Keir Starmer

[sir roger]

5 hours ago, Section_31 said:

 

Just read this now, bit of a shitty comment really by you but then it's what I expect on this thread. You and a handful of others, as soon  as I see a reply I know pretty much exactly what it will say, regardless of the story being talked about, that's why I've only just spotted it now, because there's no point looking. It's great craic, it really is. 

Are you joking ?

 

You blame or deflect every problem in the Labour party on a small, disenfranchised minority of left wingers ,  and get a titty lip on if it is pointed out.

[Numero Veinticinco]

3 hours ago, Gnasher said:

Fanfare made up? It was all over the news for days as it was always going to be.

Oh, so you don’t know what fanfare is. Fair enough. There was exposure. 
 

3 hours ago, Gnasher said:

These happy people you talk about? Tracy Oberon, Maureen Lipman and John Mann seemed overjoyed, not sure it did anything to help real victims of anti semitism and this "shitty stuff"

You clearly didn’t read the report. 

 

3 hours ago, Gnasher said:

f you want to go into the broader picture Starmer was elected on a ticket that included a call for unity

It also included other things, like rooting out antisemitism from within the party. 

 

3 hours ago, Gnasher said:

I'm not convinced right wing labour members like Ruth Smeer will win over disaffected labour voters judging by her election results but there you go.  

Labour, with a left wing agenda, with a cabinet chosen by the left wing leader, lost the election badly. You can cherry pick all you like, it won’t change the facts. 
 

3 hours ago, Gnasher said:

My point is Starmer is fighting a battle he'd already won, if he wanted it to go away he should have quit when he'd won. 

Then you clearly don’t understand the problem. 
 

I’m just going to put you on ignore now. It’s circular nonsense and reading it just annoys me. All the best. 

[Gnasher]

50 minutes ago, Numero said:

Oh, so you don’t know what fanfare is. Fair enough. There was exposure. 
 

You clearly didn’t read the report. 

 

It also included other things, like rooting out antisemitism from within the party. 

 

Labour, with a left wing agenda, with a cabinet chosen by the left wing leader, lost the election badly. You can cherry pick all you like, it won’t change the facts. 
 

Then you clearly don’t understand the problem. 
 

I’m just going to put you on ignore now. It’s circular nonsense and reading it just annoys me. All the best. 

Cheerio. 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

Keir Faragemer. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/feb/02/labour-urged-to-focus-on-flag-and-patriotism-to-win-voters-trust-leak-reveals?CMP=fb_gu&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1612295909

[skend04]

9 minutes ago, Nelly-Torres said:

Keir Faragemer. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/feb/02/labour-urged-to-focus-on-flag-and-patriotism-to-win-voters-trust-leak-reveals?CMP=fb_gu&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1612295909

Properly depressing reading all round. 

[Rushies tash]

9 minutes ago, Nelly-Torres said:

Keir Faragemer. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/feb/02/labour-urged-to-focus-on-flag-and-patriotism-to-win-voters-trust-leak-reveals?CMP=fb_gu&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1612295909

I noticed the massive union flag in the broadcast the other day (it was hard to fucking miss.) I reckon they'd be much better off focusing on pictures of the shit hole estates up north and banging on about how the Tories, their policies and (eventually in a couple of years) Brexit had done this. Juxtaposed with how much money Tory donors have been raking in. Being seen as too similar to the Tories is what saw Labour's vote share decline consistently under Blair.

[Vincent Vega]

Do they honestly believe they can out-Tory the Tories? I voted for Starmer as leader but I’ve been having major doubts recently and this kind of shit is just depressing.

[Rushies tash]

9 minutes ago, Vincent Vega said:

Do they honestly believe they can out-Tory the Tories? I voted for Starmer as leader but I’ve been having major doubts recently and this kind of shit is just depressing.

Unfortunately, I reckon anyone other than Starmer would have got the Corbyn treatment. The establishment have their safe pair of hands it would seem.

 

Edit: I fucking hate using the term "establishment" but it seems the best way of expressing the way Labour have had to move back to the centre to avoid a daily mauling by the media.

[Numero Veinticinco]

It seems to be aimed at winning back seats they lost. There's nothing inherently Conservative party about being patriotic. Want to dress smartly and have a Union Flag in the background to win a few votes from those who would happily sell the NHS off to American companies... I can live with that. If it was a policy that cut welfare spending for Mums or sick people, then that's obviously an issue. An initiative to win some votes in traditional Labour heartlands? It's not really *that* depressing. It's depressing that some people get suckered in by that shit, but the reality is that it will help win back some votes. It's a popularity contest, what were people expecting? 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

It seems a lose/lose tactic. 

 

The more left leaning Labour voters will probably be revolted by such jingoism. The voters they're trying to attract will see it as a bit patronising - they'll want a bit more than flags and a nice coat at the cenotaph. They'll want Priti Patel style immigration policies. They'll want big cuts to international aid. They'll want very un-Labour like actions before they vote for/come back to the party and before they forgive and forget Starmer's past remain credentials. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

Jingoism. What the actual fuck. 

 

The utter wank people come out with on here is quite something. 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

Just now, Numero said:

Jingoism. What the actual fuck. 

 

The utter wank people come out with on here is quite something. 

After reading your last post, you've got some balls posting that. I'll give you that. It's a depressingly shite direction for the party to go in. I know it. You know it. The cult will let you off if you knock it. Go on. You can do it. 

[Jairzinho]

I think it's the only sensible direction. 

 

The liberals in big cities are more likely to put up with right wing social policies than the Brexit crowd from towns will put up with left wing social policies.

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Nelly-Torres said:

After reading your last post, you've got some balls posting that. I'll give you that. It's a depressingly shite direction for the party to go in. I know it. You know it. The cult will let you off if you knock it. Go on. You can do it. 

You don't know what jingoism means. Deflecting like an ignorant cunt won't stop that being obvious. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Jairzinho said:

I think it's the only sensible direction. 

 

The liberals in big cities are more likely to put up with right wing social policies than the Brexit crowd from towns will put up with left wing social policies.

I've got a cult membership card with your name on it. 

 

But yeah, I think you and I spoke about this pre-Starmer. That's how much of a cultist I am, I was in the cult before it existed. 

[Jairzinho]

1 minute ago, Numero said:

I've got a cult membership card with your name on it. 

 

But yeah, I think you and I spoke about this pre-Starmer. That's how much of a cultist I am, I was in the cult before it existed. 

I think it's spelled "cunt", mate. 

[Bruce Spanner]

4 minutes ago, Nelly-Torres said:

It seems a lose/lose tactic. 

 

The more left leaning Labour voters will probably be revolted by such jingoism. The voters they're trying to attract will see it as a bit patronising - they'll want a bit more than flags and a nice coat at the cenotaph. They'll want Priti Patel style immigration policies. They'll want big cuts to international aid. They'll want very un-Labour like actions before they vote for/come back to the party and before they forgive and forget Starmer's past remain credentials. 

Potentially, but part of being in government is having the power to shape education policies which in a generation become beliefs.

 

One of the most abhorrent things the tories do is a slow creep nationalism through the curriculum and that’s part of the rot. This also applies to courts, prisons, welfare and so many other things that shape a nation and a mind set and nothing will change until those are changed, reformed and funded properly.

 

It makes sense as a way to get voters invested, I don’t like it, I think it’s deeply unpleasant given the current connotations, but you can’t change anything from the sidelines. Is it wrong, time will tell, but the fools voted for Alex so I have no fucking idea what they want.
 

 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 minute ago, Bruce Spanner said:

Potentially, but part of being in government is having the power to shape education policies which in a generation become beliefs.

 

One of the most abhorrent things the tories do is a slow creep nationalism through the curriculum and that’s part of the rot. This also applies to courts, prisons, welfare and so many other things that shape a nation and a mind set and nothing will change until those are changed, reformed and funded properly.

 

It makes sense as a way to get voters invested, I don’t like it, I think it’s deeply unpleasant given the current connotations, but you can’t change anything from the sidelines. Is it wrong, time will tell, but the fools voted for Alex so I have no fucking idea what they want.
 

 

I think most people outside of the easily categorised politically interested folk are probably put off by politicians sounding like they hate the country, that they don't like the voters, that they're not working for them, that they're all the same, that they're out for themselves, etc. It's all a load of nonsense. Labour need to win votes. It's a popularity content. You don't need to be a cultist to acknowledge that Labour are going to have to do something to win votes back. Is having some British Flags really that nauseating to people? I don't give a fuck either way, it's all empty bollocks. I want to know where Labour will stand on a range of pivotal policies. People getting their knickers in a twist on twitter and then parroting mindless dribbles on here over a flag and dressing smart is actually incredibly boring to me. If he comes out with a Tory manifesto, he can get fucked. If he gets into power, dislodges the Tories, then brings about gradual progressive change then I'll be pleased. The rest is all partisan drivel as far as I'm concerned. Flag, no flag, who gives a fuck. The answer is... the who are told to by twats with an agenda. 

[Bruce Spanner]

5 minutes ago, Nelly-Torres said:

 

Perspective is a wonderful thing.

[Bruce Spanner]

6 minutes ago, Numero said:

I think most people outside of the easily categorised politically interested folk are probably put off by politicians sounding like they hate the country, that they don't like the voters, that they're not working for them, that they're all the same, that they're out for themselves, etc. It's all a load of nonsense. Labour need to win votes. It's a popularity content. You don't need to be a cultist to acknowledge that Labour are going to have to do something to win votes back. Is having some British Flags really that nauseating to people? I don't give a fuck either way, it's all empty bollocks. I want to know where Labour will stand on a range of pivotal policies. People getting their knickers in a twist on twitter and then parroting mindless dribbles on here over a flag and dressing smart is actually incredibly boring to me. If he comes out with a Tory manifesto, he can get fucked. If he gets into power, dislodges the Tories, then brings about gradual progressive change then I'll be pleased. The rest is all partisan drivel as far as I'm concerned. Flag, no flag, who gives a fuck. The answer is... the who are told to by twats with an agenda. 

No, we’re on the same page, it just doesn’t sit well given the connotations attached to the flag currently, but if that’s where we are with these idiots who’d rather starve than vote socialism then do it, it’s for their own good.

 

 

[Gnasher]

3 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

I think it's the only sensible direction. 

 

The liberals in big cities are more likely to put up with right wing social policies than the Brexit crowd from towns will put up with left wing social policies.

I agree. Nothing wrong with it at all. Why the fuck should labour let a tory party that's sold off most of Britain's assets be seen as the patriotic party of Britain? We all know when it comes to Britain the tories couldn't give a fuck.

 

Labour under Corbyn was (imo unfairly) seen as anti British, Kuenssbergs interviews and the bbc coverage didnt help but it hurt Labour at the ballot box.

 

Britains greatest prime minister Atlee was a patriot (wasnt keen on Europe but I think I've said enough on that subject)  most of the people who fought in the two world wars were working class labour leaning voters  Labour gave birth to decent education, council house building and the National health service.

 

Starmer is right to show Labour as a party that is internationalist but proud of British values and achievements.

[Harry's Lad]

48 minutes ago, Rushies tash said:

I noticed the massive union flag in the broadcast the other day (it was hard to fucking miss.) I reckon they'd be much better off focusing on pictures of the shit hole estates up north and banging on about how the Tories, their policies and (eventually in a couple of years) Brexit had done this. Juxtaposed with how much money Tory donors have been raking in. Being seen as too similar to the Tories is what saw Labour's vote share decline consistently under Blair.

For me, they should have large graphics of the run down estates with a slogan for that, Grenfell with other tower blocks with fix the cladding slogans, empty factories and shops with slogans showing the state of the country, run down schools, lack of computers with accompanying slogans and so on.

Really ram it down the throats of people so they can see the way these bastards have tried to destroy the social fabric of the country in favour of profit for themselves and their friends at the expense of the people, and show them at every opportunity.

Never mind the fucking flag.

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Bruce Spanner said:

No, we’re on the same page, it just doesn’t sit well given the connotations attached to the flag currently, but if that’s where we are with these idiots who’d rather stave than vote socialism then do it, it’s for their own good.

I was agreeing with you. It's all a bit silly. It's every little thing, isn't it. Says this thing, does that thing, report about this thing and it's the end of the world and he's a right wing mental case or something. It's all so boring. 

[Bruce Spanner]

Just now, Numero said:

I was agreeing with you. It's all a bit silly. It's every little thing, isn't it. Says this thing, does that thing, report about this thing and it's the end of the world and he's a right wing mental case or something. It's all so boring. 

True dat.