Is it racist for a white person to paint their face black/brown for fancy dress?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 hours ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

Dressing up as a Minstrel has historical context, dressing up as Jules Winnfield does not.

I think the "Jules" facepaint (from what I've seen) was closer to the old Jim Crow tradition of blackface minstrels than it was to Pulp Fiction. 

 

Like Trumo says "context is everything". In context, I'd say that bloke on the Tube was acting like a racist dickhead. 

[Pidge]

 

3 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

If a black person painted their face white it wouldn't bother me in the slightest. Not even close to offending me. The threshold for being offended these days is as low as its ever been. 

 

Yeah, don't think we've been subject to the same level of cultural exclusion to be honest, so it doesn't exactly seem like a fair comparison.

 

I don't think it necessarily means that the person is a racist to dress up that way, but it could be insensitive so it might be best advised to consider where you're wearing it.  That kind of playful transgression is harmless where you're dealing with people that know you don't mean any harm.  But in this day and age those might not be the only people who see it (especially with social media), so it might lead to offence on the assumption that you are taking the piss of perfectly legitimate concerns about equality, rather than breaking a taboo for the fun of it.

[VladimirIlyich]

Are any people on here black/asian? I would be interested in your views on it.

[aRdja]

1 minute ago, VladimirIlyich said:

Are any people on here black/asian? I would be interested in your views on it.

Mmmm... I’m not sure... I don’t think I care enough. Btw, I went to a ‘mixed’ Indian-Irish wedding in Tuscany back in August. The bridesmaids - most were white - wore Indian dresses and they looked lovely. I’m not sure it would’ve been as well received had they made themselves brown. 

[Strontium]

1 hour ago, aRdja said:

Here’s the article:

https://medium.com/the-establishment/miley-cyrus-image-makeover-shows-why-black-people-fight-for-their-culture-ada67f9749b5

 

Hmm. Well, I could say a lot about that article but the topic doesn't interest me enough to waste my life doing so so I'll just denounce it as bitter, racist drivel and leave it at that.

[aRdja]

2 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

Hmm. Well, I could say a lot about that article but the topic doesn't interest me enough to waste my life doing so so I'll just denounce it as bitter, racist drivel and leave it at that.

Yeah, I suppose most people wouldn’t give a shit, unless they’re the ones taken advantage of.

[Captain Turdseye]

In years gone by you’d have easily got away with it, for obvious reasons. These days though, it’s abhorrent and morally wrong. 

 

I’m not talking about blacking up like, I mean posting an article about Miley Cyrus. 

[VladimirIlyich]

4 minutes ago, aRdja said:

Mmmm... I’m not sure... I don’t think I care enough. Btw, I went to a ‘mixed’ Indian-Irish wedding in Tuscany back in August. The bridesmaids - most were white - wore Indian dresses and they looked lovely. I’m not sure it would’ve been as well received had they made themselves brown. 

We're on the same page personally but what I think doesn't actually matter.

[Alan Sex]

1 hour ago, Paul said:

FYI: racism is a little bit bigger than  people believing “they should be offended”. 

Agreed, racism is a terrible thing. No time for it, no place for it. 

 

I was more more referring to the current trend of people looking around for the next hip thing to be offended by. 

[Strontium]

19 minutes ago, aRdja said:

Yeah, I suppose most people wouldn’t give a shit, unless they’re the ones taken advantage of.

 

The fact that you see a white woman choosing to experiment with hip hop music as "taking advantage" sums up the nonsensical attitude.

[Chip Butty]

Where the white wimmin at?

[aRdja]

6 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

The fact that you see a white woman choosing to experiment with hip hop music as "taking advantage" sums up the nonsensical attitude.

No one is pretending that it’s a straightforward issue, especially for people who are not in the scene, like you and me (even though I love the music. However I appreciate both viewpoints. 

[Strontium]

I can't respect any viewpoint that regards one group of people as custodians of a particular music genre simply because of the colour of their skin. Human existence is plagued by these arbitrary and ridiculous boundaries.

[Scooby Dudek]

I thought this was in relation to Megyn Kelly;

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/10/25/opinions/megyn-kelly-blackface-comments-racism-roxanne-jones/index.html

 

"But what is racist?" Kelly asked on her show. "Because you do get in trouble if you are a white person who puts on blackface on Halloween, or a black person who puts on whiteface for Halloween. Back when I was a kid that was OK, as long as you were dressing up as, like, a character."

 

 

NBC slams Megyn Kelly over blackface comments 02:02

The backlash was swift. Kelly was roasted across social media and more importantly her colleagues and bosses were appalled by her comments. NBC executives forced Kelly to apologize first, internally to her colleagues, and then to the viewers.

But Halloween is tricky and the blackface flap didn't die down.

Ironically, for me, the most revealing part of Kelly's explosive comments was their illumination of her true face as an out-of-the-closet racist, in my opinion.

 

 

 

 

[Scooby Dudek]

I found this whilst looking for the Megyn Kelly story, obviously American based;

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/history-of-blackface-unmasking-the-racism-reignited-by-megyn-kelly-controversy/

 

 

Unmasking the racist history of blackface

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

13 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

I can't respect any viewpoint that regards one group of people as custodians of a particular music genre simply because of the colour of their skin. Human existence is plagued by these arbitrary and ridiculous boundaries.

I thought that way until I heard Big Mountain's attempts at reggae.

[aRdja]

20 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

I can't respect any viewpoint that regards one group of people as custodians of a particular music genre simply because of the colour of their skin. Human existence is plagued by these arbitrary and ridiculous boundaries.

It’s not necessarily the colour of the skin only. The Beastie Boys, for example, not sure you’re familiar with them, they’re three jews from from New York, I don’t think they were ever accused of appropriating black culture for profit, as they lived and breathed it. Even Eminem... There are loads more examples in House music scene, which came out of the gay party scene in Chicago and New York, but probably a bit more obscure for most TLWers.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

15 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

I can't respect any viewpoint that regards one group of people as custodians of a particular music genre simply because of the colour of their skin. Human existence is plagued by these arbitrary and ridiculous boundaries.

All the best music gets passed around, absorbed, adapted, reblended and passed around again from one cultural group to another and from one generation to another. That's exactly the way it's supposed to be.  Any attempts to restrict that should be treated as contemptible bullshit.

[Chip Butty]

24 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

I can't respect any viewpoint that regards one group of people as custodians of a particular music genre simply because of the colour of their skin. Human existence is plagued by these arbitrary and ridiculous boundaries.

If Milli Vanilli can be classed as a genre, then they can keep it. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 hours ago, aRdja said:

Here’s the article:

https://medium.com/the-establishment/miley-cyrus-image-makeover-shows-why-black-people-fight-for-their-culture-ada67f9749b5

That's pretty much bollocks, that.  So she went through a phase of doing (her version of) hip hop. Big whoop. Ray Charles released some belting country records; I wouldn't argue that struggling white country singers were somehow left to suffer when he returned to his more familiar stuff.

 

I can't believe I'm siding with Miley fucking Cyrus.

[aRdja]

A funny (if a bit cringey) example of someone trying to gain street cred by talking like an African American. (though she’s an 11 out of 10 looks wise)

 

 

[Numero Veinticinco]

4 minutes ago, aRdja said:

Funny (if a bit cringey) example of someone trying to gain street cred by talking like an African American.

 

Talking like an African American, huh? 

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

14 minutes ago, aRdja said:

There are loads more examples in House music scene, which came out of the gay party scene in Chicago and New York...

... which drew on a combination of Jamaican sound systems and European arthouse synth pop.

 

If anyone cries "cultural appropriation" about music, I defy them to pick the bones out of that.

[aRdja]

5 minutes ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

Talking like an African American, huh? 

 

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You got problem with that homeboy?

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 minute ago, aRdja said:

You got problem with that homeboy?

Erm, yeah. It's actually closer to racism than anything in this thread. Still... it's daft, I was just messing around.