All time Prem 11 - 442

[KevieG]

And also, for me Bale is a far far superior player than Giggs ever was. I was never too worried seeing Giggs line up against us. His best years were when he burst on the scene and was a bit unpredictable but from mid 20s on he just seemed to plateau.

 

 

 

 

[Jairzinho]

28 minutes ago, KevieG said:

And also, for me Bale is a far far superior player than Giggs ever was. I was never too worried seeing Giggs line up against us. His best years were when he burst on the scene and was a bit unpredictable but from mid 20s on he just seemed to plateau.

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, he had two seasons in his whole career where he got into double figures in the league, both before the age of 24.

 

I think Bale is a better footballer, but a worse left winger.

 

You could make a team that doesn't include the seven or eight players in most people's sides here, in a 4-3-3, and they'd probably hammer the 4-4-2 team.

[Jairzinho]

Current Prem 11 - 

 

De Gea

Azpilicueta Alderweireld VVD Robertson

Kante

De Bruyne Silva

Salah Aguero Hazard

 

Something like that anyway, you can argue the toss over a few of them.

 

I think the result against an all time XI would depend a lot on whether we got the sort of reffing we have now or 10/15/20 years ago.

[moof]

Xavi must be a bit blind or daft because scholes isn’t even in the top 10/15 of midfielders over the past 20 or so years

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

1 hour ago, moof said:

Xavi must be a bit blind or daft because scholes isn’t even in the top 10/15 of midfielders over the past 20 or so years

So must I.

[Tony Moanero]

1 hour ago, moof said:

Xavi must be a bit blind or daft because scholes isn’t even in the top 10/15 of midfielders over the past 20 or so years

Negged by accident. 

[The Guest]

4 hours ago, aRdja said:

Take your red tinted glasses off. He was quality. Successfully morphed from a goal scoring AM to a deep-lying Pirlo like midfielder, pulling the strings. But don’t take my word for it... Take Xavi’s! 

 

“Paul Scholes is a role model. For me – and I really mean this – he's the best central midfielder I've seen in the last 15, 20 years.”

Why would I take Xavi’s word for it?  I reckon I’ve watched Scholes literally hundreds and hundreds more times than Xavi did.  I have no idea if Xavi is thick as fuck either or the most intelligent footballer ever and neither do you.  So many former pros talk so much shit I’d rather judge with my own eyes.  The prime example of it is Gary Neville.  This is a guy who played with him for his whole career and then sits there and says that it’s baffing that Scholes was never picked in the base of a midfield 3 for England with Gerrard and Lampard in front of him.  It’s almost like he’s had a lobotomy.  He retired for England probably about 8 years before even Ferguson thought about playing him there and that was because of the players they had around first the team they got away with it.

 

This laughable myth started to develop getting towards the end of his career and it’s blown massively out of control since he retired.  He didn’t get near the top midfielders in the premier league.  He was basically another cog in Ferguson’s teams and one that had no inclination to leave so ended up staying there as midfield was always something Ferguson struggled to judge for his whole career.  He was a very good player obviously but you see these comments more and more.  “He was the complete midfielder, he ran the midfield, he never give the ball away, he didn’t waste possession on Hollywood passes” and it’s all complete bollocks.

 

He came into the United team as a forward  and over time started to get played in the midfield of the best attacking premier league team with very little defensive responsibility and was basically in the team because he was goalscorer.  I wouldn’t say it was exactly like the position Lampard played for Chelsea where he has no defensively responsibility in most games but it wasn’t far off.  He only dropped into the deep lying role really late on in his career and you now see people talk as if this is what he did in his whole career.  He wasn’t trusted in the big game to play there either.  He had to be carried by another ball winner or player to do his running.

 

In every successful side he ever played in he was a minor part.  It’s the reason he never picked up any individual awards and consistently why he was hardly ever selected in teams of the year.  It seems to be the hipster thing to wax lyrical about what a great player he was but it’s a myth.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Fuck i’m A Hipster now.

[The Guest]

1 minute ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Fuck i’m A Hipster now.

You should have realised when you started wearing those suspenders.

[Mark M]

Watching that BBC video I've realised I quite like Wright.

Love the way when the midfield selection came about he started by saying Gerrard and one other cause Stevie could do everything. 

[VladimirIlyich]

7 hours ago, aRdja said:

He was a forward though. Zola like Bergkamp, didn’t score enough goals to be  in the conversation as best ever forwards IMO.

Zola was class and often played as an attacking mid/deep lying forward. Its all just hypothesis anyhow.

[VladimirIlyich]

20 minutes ago, Mark M said:

Watching that BBC video I've realised I quite like Wright.

Love the way when the midfield selection came about he started by saying Gerrard and one other cause Stevie could do everything. 

Wright is usually a div when talking about football but very listenable when speaking about his rise from amateur to professional footballer

 and his experiences in general.

[Ronnie Whelan]

Gk: schmeicheal

Rb: Ivanovic

Cb: vidic

Cb: carvalho

Lb: irwin

Rm: ronaldo

Cm: keane

Cm: gerrard

Lm: bale

Fw: bergkamp

Fw: Henry

 

So many great players left out. Luis, shearer, vieira, scholes, zola and ashley cole can consider themselves unlucky. I actually went with the arsenal front two because they were sublime.

 

 

 

[Grinch]

3 hours ago, VladimirIlyich said:

Zola was class and often played as an attacking mid/deep lying forward. Its all just hypothesis anyhow.

 

That Chelsea side had some very good players too.  Mostly older ones who seen their best days elsewhere.

[Bjornebye]

7 minutes ago, Grinch said:

 

That Chelsea side had some very good players too.  Mostly older ones who seen their best days elsewhere.

Yeah if Dessaily had spent longer in the poem then he would be a shoe in at centre back. Arguably Shevchenko too. 

[Grinch]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

Yeah if Dessaily had spent longer in the poem then he would be a shoe in at centre back. Arguably Shevchenko too. 

 

George Weah, Vialli, Gullit and I'm sure there was more.

[Jairzinho]

5 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Yeah if Dessaily had spent longer in the poem then he would be a shoe in at centre back. Arguably Shevchenko too. 

Seems a strange selection policy that. 

[TheHowieLama]

Agreed -- lets see -- Ruud Gullit or Paul Scholes, hmmm...

[TheHowieLama]

Schmeichel

Ivanovic

Ferdinand

Desailly

Cole

Ronaldo

Gerrard

Gullit

Bale

Suarez

Henry

[Jairzinho]

Is that purely on poetry?

[TheHowieLama]

That and culinary skils

[aRdja]

On 10/19/2018 at 1:26 PM, The Guest said:

Why would I take Xavi’s word for it?  I reckon I’ve watched Scholes literally hundreds and hundreds more times than Xavi did.  I have no idea if Xavi is thick as fuck either or the most intelligent footballer ever and neither do you.  So many former pros talk so much shit I’d rather judge with my own eyes.  The prime example of it is Gary Neville.  This is a guy who played with him for his whole career and then sits there and says that it’s baffing that Scholes was never picked in the base of a midfield 3 for England with Gerrard and Lampard in front of him.  It’s almost like he’s had a lobotomy.  He retired for England probably about 8 years before even Ferguson thought about playing him there and that was because of the players they had around first the team they got away with it.

 

This laughable myth started to develop getting towards the end of his career and it’s blown massively out of control since he retired.  He didn’t get near the top midfielders in the premier league.  He was basically another cog in Ferguson’s teams and one that had no inclination to leave so ended up staying there as midfield was always something Ferguson struggled to judge for his whole career.  He was a very good player obviously but you see these comments more and more.  “He was the complete midfielder, he ran the midfield, he never give the ball away, he didn’t waste possession on Hollywood passes” and it’s all complete bollocks.

 

He came into the United team as a forward  and over time started to get played in the midfield of the best attacking premier league team with very little defensive responsibility and was basically in the team because he was goalscorer.  I wouldn’t say it was exactly like the position Lampard played for Chelsea where he has no defensively responsibility in most games but it wasn’t far off.  He only dropped into the deep lying role really late on in his career and you now see people talk as if this is what he did in his whole career.  He wasn’t trusted in the big game to play there either.  He had to be carried by another ball winner or player to do his running.

 

In every successful side he ever played in he was a minor part.  It’s the reason he never picked up any individual awards and consistently why he was hardly ever selected in teams of the year.  It seems to be the hipster thing to wax lyrical about what a great player he was but it’s a myth.

I agree with you that Scholes wasn’t a complete midfielder. He had very little ability defensively, and got away with some terrible fouls. However he was excellent at what he did i.e. playmaking.

[VladimirIlyich]

Scholes was an excellent player and it's really stupid to claim otherwise. To say he was 'just a cog in the wheel' is also under estimating his true ability. His weaknesses was that he was English and almost all English players have limitations and ergo his loyalty kept him at the same club almost his whole career. They were weaknesses as an individual but as a team player he didn't really need to move as he was very successful anyway.

[Red Dawn]

gk - Schmeichel

rb - rob jones

cb - Rio Ferdinand

cb - Paul McGrath 

lb - Dennis Irwin

rm - Ronaldo

cm - Roy Keane

cm - Stevie Gerrard

lm - Ryan Giggs

Fw - Dennis Bergkamp

St - Alan Shearer

 

If I can justify Rob Jones in there for 3 or 4 seasons then likewise I can justify McGrath over Stam. McGrath was immense for Villa early 90's as he moved towards the end of his career.

Gutted for Jones that the injuries ended his career early. He was on track for greatness despite being in poor Liverpool teams. Neville was a poor mans Rob Jones.

 

 

[The Guest]

6 hours ago, aRdja said:

I agree with you that Scholes wasn’t a complete midfielder. He had very little ability defensively, and got away with some terrible fouls. However he was excellent at what he did i.e. playmaking.

Is he the best midfielder of the past 15/20 years?

 

If you answer no to the above then is he the best midfielder to have played in the premier league era?

 

I’m not questioning that he was a good player.  He clearly was.  I’m questioning this myth that he is the best to have graced the prem and a level above Gerrard as you now hear all over the place but never did when they were both playing.  His ability seems to grow with each passing year since his retirement.  It wasn’t even a conversation when they were both playing.