Jump to content
Bjornebye

Coronavirus

Recommended Posts

Small Pox was the last time a 'passport' was needed as proof of vaccination, until a group of anti vaxxers got there way in 1949, children given the small pox vaccine were put on a register and the parents issued a certificate of proof.

 

Small Pox is all but eradicated now.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

That's literally what happens with law and governments. 

So you are worried about government?  Well, I’m afraid there’s not much we can do about that is there? Other than vote them out.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Rico1304 said:

So you are worried about government?  Well, I’m afraid there’s not much we can do about that is there? Other than vote them out.  

When you write laws, you write them with how they're likely to be applied both now and in the future. Any type of ID scheme for public gatherings or any type of needing to prove something about your health can clearly open the door for other things without law changes. You've smoked? The NHS won't treat your cancer than as we need to save money. You just tweak what's there, no law change required.

 

This government through the whole Brexit process has shown they will do that and literally tried to use hundreds of years old mechanisms to deny goverent sitting. This goverent has been taken to court more times than any I can remember. If this government alone (let alone what a bad one could do with clever people) doesn't worry you about your democracy and freedoms, well nothing will. I wouldn't give them any measures for any purpose that restricted freedoms or parliament, unless they are time limited. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

When you write laws, you write them with how they're likely to be applied both now and in the future. Any type of ID scheme for public gatherings or any type of needing to prove something about your health can clearly open the door for other things without law changes. You've smoked? The NHS won't treat your cancer than as we need to save money. You just tweak what's there, no law change required.

 

This government through the whole Brexit process has shown they will do that and literally tried to use hundreds of years old mechanisms to deny goverent sitting. This goverent has been taken to court more times than any I can remember. If this government alone (let alone what a bad one could do with clever people) doesn't worry you about your democracy and freedoms, well nothing will. I wouldn't give them any measures for any purpose that restricted freedoms or parliament, unless they are time limited. 

So you think that by tweaking the law and having a 3 month limit protects us?  That law couldn’t be amended because it’s already there?  I don’t think I’ve ever seen a more circular argument.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

So you think that by tweaking the law and having a 3 month limit protects us?  That law couldn’t be amended because it’s already there?  I don’t think I’ve ever seen a more circular argument.  

As I made clear before, I think any new restrictions should be time limited and if they are to be extended should have the need to be brought back to parliament, debated and put back into law for another 3 months. I wouldn't trust this (or any government, but especially this one) with any law such as this. As I have posted before, I see it as a health crisis and it could be needed right now. Time limited and should be very specific about how and why it can be used. Specific is not something this government has much interest in, so time limit is probably as good as you'll get. 

 

I don't really understand why you would object to the idea of it being time limited. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

As I made clear before, I think any new restrictions should be time limited and if they are to be extended should have the need to be brought back to parliament, debated and put back into law for another 3 months. I wouldn't trust this (or any government, but especially this one) with any law such as this. As I have posted before, I see it as a health crisis and it could be needed right now. Time limited and should be very specific about how and why it can be used. Specific is not something this government has much interest in, so time limit is probably as good as you'll get. 

 

I don't really understand why you would object to the idea of it being time limited. 

I’m not objecting to it, but your argument that it could be tweaked makes the time limit useless. They can just strike that part of the legislation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Rico1304 said:

I’m not objecting to it, but your argument that it could be tweaked makes the time limit useless. They can just strike that part of the legislation. 

Of course they can. But they'd have to do that through parliament and with debate to do so. And they'd need their right wing nuts to be onboard with it. If it just drops off because at some point covid is seen to be beaten, then it's gone, off the books and can't be used down the line in 10, 20, 30 years time to back door something else in on the back of it with some other regime. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Joe Biden stated on October 7, 2021 in remarks in Elk Grove Village, Ill.: People who are vaccinated for the coronavirus “cannot spread it to you."


Our ruling

Biden said that people who are vaccinated for the coronavirus "cannot spread it to you."

That’s overstating the case. Multiple studies show that a vaccinated person is significantly less likely to pass the coronavirus to someone else than an unvaccinated person is, but the transmission risk is not reduced to zero.

We rate the statement Half True.

 

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/oct/14/joe-biden/joe-biden-overstates-effectiveness-vaccines-preven/

 

It's not overstating the case it's 100% wrong.

 

It's not half true it's 100% false.

 

And you'd have to lie to yourself to believe otherwise.

 

"It was quite simple. All that was needed was an unending series of victories over your own memory. 'Reality control', they called it: in Newspeak, 'doublethink'."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

Was sure I'd picked it up again late last week but several negative laterals and a pcr means I can't have, got some alwful bug though with all the hallmarks of it.

I had a horrendous cold a few weeks ago and I just haven’t felt right since, like you I had several negative tests.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

Was sure I'd picked it up again late last week but several negative laterals and a pcr means I can't have, got some alwful bug though with all the hallmarks of it.

 

27 minutes ago, Captain Howdy said:

I had a horrendous cold a few weeks ago and I just haven’t felt right since, like you I had several negative tests.

I’m about 4 weeks into some weird viral cold thing. It’s been through the whole family. Twice I’ve thought I was over it, got pissed and it’s come back again. Started off with a sore throat that came and went, that went, got bladdered, came back with voice loss, that went and I inexplicably got pissed again, and now my voice has gone again and I’ve had a fry cough which is now becoming loose. If it wasn’t so prevalent throughout my work and family I would be thinking I was on my way out!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Captain Howdy said:

I had a horrendous cold a few weeks ago and I just haven’t felt right since, like you I had several negative tests.

I'm sure it's some kind of covid fucking hybrid.

6 minutes ago, Belarus said:

 

I’m about 4 weeks into some weird viral cold thing. It’s been through the whole family. Twice I’ve thought I was over it, got pissed and it’s come back again. Started off with a sore throat that came and went, that went, got bladdered, came back with voice loss, that went and I inexplicably got pissed again, and now my voice has gone again and I’ve had a fry cough which is now becoming loose. If it wasn’t so prevalent throughout my work and family I would be thinking I was on my way out!

Can't even get pissed in peace anymore , what the fuck is 2021, the cough has been the worst part for me, horrendous chesty cough.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

I'm sure it's some kind of covid fucking hybrid.

Can't even get pissed in peace anymore , what the fuck is 2021, the cough has been the worst part for me, horrendous chesty cough.

That’s where I am now. Scratchy voice, in the day, dry cough and tight chest at night. As I say, it’s coming out now it seems and becoming “productive” as the medical profession say

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

I'm sure it's some kind of covid fucking hybrid.

Can't even get pissed in peace anymore , what the fuck is 2021, the cough has been the worst part for me, horrendous chesty cough.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhinovirus

 

Apparently this is what the 10 day chesty cough is known as.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

I've seen cases of Covid-19 striking down extremely fit and muscular people. Not convinced they would have benefitted from exercise advice. Not sure what advice could be given regards sunlight. 

 

It can probably get most people to some extent with all of the factors involved, I think some other advice would've helped though to reduce some cases since this started up. Advice to get out in the sun more could've helped get vitamin D levels up too for some people's immune systems, especially in those deficient.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chomsky said recently that unvaxx should have the decency to remove themselves from society, and when it comes to how they get food : "well, that's actually their problem." Then he said if things become destitute some measures would have to be taken to secure their survival.

 

This pandemic has really fucked with people's heads.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

It can probably get most people to some extent with all of the factors involved, I think some other advice would've helped though to reduce some cases since this started up. Advice to get out in the sun more could've helped get vitamin D levels up too for some people's immune systems, especially in those deficient.

But having people outside contravened the lockdown rules. This situation has been a nightmare from the beginning to keep under control. The Government sadly have made the situation way harder to control through poor decision making on national and international levels. Trying to solve it through individual behaviours relies on people being sensible and considerate. I think it's fair to say the vast majority in most countries struggle to tick one of those boxes, let alone both.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

Chomsky said recently that unvaxx should have the decency to remove themselves from society, and when it comes to how they get food : "well, that's actually their problem." Then he said if things become destitute some measures would have to be taken to secure their survival.

 

This pandemic has really fucked with people's heads.

I'm not convinced it's the illness that has, it seems to me to be more the ruling class setting the example of 'do whatever you want and there will be no recriminations - unless it suits the ruling class'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

But having people outside contravened the lockdown rules. This situation has been a nightmare from the beginning to keep under control. The Government sadly have made the situation way harder to control through poor decision making on national and international levels. Trying to solve it through individual behaviours relies on people being sensible and considerate. I think it's fair to say the vast majority in most countries struggle to tick one of those boxes, let alone both.

 

Yeah it wouldn't have worked during the lockdown but it could've helped in all of the time we've been out of it. One of the main parts for them has been making sure pharma makes cash though I think.

 

10 minutes ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

I'm not convinced it's the illness that has, it seems to me to be more the ruling class setting the example of 'do whatever you want and there will be no recriminations - unless it suits the ruling class'.

 

They've definitely taken advantage of it, with Chomsky though he's old now and could be really high risk, so I've not taken what he's said so seriously even if I do find it a bit shocking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/oct/14/joe-biden/joe-biden-overstates-effectiveness-vaccines-preven/

 

It's not overstating the case it's 100% wrong.

 

It's not half true it's 100% false.

 

And you'd have to lie to yourself to believe otherwise.

 

"It was quite simple. All that was needed was an unending series of victories over your own memory. 'Reality control', they called it: in Newspeak, 'doublethink'."


You’re not doing a great job of pretending not to be anti-vax anymore. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

Chomsky said recently that unvaxx should have the decency to remove themselves from society, and when it comes to how they get food : "well, that's actually their problem." Then he said if things become destitute some measures would have to be taken to secure their survival.

 

This pandemic has really fucked with people's heads.

“If people decide ‘I am willing to be a danger to the community by refusing the vaccine’ they should then say well ‘I also have the decency to isolate myself. I don’t want a vaccine but I don’t have the right to run around harming people’.

“That should be a convention. Enforcing is a different question. It should be understood and we should try to get it to be understood.”
 

I think old Noam (and he is looking very old) is working on the incorrect assumption that people refusing the vaccine are doing so with proper knowledge and good intentions.

 

Either that or he’s just trolling antivaxxers because he hates stupid people.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×