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On 08/10/2021 at 17:48, Bjornebye said:

They won't make the champions league within the next 5 seasons. After that they could well monopolise football but it's harder than ever to break into the top in this league. They won't have European football next season (could still even get relegated this season) so won't be an attractive proposition to many top players at all. It will be a slow burn. Amanda Staveley looks like she was conceived by The Beast from Beauty and the Beast and Kryton from Red Dwarf. I used to think she was a bit of a minx as well. 

Wishful thinking.

 

Probably 2 seasons at most

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9 minutes ago, Dave D said:

Wishful thinking.

 

Probably 2 seasons at most

It will take longer than 2 seasons.

 

When Chelsea and City were taken over they had quite a lot of decent players. Newcastle have one, maybe two that are top four level. It will take time to turn them round from essentially a Championship team to a Champions league team.

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12 minutes ago, Dave D said:

Wishful thinking.

 

Probably 2 seasons at most

Nah. They wont be in the CL in 2 years. I admit players will go anywhere for silly money but there's a couple of issues here: will Newcastle offer silly money in to every player they manage to sign, would the quality players go there in the next year or two and the top 6 will continue to improve?

 

You're probably looking at 3 seasons at least but I guess we'll see.

 

 

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Two excellent posts by Bobby Hundreds.

 

Totally agree with him. If they bought us i'd be done with the club in a heartbeat.  Some things (in fact many things) are bigger than football.  PL silence speaks volumes as I said before this stinks of government interference.  The country is fucked so any extra investment & relations with the middle east oil barons was bound to be welcomed.

 

This whole suffering Newcastle fans is a load of bullshit as well. Yes Ashley has been a crap owner for them but he's not the worst owner in the north east over the last decade or two. Most owners are wankers if truth be told. They are in it for profit & the PL cash cow. Without Klopp FSG would be absolutely fucked & they'd be mass protests. The Glazers have placated the Manc cunts with the summer dealings, funny how its now all about their manager at the moment & not about the ownership.

 

Rick Parry is correct that the horse has already bolted with state ownership.  They'll be another few deals in the next few years.  Only way forward imo is something similar to the German model. Never gonna happen though sadly.  PL will end up being American hedgefunds v MiddleEast/Asian states (with a little bit of Russia Oligarch thrown into the mix)

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29 minutes ago, Dave D said:

Wishful thinking.

 

Probably 2 seasons at most

No chance in my view

 

They are fucking shite....and i don't care how much money you have you just can't go from what they are to being a champions league team in 2 seasons, it is too much of a transformation even with the money it seems like they will have...especially when there is every chance 1 of those seasons will be spent in the championship.

 

The competition at the very top now is stiffer than it was when Citeh won the lottery too.

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3 minutes ago, dockers_strike said:

Nah. They wont be in the CL in 2 years. I admit players will go anywhere for silly money but there's a couple of issues here: will Newcastle offer silly money in to every player they manage to sign, would the quality players go there in the next year or two and the top 6 will continue to improve?

 

You're probably looking at 3 seasons at least but I guess we'll see.

 

 

Maybe,  but it would seem they are uber-rich. Newcastle are a club that would gain momentum far quicker than City or Chelsea- a much bigger and more passionate fan base will see them progress pretty quickly. 

Football is so money driven, coupled with sponsorship and the importance of social media presence (see the likes of Ronaldo and Pogba) and you can see football has changed massively, even from the days of Abromivich showing up 

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3 minutes ago, Dave D said:

Maybe,  but it would seem they are uber-rich. Newcastle are a club that would gain momentum far quicker than City or Chelsea- a much bigger and more passionate fan base will see them progress pretty quickly. 

Football is so money driven, coupled with sponsorship and the importance of social media presence (see the likes of Ronaldo and Pogba) and you can see football has changed massively, even from the days of Abromivich showing up 

Yeah good points.

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Not sure Tarkowski  & Coutinho will take the to CL level so quickly. 

 

It'll still be like City. Over pay for lower tier players to improve the team in short term before trying to sign elite players in 2-4 years time.

 

The elite players are on mega bucks as it is nowadays, they won't go straight to a crap Newcastle team.  They'll at least need to get European football first.

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It kind of depends on how smart they are about it.

 

If they're smart, they'll get in a good DOF straight away and then build for a future 3-4 years from now when they're in the CL. Buy up all the 20-23 year olds, rather than going for the big names.

 

But if Tarkowski and Coutinho are anything to go by, it might take them a while, maybe even 5 years. I suppose there's an argument to be made for getting them to mid-table first, but I'd be doing that by buying the Jarrod Bowens of the world rather than the Coutinhos. Tammy Abraham, for example, would be a much better way to spend their money than Harry Kane, whose ankles will be falling off by the time they get really good and need to compete at the top end of the table.

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8 minutes ago, Ne Moe Imya said:

It kind of depends on how smart they are about it.

 

If they're smart, they'll get in a good DOF straight away and then build for a future 3-4 years from now when they're in the CL. Buy up all the 20-23 year olds, rather than going for the big names.

 

But if Tarkowski and Coutinho are anything to go by, it might take them a while, maybe even 5 years. I suppose there's an argument to be made for getting them to mid-table first, but I'd be doing that by buying the Jarrod Bowens of the world rather than the Coutinhos. Tammy Abraham, for example, would be a much better way to spend their money than Harry Kane, whose ankles will be falling off by the time they get really good and need to compete at the top end of the table.

I'm not sure it's easy to identify a good dof, because so much depends on the manager. Everton have spent hundreds of millions since they were bought by Moshiri and have hired themselves 2 dof's and 2 champions League winning managers. 

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Premier League FFP rules will make it harder to build from scratch which is what these need to do 

The thing with Chelsea for example now on top of the money they have to hand is they were investing practically billions into it it all before FFP and now every summer they get about 100 million they can spend just from selling a few of the players they've horded over the years and had out all over the place on loan or have come through their academy.

 

City are the same now with Guardiola boasting in the summer how they basically sold a few rejects to cover much of what they spent on Grealish.

 

No-one was able to do this when City won the lottery or when Chelsea won it - they didn't have to face that kind of competition...Newcastle will now.

Ashley has pretty much let Newcastle totally stagnate in terms of their whole infrastructure.....their academy and training facilities are a joke by Premier League standards (Rafa Benitez was always on at Ashley to modernise things)

 

They need massive investment and massive change in just about every area of the football club and that takes time to put in place and make work.

They'll push the lines and work their way around the rules as much as they can, but they won't be able to just do what they like for 5-10 years the way Chelsea and City did to build up......Yeah they are starting off in a similar place to where  City did - but then it was a top 4 rather than a top 6 as is now as well - there was no Man City in Man City's way (if you know what i mean!) and we were starting our Cancer and AIDS decline..... It's a lot harder to break in now - a lot harder.

 

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1 minute ago, polymerpunkah said:

If money is no object, I wonder if the Saudis approached any of the bigger boys, prior to deciding on Newcastle.

 

Why start from scratch if you can buy pre-built?

I can think of a billion + reasons.

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3 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

I'm not sure it's easy to identify a good dof, because so much depends on the manager. Everton have spent hundreds of millions since they were bought by Moshiri and have hired themselves 2 dof's and 2 champions League winning managers. 

That's why you need a good DOF. He's the one who identifies the style of play you're going for, and then can hire/sack managers as needed to suit his vision. That way you aren't buying up any mercenary who will play for anyone who pays them more and then selling them all at a loss a year or two later when you have a new manager who doesn't like them.

 

Everton's problem is that they saw Leicester catch lightning in a bottle with one or two transfers and thought "it must be Brands doing all that" and brought him in. Since he arrived, either the owners/managers have consistently failed to listen to him, or he's been incompetent. Not sure which of the two it is but it's certainly not the case that they did what I'm proposing Newcastle would do if they're smart, which is get a good Director of Football in and then let him run the club with a long-term strategy.

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22 minutes ago, Ne Moe Imya said:

That's why you need a good DOF. He's the one who identifies the style of play you're going for, and then can hire/sack managers as needed to suit his vision. That way you aren't buying up any mercenary who will play for anyone who pays them more and then selling them all at a loss a year or two later when you have a new manager who doesn't like them.

 

Everton's problem is that they saw Leicester catch lightning in a bottle with one or two transfers and thought "it must be Brands doing all that" and brought him in. Since he arrived, either the owners/managers have consistently failed to listen to him, or he's been incompetent. Not sure which of the two it is but it's certainly not the case that they did what I'm proposing Newcastle would do if they're smart, which is get a good Director of Football in and then let him run the club with a long-term strategy.

The guy Everton got from Leicester was Steve Walsh, they sacked him a couple years ago. Brands was from PSV.

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The Newcastle fans have it on good authority that Bin Salman was on a week long bender in The Old George in Newcastle City Centre when Khashoggi was getting sliced and diced. No way he was involved or ordered it. His Nokia was out of charge. There were 40,000 witnesses.

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11 hours ago, polymerpunkah said:

If money is no object, I wonder if the Saudis approached any of the bigger boys, prior to deciding on Newcastle.

 

Why start from scratch if you can buy pre-built?

Apparently they wanted Spurs and Levy quoted them £3.5bn. Money's no object for them but they're not stupid.

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12 hours ago, polymerpunkah said:

If money is no object, I wonder if the Saudis approached any of the bigger boys, prior to deciding on Newcastle.

 

Why start from scratch if you can buy pre-built?

A number of reasons: Owners of the 'big 6,' as the media like to call them, would only sell for stupid money. Kronkie's have said this, FSG have said it, Glazers probably think it etc.

 

Owners of smaller clubs like Newcastle are usually happy to offload a club for a couple of hundred million. But most probably, mega rich people dont like making other people mega rich on the back of 'their' money.

 

I wonder if Edwards had inside info on the deal when he told FSG he fancied a new challenge recently? Wouldnt surprise me to see him turn up at Newcastle.

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10 hours ago, Ne Moe Imya said:

That's why you need a good DOF. He's the one who identifies the style of play you're going for, and then can hire/sack managers as needed to suit his vision. That way you aren't buying up any mercenary who will play for anyone who pays them more and then selling them all at a loss a year or two later when you have a new manager who doesn't like them.

 

Everton's problem is that they saw Leicester catch lightning in a bottle with one or two transfers and thought "it must be Brands doing all that" and brought him in. Since he arrived, either the owners/managers have consistently failed to listen to him, or he's been incompetent. Not sure which of the two it is but it's certainly not the case that they did what I'm proposing Newcastle would do if they're smart, which is get a good Director of Football in and then let him run the club with a long-term strategy.

As I said in a previous post, I don't think it's easy to identify a good dof. Edwards as an example was absolutely fucking shite until klopp came along. If you think that's coincidence, fine. I don't, I think a good dof is a tiny part of the story.  

 

As for Everton. They didn't get brands from Leicester. They got Steve Walsh. They quickly realised that wasn't working. So they chased brands who was broadly regarded as a good dof across Europe. Yet he hasn't been. Monchi was lauded for what he did at Seville, yet he was absolutely shite at Roma. It just isn't a magic wand thing. You can have all the long term strategy you want, but everyone is doing the same thing. I could say "I'm a dof, aim to get u25 players for resale value, aim to get players who can press and pass, play a high paced game and use data to deliver those players". But if it was that simple, we wouldn't have managers and we wouldn't have dof's and we'd just have really good hardware and software developers driving recruitment AI and team selection. 

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52 minutes ago, magicrat said:

The big question is whether in 5 years time we will have a thread entitled " Barcodes the new Bitters "

 

Yes. Newcastle fans are insufferable when they're shite, just imagine how they'll be after a trophy or ten.

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They’ll be wanting to make a statement signing as soon as they can to show they mean business and to help attract others. 
 

It could well be that transfers the usual suspects have been working on could be about to be blown out of the water. 
 

I doubt they’re yet in a position (not for financial reasons obviously) to snare the absolute cream of the crop yet, but they might be in for the next level down, or the best of the young players available. This could well have a knock on effect on the transfer plans in place at our club. 

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