Keir Starmer

[Gnasher]

1 hour ago, Mudface said:

If and when the 'left' get back in, they need to be as bold and arrogant as the Tories and Trump have been. Fuck the timidity that Blair showed, get PR in place and a proper constitution, make it impossible for chancers and spivs like Johnson to even get elected, never mind engage in the fuckery they have been.

First things first, close down the sun newspaper. Then blitz the rest of the print media. All newspapers should be packaged in brown paper bags like cigarettes. Insist on front page public apologies for libel and false reporting. Massive fines for journalists who knowingly deceive their readership. Overseas nationals who do not pay tax in this country should be banned from owning a British newspaper.

 

The Beano meanwhile should be free and compulsory to every household.

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 hour ago, Brownie said:

Watched the interview above, thought he came across very well. As with everything, the judgement will be in the detail when the time comes.

Yeah, totally agree. If he comes out with a manifesto with tax cuts for the rich, increases in private ownership in the NHS, etc... of course he will need lynching. Obviously he's not actually going to do those things because he's not mental. I mean, what could he do that's remotely likely that would piss people off? There's no way he's coming out with tax cuts for the rich, or increase in private involvement, or bullshit immigration laws, or any of that stuff. I honestly don't know what people would worry about with him. Really, I don't get where a lot of it is coming from.

 

It really does seem to stem from his reaction to two incidents 1) RLB not doing as she was told and getting fired 2) Corbyn getting suspended. Of course, people are absolutely free to disagree with those actions, I don't personally (just as I wouldn't if Corbyn had been harder on the bullshit within the party at the time) but I can see how some think it's not justified. What he hasn't done, in my view, is earn any of this 'pseudo Tory' type stuff that's thrown around. Like, really; there's nothing to suggest he's not a social democrat who wants to actually win an election. Then there's his 'Sir' title, but it's not like he is some blue-blooded aristocrat. I think people have added 2 and 2 together and come up with 4927397.23. 

 

For me, he's just your soft left politician when it comes to political views. Mostly that actually means he's got left-wing views but is more pragmatic and willing to be more flexible on a lot of issues if he can get the party in power. It's the same with Ed Miliband and Barry Gardiner and others. I think he's a lot closer to being hard left than people think. Fortunately, he also seems intelligent and pragmatic and knows that you can't win on a purely hard-left agenda. Corbyn knew that too, which is why he didn't run on a hard left agenda or anything like it. I think we will end up left of Blair, right of Corbyn. Pretty much where Brown was. 

 

Brown and Blair actually agreed on a fuck load of things, and if those two can unify and win, everyone else should be able to because I think Starmer is far more of a Brownite than a third-way Blairite. Pledging free tuition is an indicator of that. Bringing back common ownership Rail, Mail, Energy and Water is a sign of that. He clearly isn't 'anti business' which some of the old labour politicians are. Anybody antibusiness these days is unelectable, and they're actually daft and don't understand the role that a good business plays. The trick isn't to fuck business over, it's to force them to help society as well as themselves. We don't live in 1920s anymore, we live in a globalised world where capitalism is the chosen economic system. Capitalism done wrong is a fucking sin, in my view. But anybody looking to destroy it rather than make it work for them, like many European countries have, is off their fucking rocker because they're not going to win a fucking thing. 

[sir roger]

I know you like him NN , but hard left, really ? 

[Numero Veinticinco]

12 minutes ago, sir roger said:

I know you like him NN , but hard left, really ? 

Depends what you mean by 'really'. If you mean 'did I really call him hard left', then the answer is 'no'. I didn't call him hard left, I said I think he's closer to being hard left than people think. I said he's soft left. I say this because of his pledges, his articles about socialism, his leadership of young socialists, the words from those who know him and say he's far left or was, and my knowledge of what these terms actually mean. 

 

 

[Scott_M]

I was watching Frankie Boyle the other week and he described Keir Starmer as looking like “a Prime Minister in a Spice Girls Movie” and now I can’t see anything else.

[Numero Veinticinco]

Dunno if anybody actually gives a fuck in finding out a bit more about him, but I have to thank moof, who if he's reading this will be calling me a cunt under his breath, because he once asked something like 'how much do you actually know about him'. I knew a fair bit, but I went out of my way - out of interest - to make sure I knew. This is one of the thing I've seen that made me quite like him. If anybody wants to check it out, it's only 30 minutes...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/audio/2020/mar/30/labour-leadership-interviews-sir-keir-starmer

[lifetime fan]

13 hours ago, Mudface said:

If and when the 'left' get back in, they need to be as bold and arrogant as the Tories and Trump have been. Fuck the timidity that Blair showed, get PR in place and a proper constitution, make it impossible for chancers and spivs like Johnson to even get elected, never mind engage in the fuckery they have been.

The biggest fuck up Blair ever made (Iraq obviously aside) was not agreeing with Ashdown and going for PR. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

I couldn’t sleep last night and watched a couple of interviews. One with Starmer with Waugh from Huffpost which I thought was great, it was from the leadership race. He spoke about quite a few things that just aren’t part of the ‘national debate’ at the moment, and he is clearly an intelligent guy with decent morality. Then I was linked  in the sidebar to the same series but with Lisa Nandy. Again, I don’t see the problem with her at all. She seems bright, principled, and witty. She handled one question really well, when asked why she didn’t vote against the welfare bill, she replied along the lines that ‘this gets thrown at me in most interviews, but I was on maternity leave’ then she went about the importance of supporting people on maternity and paternity leave, which seemed to make the interviewer ‘get it’ rather than go on the aggressive. Starmer was asked the same question. He said ‘I just got that plain wrong. I did actually vote against it at the third reading but that’s mitigation and not an excuse. I’d just got into Parliament and Harriet Harman wanted to make Labour look credible to the electorate, I was whipped to do it and I just got it totally wrong’. Some people would have just said ‘I actually voted against it’ but I’m glad when politicians just say they got it wrong. RLB’s I only got 10 minutes into. Probably pissing into the wind by linking them. 
 

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Here's someone a lot more eloquent than me pointing out that Starmer's actions are contrary to party unity and to the EHRC report itself. 

 

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/03/keir-starmer-party-unity-reinstate-jeremy-corbyn-labour-disciplinary?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other&__twitter_impression=true&s=09

 

[Gnasher]

9 hours ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

I couldn’t sleep last night and watched a couple of interviews. One with Starmer with Waugh from Huffpost which I thought was great, it was from the leadership race. He spoke about quite a few things that just aren’t part of the ‘national debate’ at the moment, and he is clearly an intelligent guy with decent morality. Then I was linked  in the sidebar to the same series but with Lisa Nandy. Again, I don’t see the problem with her at all. She seems bright, principled, and witty. She handled one question really well, when asked why she didn’t vote against the welfare bill, she replied along the lines that ‘this gets thrown at me in most interviews, but I was on maternity leave’ then she went about the importance of supporting people on maternity and paternity leave, which seemed to make the interviewer ‘get it’ rather than go on the aggressive. Starmer was asked the same question. He said ‘I just got that plain wrong. I did actually vote against it at the third reading but that’s mitigation and not an excuse. I’d just got into Parliament and Harriet Harman wanted to make Labour look credible to the electorate, I was whipped to do it and I just got it totally wrong’. Some people would have just said ‘I actually voted against it’ but I’m glad when politicians just say they got it wrong. RLB’s I only got 10 minutes into. Probably pissing into the wind by linking them. 
 

 

 

Nandy is very bright and fleet footed. My problem with her is she runs with the hares and the hounds.

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 hours ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

Here's someone a lot more eloquent than me pointing out that Starmer's actions are contrary to party unity and to the EHRC report itself. 

 

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/03/keir-starmer-party-unity-reinstate-jeremy-corbyn-labour-disciplinary?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other&__twitter_impression=true&s=09

 

I mean, fucking hell. What's wrong with the swede on these fuckers. You can't write an article about it being contrary to the EHRC report whilst suggesting Starmer should politically interfere by reinstating Corbyn in the middle of an investigation and be taken seriously. I mean... what the fuck is wrong with people. There's a distinct lack of thought that goes into these types of thing, and it's based off a dishonest premise. 

 

1 minute ago, Gnasher said:

Nandy is very bright and fleet footed. My problem with her is she runs with the hares and the hounds.

I think that's fair comment. I think she's actually quite malleable and pragmatic. If you agree on 75% of stuff, maybe more than that (as Blair and Brown did) and you see that as the most important stuff, then I think it's acceptable to float on the other 25%. It just depends on if that 25% is vitally important to you. So, for example, if she is okay with renationalising the Royal Mail but also okay with not renationalising the Mail because it's 2020 and we should be going paperless anyway, on the basis that you find it much more important that you get help for needy families who are struggling to eat and buy school uniforms at the same time, then I personally fine with that because it's how I feel. I'd happily keep the Royal Mail in the hands of some private cunts if it meant Labour could get into power and help those single mums, but that doesn't mean I WANT Mail in their hands, just that I accept that I can still go and post stuff, I have a choice of people to post stuff with, and even though it's not perfect I can still do it, so it's not a priority spending for me - certainly if it's that or the Tories, when you end up with nothing you want. Now, there's a line, because if that 25% is sell the NHS, then obviously it's lynchin' time. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

I haven't heard a huge amount from Angela Rayner but I'm listening to this and she is giving her best response about Corbyn. Interesting to hear her talk about the way the last leader approached the problem and how he thought it was smaller than it actually was. Nice to hear her take some sort of responsibility for the party she is helping lead. 

 

 

[Bjornebye]

7 minutes ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

I haven't heard a huge amount from Angela Rayner but I'm listening to this and she is giving her best response about Corbyn. Interesting to hear her talk about the way the last leader approached the problem and how he thought it was smaller than it actually was. Nice to hear her take some sort of responsibility for the party she is helping lead. 

 

 

Would you? 

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Would you? 

I might, but he'd have to warm his hands up first. 

[Bjornebye]

Haha. 

 

 

Rayner though..... ? 

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

Haha. 

 

 

Rayner though..... ? 

It'd be a struggle, to be honest.

[Gnasher]

16 minutes ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

I haven't heard a huge amount from Angela Rayner but I'm listening to this and she is giving her best response about Corbyn. Interesting to hear her talk about the way the last leader approached the problem and how he thought it was smaller than it actually was. Nice to hear her take some sort of responsibility for the party she is helping lead. 

 

 

Not trying to be antagonistic here but maybe Corbyn thought antisemitism in the labour party was smaller than it was. Or are we measuring it by Twitter fake outrage?

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Gnasher said:

Not trying to be antagonistic here but maybe Corbyn thought antisemitism in the labour party was smaller than it was.

That's what she's saying, yeah. 

[Gnasher]

1 minute ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

That's what she's saying, yeah. 

Well Corbyn is right and shes wrong. If she was saying he misjudged the damage it was doing she'd have a point.

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Well Corbyn is right and shes wrong. If she was saying he misjudged the damage it was doing she'd have a point.

I don’t think she is wrong, I think she’s talking about her own personal experience with Corbyn. 
 

Would you mind replying to this I’m the Corbyn thread? I think we should try to keep this one about Starmer and the new shadow cabinet rather than the old one. 

[Captain Turdseye]

I’m sure the avatar is probably meant to be a laugh but you’re almost bordering on the obsessive here, NV. You don’t half bang on about Starmer. You can’t sleep so you end up watching clips of him on YouTube. Fucking hell, man. 

[cloggypop]

He's the first Starmerista. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

47 minutes ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I’m sure the avatar is probably meant to be a laugh but you’re almost bordering on the obsessive here, NV. You don’t half bang on about Starmer. You can’t sleep so you end up watching clips of him on YouTube. Fucking hell, man. 

Okay? 

[Captain Turdseye]

[Bjornebye]

I reckon I could to be fair. Something there. Something about her. In a stable.