Tommy Smith

[littletedwest]

Great player. Those comments are awful. Hopefully his views changed as times did. Anyway RIP great servant for us and a man with a family 

[JohnnyH]

2 hours ago, aws said:

Would it be possible to leave the analysis of his views until after the funeral? 

No. That’s the whole point. It’s not like he said stuff that was a bit off. It was absolutely horrific. I think it’s important it’s said now as people call him a legend and some ex Liverpool players call him a “great man”, although not many have said that. They all stick to him being a great player, which he was. 

[littletedwest]

7 minutes ago, littletedwest said:

Great player. Those comments are awful. Hopefully his views changed as times did. Anyway RIP great servant for us and a man with a family 

To be fair after some more reading he acted like a cunt with Howard Gayle 

[suzy]

I didn’t see Tommy play, just before my time but I knew Emlyn had beef with him ( and Emlyn was one of my favourites) Saw Thommo on SSN earlier and he was full of praise for Smith.

[Mook]

3 hours ago, JohnnyH said:

He said them in 1988 when everyone else in Liverpool was supporting our best player, John Barnes. They were abhorrent views at the time too 

Some Liverpool fans were throwing bananas at Barnes in '87/88, let's not pretend Tommy Smith was on his own.

[JohnnyH]

14 minutes ago, Mook said:

Some Liverpool fans were throwing bananas at Barnes in '87/88, let's not pretend Tommy Smith was on his own.

True. Lots of other people were horrific cunts too. 

[Chip Butty]

Maybe going out on a limb here, but how many fella's born in the 40's and 50's, and probably even the early 60's, are minimally, partially or even fullblown, shit/shinola, racist? 

 

OK, the likes of Stringy and Dave will protest about the 40's and 50's bit, but i reckon y'all dig ma jig. 

 

Just a thought. 

[Strontium]

Don't think anyone is going to defend Tommy Smith's attitudes towards black people in the cold light of the 21st century, but he was a product of his times. You might as well criticise Homo habilis for having poor table manners.

[aws]

4 hours ago, JohnnyH said:

No. That’s the whole point. It’s not like he said stuff that was a bit off. It was absolutely horrific. I think it’s important it’s said now as people call him a legend and some ex Liverpool players call him a “great man”, although not many have said that. They all stick to him being a great player, which he was. 

No . The whole point is he's just died and people want to pay tribute to what he did for the club as a player. Other people want to rake up stuff which has all been done before and can be done again at any time in the future. 

[JohnnyH]

I’m surprised by many of the posts here. His unrepentant views are horrific. They are so bad that I don’t think they can be divorced or ignored at any time from what he did on the pitch. Others do. Fair enough (although I obviously strongly disagree). I’ll not comment any more. 

[KMD7]

Never knew that about Smith. Even more gutted now. 

[Tj hooker]

I never knew that about Smith totally unacceptable by any measure 

[s(k)aturation]

14 hours ago, littletedwest said:

Anyway RIP great servant for us and a man with a family 

 

Nah, fuck that.

 

There are valuable points to be scored on an internet forum.

 

 

[Grinch]

Jesus the hypocritical lefties can't even leave it out of a recently deceased thread. 

 

White man born in the 40s said things that are racist by today's standards shocker. 

 

 

[3 Stacks]

2 hours ago, Grinch said:

Jesus the hypocritical lefties can't even leave it out of a recently deceased thread. 

 

White man born in the 40s said things that are racist by today's standards shocker. 

 

 

You're doing the same thing, only worse. Bringing up politics in an incendiary way to bother people when they're discussing a legitimate moral dilemma. 

[TheHowieLama]

14 hours ago, aws said:

No . The whole point is he's just died and people want to pay tribute to what he did for the club as a player. Other people want to rake up stuff which has all been done before and can be done again at any time in the future. 

I think the point is how does the club handle a "tribute" to the player while ignoring the character of the man.

Thats difficult.

[moof]

19 hours ago, JohnnyH said:

No. That’s the whole point. It’s not like he said stuff that was a bit off. It was absolutely horrific. I think it’s important it’s said now as people call him a legend and some ex Liverpool players call him a “great man”, although not many have said that. They all stick to him being a great player, which he was. 

Yep, what better time is there to talk about it? 

 

Great player but horrific cunt of a man. Tributes should be tempered accordingly 

[VladimirIlyich]

8 hours ago, Grinch said:

Jesus the hypocritical lefties can't even leave it out of a recently deceased thread. 

 

White man born in the 40s said things that are racist by today's standards shocker. 

 

 

My old fella was born in the 1930's and had a lifelong friend who was black and whose family was from Africa. He met him in school and stayed friends until the first of them passed away. I still know the family now. Its not as if being born in Liverpool in pre and post ww2 Britain gives you an excuse to be an unapologetic racist. Have to agree with Johnny that both sides of nature have to be referenced when summing them up. He gets his plaudits as a great player and gets called out on some horrible things. I have to admit that I am quite shocked by those comments Smith made though.

[Harry Squatter]

Makes me laugh about him saying his daughter bringing a black man home. My mate was seeing his daughter ages ago and he's a big 23 stone baldy Coke head who can't lie straight in bed. 

[Saintslfc13]

On 14/04/2019 at 07:28, TheHowieLama said:

I think the point is how does the club handle a "tribute" to the player while ignoring the character of the man.

Thats difficult.

"Tommy Smith, who was a fantastic servant for Liverpool Football Club during his years with us has passed away at the age of 77. (Insert blurb about honors won). Our sympathies are with his family and friends at this time."

I don't know how the club are going to do it but that's about how I'd go about it. Individual opinions do not reflect the views of Liverpool Football Club, especially when those opinions were given ages ago. If he was a current player or part of the coaching or backroom staff then sure pull him up on it, fine him, fire him, whatever, but what amounts to a posthumous excommunication only hurts the people close to him that are mourning him and for all anyone knows those people aren't racist cunts themselves. Hell for that matter maybe Tommy Smith completely reformed his views in his later years, I have no idea.

In my opinion the only reason the club should address those comments after his death is if they're directly asked about it, at which point they should just state the obvious. A dead former players views on race from some 40-50 years ago are not representative of the views of the club now, nor have they ever been.

[Bjornebye]

On 13/04/2019 at 21:33, Chip Butty said:

Maybe going out on a limb here, but how many fella's born in the 40's and 50's, and probably even the early 60's, are minimally, partially or even fullblown, shit/shinola, racist? 

 

OK, the likes of Stringy and Dave will protest about the 40's and 50's bit, but i reckon y'all dig ma jig. 

 

Just a thought. 

Dont knock the 1740's 

[magicrat]

10 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Dont knock the 1740's 

Rees Mogg wants us to go back there

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

23 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Dont knock the 1740's 

You still not over Culloden?

[VladimirIlyich]

13 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

Dont knock the 1740's 

Insert Stringy joke. Although he's usually having his tea about that time of day.

[sir roger]

On 14/04/2019 at 15:28, TheHowieLama said:

I think the point is how does the club handle a "tribute" to the player while ignoring the character of the man.

Thats difficult.

I am rather hoping there won't be t-shirts