he knows lots of people in the Labour Party who support him know that.  It’s completely depressing and people are living in a fantasy land if they think Starmer can win and if he by some miracle does that anything significant would change.  As long as the tories are seen as the “anti-immigration party” they will take too many votes from the left.  The party constantly talk about engaging with its heartlands and winning back the working class etc.  It’s not happening because largely those voters want tighter immigration controls and left wing economic policy and these cunts are built on the opposite.

 

TL;DR

 

Wake up it’s the right wing cunts in labour that are the problem not the people trying to turn this country into an actual democracy.

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9 minutes ago, The Guest said:

I just can’t believe people who are clearly intelligent hold this sort of nonsense view.  It’s like they suddenly become completely braindead over and over again whenever the topic of discussion on him raises its head.  You’ve got numero talking that shit about him not being a leader as if that’s an even relevant point and things like this about holding on to power.  Ironic shouts about wanting the tories in perpetuity. We’ve fucking had Tory policy and behaviour in govt since forever because people like you can’t see the wood for the trees.

 

Labour is infested with economically right wing people who don’t want to be accountable.  I’m sure you know this already because I’m sure I’ve seen you post about it.  They’ve spent decades filling up the party with candidates that think the same way or at least are happy to take the pay cheque and follow orders.  It’s just a production line of suits out of oxbridge or any sellout they can find that grew up on a council estate who’s managed to find themselves working their way through a union which is run by the same fucking suits.  There are very few economically left wing politicians left in labour and therefore parliament despite the fact the country is left leaning economically.  The few left either are hanging on from before this tactic was implemented or have snuck through the door recently.

 

They’ve filled the MPs up with this type because they know that’s where the power lies.  This idea he was a shit leader is comical.  These people would prefer to see a Boris Johnson or Theresa May led Tory government in power than a Corbyn led one.  You can’t lead people like that. No matter how he would have approached it.  The funniest ones I hear were he should have had an alistair Campbell figure controlling the media and the MPs.  He had no power to do anything like that.

 

The only reason he got to be leader was because these suits got complacent.  They were that arrogant that they couldn’t be ousted and things couldn’t be changed that they allowed him on the ballot.  After a couple of election defeats to a right wing party when it was right wing policy that labour had implemented that people were sick of, the Labour Party were clueless.  Where do they go?  You can’t go more right wing.  They tried that by abstaining to hard right Tory policy and it failed.

 

They decided to allow a lefty on the ballot because they thought it would energise the local party’s as the party was clearly dying not thinking for a second he would win.  After he did win they basically then spent the next 4 years shitting themselves and trying to do anything and everything they could to oust him.  Leadership challenges, keeping him off the ballot, adding rogue new positions to the NEC to get a majority, fake antismeitism claims and hysteria, “electability”, undermining party processes and telling him it was fine.

 

Nothing else mattered.  Not the tories winning and not a hard brexit.  They caused it all because they wouldn’t compromise.  The left wing economic manifesto was very close to winning an election and would have done had these cunts not behaved that way.  He was fucked in the next election by the liberal whining over the brexit position from everyone in and out of the party.  The day the party backed a second referendum was the day they lost the election and every fucking liberal cunt knew it and they also knew what that meant.  They didn’t care though because all that mattered was getting the economic right back in charge of labour and Corbyn out.  He never stood a chance in 2019.

 

It will take lot of people a long time to realise but it has set the country back decades if not longer.  By the time they get complacent again the likelihood that there will be an incorruptible left wing person like Corbyn in the party to actual become the leader is basically zero.  Every time the Labour Party shifts right the Tory’s get further right.  The idea that any labour govt is better than a Tory one is so short sighted and it’s what’s led to the country being in the position it’s in.

 

He clung on because he knows that’s the reality and he knows lots of people in the Labour Party who support him know that.  It’s completely depressing and people are living in a fantasy land if they think Starmer can win and if he by some miracle does that anything significant would change.  As long as the tories are seen as the “anti-immigration party” they will take too many votes from the left.  The party constantly talk about engaging with its heartlands and winning back the working class etc.  It’s not happening because largely those voters want tighter immigration controls and left wing economic policy and these cunts are built on the opposite.

 

TL;DR

 

Wake up it’s the right wing cunts in labour that are the problem not the people trying to turn this country into an actual democracy.


It’s all well and good, but you just called labour members right wing so all you typed was pointless as by their very definition they are left wing and would not be signed up members unless they believed, in at least, the bare fucking minimum lett/socialist/workers/progressive policy, unless you genuinely believe that they are interlopers, which is bordering on conspiracy territory.
 

Surely they’d be better singing up as Tories and manipulating the populous as they’re so effective? 
 

If you don’t support Labour you support the Tories, there I just did a stupid fucking argument as well.

Strength in unity an’ all that.

 

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5 hours ago, Numero said:

I do think they have same position, yeah. Both Labour party leaders. That’s not to say they’re in the same position or the climate is the same or any of that, but it’s the same position. We could continue the discussion with you letting me know what you mean by they’re not the same position. I explained what I meant by it. 
 

It might not be worth your time, or mine; he’s gone and it’s really just raking over coals that are still warm but not that relevant outside of Corbynites that are pissed off. 

I'm not entitled to speak for him but if you see Starmer being interviewed by laura Kuenssberg and compere it to the way Kuenssberg conducted her interviews with Corbyn it might give just a small glimpse of what I think hes getting at, and if my guess is correct hes 100 % right they are not in any shape or form starting from the same position. 

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Laura

 

 

' do you still like the IRA Jeremy'? 

 

Would you bow for the queen Jeremy? Would you?

 

Would you shoot dead a terrorist Jeremy? Shoot the vunt in the fucking head Jeremy? Would you?

 

 

 

Now meanwhile 

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Numero said:

So we still don’t understand. Do I need a bigger font or something? 

Sorry it's not my remit to answer, i was having a guess. My guess is Corbyn had a far more hostile press and a far more hostile parliamentary labour party to deal with, and hed be 100% right.

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2 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Laura

 

 

' do you still like the IRA Jeremy'? 

 

Would you bow for the queen Jeremy? Would you?

 

Would you shoot dead a terrorist Jeremy? Shoot the vunt in the fucking head Jeremy? Would you?

 

 

 

Now meanwhile 

 

 

 

 


You don’t understand twitter, do you? 
 

That’s a, very easily identifiable, fake account.

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23 minutes ago, Bruce Spanner said:


It’s all well and good, but you just called labour members right wing so all you typed was pointless as by their very definition they are left wing and would not be signed up members unless they believed, in at least, the bare fucking minimum lett/socialist/workers/progressive policy, unless you genuinely believe that they are interlopers, which is bordering on conspiracy territory.
 

Surely they’d be better singing up as Tories and manipulating the populous as they’re so effective? 
 

If you don’t support Labour you support the Tories, there I just did a stupid fucking argument as well.

Strength in unity an’ all that.

 

This unfortunately is what the country is up against.

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8 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Eh???  I know.  The real one is fucking worse.


It’s bad, but it isn’t that bad, as much as we castigate the BBC they still had Brooker’s screen wipe, Nish’s ‘Mash Report’, the recent Windrush scandal film And various other ‘Mock the week’ type shite, which all actively show the government in a terrible light. This is not including newsnight and the fact they show parliament all fucking day. It’s the public that are not engaged, not the BBC giving the opportunity to engage. 
 

Kuensburg Is a dickhead, but that’s not the BBC’s entire political output.

 

It’s like a fucking Alex Jones convention in here sometimes.

 

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20 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Sorry it's not my remit to answer, i was having a guess. My guess is Corbyn had a far more hostile press and a far more hostile parliamentary labour party to deal with, and hed be 100% right.

I really don’t know what that has to do with me, though. I bolded and italicised then difference yet people still want to point out they’re not in the same position. If people don’t think they’re both Labour Leader that’s fine, but I’m not saying their circumstances are the same. 
 

Anyway, I’m done talking about Corbyn. He’s no longer leader. Hopefully Starmer can regain some of the support lost under the last few leaders. 

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13 minutes ago, Bruce Spanner said:


It’s bad, but it isn’t that bad, as much as we castigate the BBC they still had Brooker’s screen wipe, Nish’s ‘Mash Report’, the recent Windrush scandal film And various other ‘Mock the week’ type shite, which all actively show the government in a terrible light. This is not including newsnight and the fact they show parliament all fucking day. It’s the public that are not engaged, not the BBC giving the opportunity to engage. 
 

Kuensburg Is a dickhead, but that’s not the BBC’s entire political output.

 

It’s like a fucking Alex Jones convention in here sometimes.

 

It's not an Alex Jones conspiracy to say the bbc news and current affairs output was biased against Jeremy Corbyn, it's a cold hard fact. 

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20 minutes ago, The Guest said:

Educate yourself you fucking buffoon.


Cool, I’m a life long labour member, my grandmother actually signed me up before I was old enough by lying about my age, who has been doorstepping since he was old enough to to stand on doorsteps.
 

Now, he stands on his own feet, he actively works with three different labour MP’s, won’t be a gossip and tell you which, as an engagement bridge with disaffected youth in the most impoverished regions of the UK and actually gets paid to put these ideas in to practice, though I’d do it for free.

 

Has been to every ward meeting, branch meeting, leaders talks, meeting sbout fucking jurisprudence in parliament, conference he could.

 

Has stood with various socialist organisations in both a solidarity stance and as a leader, of sorts, and provided communications, essays, and all other essential ways of getting ideas out to the electorate.

 

Is, and always will be, a fucking socialist.

 

Now, fuck off you small time, chip on your shoulder prick.

 

You’re either with ‘us’ or against yourself.

 

PS I have eighteen academic letters, again, fuck off! 

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3 minutes ago, Numero said:

Why can’t they just let it die down FFS. 

Because the Lsbour leader made a glaring error in sacking someone for nothing and now the witchhunt begins in earnest. For the next 4 years the press will push Stsrmer for sackings for every minute reason and refer to the long Bailey sacking as a yardstick  In trying to look decisive hes made himself a hostage to fortune. 

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6 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Because the Lsbour leader made a glaring error in sacking someone for nothing and now the witchhunt begins in earnest. For the next 4 years the press will push Stsrmer for sackings for every minute reason and refer to the long Bailey sacking as a yardstick  In trying to look decisive hes made himself a hostage to fortune. 

Glaring error? It seems like sound judgment for sacking somebody not willing to apologise for or retract her mistake. 

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