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VAR shit show 19/20

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So many fans have told me that we are going to benefit a lot from var. That in some study we are very unlucky with decisions etc. So with var being implemented this season we should be a lot better off.
 

The point of this thread is to see how that pans out over the season. So we start at 0-0 with var neither helping us nor hindering us. I predict over the season (premiership games only) that var will shit on us, hopefully I’m wrong.
 

Some idiots have tried to compare the introduction of ball line technology with the introduction of var. One uses precise measurements to decide on the position of a ball in relation to a line, the other uses useless twats to tell another useless twat what their stupid opinion is. 
 

I’m at all the home games so any help on this will be appreciated. For this particular thread I am thinking of only counting var decisions that are made that change the referees decision. So possible red card, or possible offsides etc don’t count if var doesn’t then uphold them.

 

So we or the opposition score a goal and celebrate but var then decides it was not a goal. Likewise a red card is awarded to either side or a penalty that the ref didn’t see. These are gains or losses that we might not have experienced previously.


Let the shit show begin. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, TK421 said:

This thread reeks of confirmation bias.

Decision that would not normally be given, is given by var. I don’t see how confirmation bias comes into it. I’m not the var official. 
 

I’m pretty sure OPTA will have stats on VAR decisions, those confirmation biased bastards. 
 

 

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I'm of the opinion that the Ref's are so bad they need the extra help.

 

What I did find shit about it was in the charity shield match there was an announcement made during the game "VAR Check no penalty." 

 

Hoddle was saying how this is great that people in the stadium are now aware of whats happening.

The fucking gobshite people at home didn't even know what was happening because after they made the announcement in the stadium they showed the replay of Arnold flicking out his foot. 

I'd say there was nobody in the stadium that picked up on that or that it was even being checked.

 

If he had made contact and was sent off there wouldn't be any replays to the people in the stadium showing what the sending off was for.

You'd be at the match having to use your phone to find out why he was sent off. Thats shit. 

 

 

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Yes the refs are that bad they do need help, but when Atkinson is the var official that’s not really help, that’s just another arsehole. Nobody needs more than one arsehole, well I can think of one person. 

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7 minutes ago, Champions of Europe said:

Decision that would not normally be given, is given by var. I don’t see how confirmation bias comes into it. I’m not the var official. 
 

I’m pretty sure OPTA will have stats on VAR decisions, those confirmation biased bastards. 
 

 

Confirmation bias comes into it because you've already decided VAR is shit rather than having an open mind about it.  So you will be looking for decisions that reinforce your preconceived opinion about the quality of VAR and how it's going to screw us over.  

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14 minutes ago, TK421 said:

Confirmation bias comes into it because you've already decided VAR is shit rather than having an open mind about it.  So you will be looking for decisions that reinforce your preconceived opinion about the quality of VAR and how it's going to screw us over.  

 

 

I’m not making the decisions. The decisions will be pretty obvious, it’s like saying I only count goals I like. I can’t believe I’m having to explain this, or maybe I can. 
 

 

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Just now, Champions of Europe said:

Are you dumb for a living?

 

I’m not making the decisions. The decisions will be pretty obvious, it’s like saying I only count goals I like. I can’t beilive I’m having to explain this, or maybe I can. 

I don't think all of the decisions will be obvious, that's kind of the point of VAR is it not?  And there is still an element of subjectivity for things like red cards and penalties.

 

I'm not poo-pooing the whole thread, by the way.  It's interesting and I'll be following it.  I just don't think it will be the definitive guide to the performance of VAR because there are still subjective elements involved in interpreting the various decisions.  

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5 minutes ago, TK421 said:

I don't think all of the decisions will be obvious, that's kind of the point of VAR is it not?  And there is still an element of subjectivity for things like red cards and penalties.

 

I'm not poo-pooing the whole thread, by the way.  It's interesting and I'll be following it.  I just don't think it will be the definitive guide to the performance of VAR because there are still subjective elements involved in interpreting the various decisions.  

Well that’s not confirmation bias. This isn’t a science experiment it’s just to see how often var screws us v how often it benefits us.

 

Any referee decision that is changed by var should really be counted as normally that wouldn’t have been made if not for var. I don’t really care if the var decision is wrong or right, well I do but for the stats it’s not important, wrong or right is a discussion for the match thread. 
 

I genuinely hope that the shithouse teams are punished by var and that we benefit. History just doesn’t back that up in my opinion. New rules generally fuck us over. 

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2 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

I hate having to cheer then wait to see if it is given 

Yeah, it takes quite a bit away from the experience. I already have to look towards the linesman when we score. Having gone through the whole celebration only to have it chalked off just stinks. However when it happens to the opposition it’s fun, so what can you do. 

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2018 bbc article
 

 

Liverpool were the 'unluckiest' team in the Premier League last season while Manchester United were the 'luckiest', new research claims. 

The Reds dropped 12 points in matches affected by wrongly disallowed goals or incorrect decisions on penalties and red cards, says a study conducted by ESPN, Intel and the University of Bath.

It says United gained six points over incidents that went in their favour.

Manchester City remain top in a new simulated table accounting for 'luck'.

However, the study found Huddersfield should have been relegated instead of Stoke when 'incorrect' refereeing decisions were taken into account.

It also found Brighton would have finished six places higher - moving up to ninth and earning an extra £11.5m in prize money on their return to the top flight. 

Conversely, Leicester would have finished 14th instead of ninth, ending the season with £9.7m less in prize money.

Fourth-placed Liverpool would have swapped with second-placed United, and champions City fallen three points short of their 100 mark.

How did the 'Luck Index' work?

A research team collaborated with ex-Premier League referee Peter Walton, analysing footage from every game of the 2017-18 Premier League season and watching for:

  • Goals that should have been disallowed
  • Incorrectly disallowed goals
  • Incorrectly awarded penalties (that were scored)
  • Penalties that were not awarded but should have been
  • Incorrect red-card decisions
  • Red-card incidents that were missed 
  • Goals scored after injury time overran
  • Deflected goals

Once incidents had been indentified, an alternative outcome of the affected matches was predicted, using a model that also considered factors including team strength, form, and home advantage.

For example: in Liverpool's 0-0 draw with Manchester United at Anfield on 14 October, the study concluded Jurgen Klopp's side should have been awarded a penalty in the 63rd minute, and the new simulated scoreline was a 1-0 victory for the home side.

And, while Leicester gained seven points compared to Manchester United's six according to the 'Luck Index', the Red Devils' points came from fewer incidents, giving them a greater points-per-incident ratio.

 

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I'm thick for a living, but wouldn't the above support the hypothesis that VAR will work in our favour rather than the other way around? 

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15 minutes ago, TK421 said:

I'm thick for a living, but wouldn't the above support the hypothesis that VAR will work in our favour rather than the other way around? 

Yes it would, I predict it won’t. I’ll be very happy to be wrong. 
 

It’s the reason I decided on this thread and also put my cards on the table from the start. The var decisions that change the game are a measurable statistic. 
 

 

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20 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

 

So they make the example that the challenge by Kompany on Salah while a red card, would not have been overturned by var for the yellow that was given.

 

 
 

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Take Martin Atkinson, he’s not biased in my opinion, he’s just awful and if you’re unlucky enough to be on the bad side of that then that’s just too bad. 
 

Remember the beach ball? A clear rule existed that was not applied by any of the officials. You’d hope var would sort that kind of fuck up.

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I think it will be interesting. VAR is not perfect, and is subject to interpretation, but at least the VAR officials get more time and different angles so are more likely to to get the decision right. It cant be perfect because the rules themselves are confusing and open to interpretation- who understands what is handball and what is offside anymore? Even the refs cant agree when looking at replays.

As we tend to have the ball in the opposition area more often than the other way round I suspect VAR will overall favour us but lets see.

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The amount of time taken to reach a decision is one of the things people have most problems with when it comes to VAR. It can be several minutes in some cases, and a lot of people (mostly inside the stadium) won't know why. Usually, the ref is talking via his earpiece to the 4th official and the VAR officials. After a while, the ref will come over to the pitchside monitor to view the incident for himself. I think the ref should be coming over to the pitchside monitor the moment he is informed that there is a VAR review, not having a discussion and THEN coming over to the sidelines. I see no reason why he cannot be communicating with the other officials as well as reviewing the footage at the same time.

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I said in the other VAR thread that there should be no pitchside monitors , all decisions should come from the VAR crew thus eliminating the waste of time & the influence of the referee's ego.

 

In theory, England should benefit from being last in the big leagues to react to VAR and should have been able t learn from everybody else's errors and successes. The worry of course is how low the standard is in our present referees ( Not having a single official chosen for the World Cup should have seen Riley & Webb resign or be ousted )

 

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1 hour ago, Bjornebye said:

I hate having to cheer then wait to see if it is given 

 

It feels like a slow mexican wave. 

 

Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo - inhale - oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooff-fucking-side. 

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My prediction:

 

On the occasions VAR fucks us over, there’ll be a widespread shrug of the shoulders and a suck it up attitude in the media.

 

On the occasions we unfairly benefit from it, there’ll be outrage.

 

Second prediction:

 

We’ll be much the same about VAR decisions concerning other teams.

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So to count in this thread here’s a simple guide.
 

If var changes the referees initial decision, it counts. So for example the penalty against spurs (I know it wasn’t in the premiership) that kind of decision doesn’t count as the penalty was already given, all var did was uphold the decision, well for everyone but Glenn Hoddle. If the ref didn’t see it, then that also counts if var sees it and gives it. If a goal is flagged offside, then var gives it, then that counts. 
 

var must clearly be seen to benefit us or the opposition. 

 

I’m interested in how being one of the unluckiest teams for referee decisions, as well as one of the most attacking teams in the league translates over a season when we have var. 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Champions of Europe said:

So if var changes the referees initial decision, it counts. So for example the penalty against spurs (I know it wasn’t in the premiership) that kind of decision doesn’t count as the penalty was already given, all var did was uphold the decision, well for everyone but Glenn Hoddle. If the ref didn’t see it, then that also counts if var sees it and gives it. If a goal is flagged offside, then var gives it, then that counts. 
 

var must clearly be seen to benefit us or the opposition.

 

I’m interested in how being one of the unluckiest teams for referee decisions, as well as one of the most attacking teams in the league translates over a season when we have var. 

 

 

Luck would dictate and we're revert back to belting them at the post/cross bar instead. VAR would still come up to show the replay and "NO GOAL" would be spammed everywhere. 

 

VAR would also give goals and the ref would override to give a foul to the oppo. 

 

Crystal clear that we're not going to benefit. Why would we? 

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