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Intellectual Dark Web

aRdja

By aRdja,
in GF - General Forum

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Rico1304

Adam Rutherford kicking JPs arse   https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/sep/21/human-instinct-why-we-are-unique

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Babb'sBurstNad

I doubt Chomsky would, given his reading of language. It reduces a person's stance on a given issue to that of a caricature, pigeonholing them, intimating they're only after appearing right-on rather

Strontium
Strontium

A bit like the GF, then.

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aRdja Grand Master

aRdja

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2 hours ago, SasaS said:

 

I don't and I explained that I don't and why I don't, also, what I think he is talking about (from his interviews and other views expressed by people that agree with him on some points) is sexualised atmosphere in the workplace, to which women contribute to by using lipstick, high heals etc (i.e. tools of accentuating your sexuality, as he explained, red lips which simulate sexual arousal etc). So what I think he is saying is, if you don't want a sexualised atmosphere in the workplace, lets all get rid of these tools, men and women. If you don't want to get rid of it, then don't complain if people behave as they think they are being incited to behave.

 

As I sad, I don't agree with him (completely) but I do understand that point of view and also, "sexualised atmosphere" would not mean grabbing someone, physically assaulting, but an atmosphere in which inappropriate comments are made or women are treated as if they are not colleagues of professionals but as potential sexual partners, which is by far the most common complaint in the workplace.  

 

Similarly, if you go out to a nigh club or something, it is widely accepted that in that situation, you are looking  for a sexual partner so it would be hypocritical of you if you are offended if someone approaches you and tries to chat you up.

Chatting someone up at a night club is not sexual harassment. Following said girl around the club, whilst refusing to take no as an answer would be widely seen as harassment. Not sure where you get this sexualised atmosphere business. He was very precise in his interview. Fast-forward to 9m:28s, he said he truly believes that a ‘serious’ woman who doesn’t want to be objected to sexual harassment at work, is being hypocritical if she turns up to work wears make-up. “I don’t see how you could not think that”. It’s disgusting backward stuff.

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SasaS Grand Master

SasaS

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21 minutes ago, viRdjil said:

Chatting someone up at a night club is not sexual harassment. Following said girl around the club, whilst refusing to take no as an answer would be widely seen as harassment. Not sure where you get this sexualised atmosphere business. He was very precise in his interview. Fast-forward to 9m:28s, he said he truly believes that a ‘serious’ woman who doesn’t want to be objected to sexual harassment at work, is being hypocritical if she turns up to work wears make-up. “I don’t see how you could not think that”. It’s disgusting backward stuff.

 

I get this sexualised atmosphere business from the interview... I am starting to get a feeling you are not making the tiniest bit of effort to at least try to understand any of my points.

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aRdja Grand Master

aRdja

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38 minutes ago, SasaS said:

 

I get this sexualised atmosphere business from the interview... I am starting to get a feeling you are not making the tiniest bit of effort to at least try to understand any of my points.

I understand them, I just disagree with them. You keep ignoring the fact that they were specifically talking “sexual harassment” for some reason. I don’t see how “chatting up a girl at a club” has anything to do with it. 

You go to a club, get a few of pints in, then switch to G&T, hit the df, decide whether you want to get high or get laid, if the latter, approach a girl who returns your smile, engage her in a convo, if she doesn’t seem interested, move on. If it’s 3 am, and still no luck, drag your mates back to the flat for some beak and Pro Evo sesh until the sun’s up. Done. It’s really not difficult not to commit sexual harassment. Parklife! 

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SasaS Grand Master

SasaS

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47 minutes ago, viRdjil said:

I understand them, I just disagree with them. You keep ignoring the fact that they were specifically talking “sexual harassment” for some reason. I don’t see how “chatting up a girl at a club” has anything to do with it. 

You go to a club, get a few of pints in, then switch to G&T, hit the df, decide whether you want to get high or get laid, if the latter, approach a girl who returns your smile, engage her in a convo, if she doesn’t seem interested, move on. If it’s 3 am, and still no luck, drag your mates back to the flat for some beak and Pro Evo sesh until the sun’s up. Done. It’s really not difficult not to commit sexual harassment. Parklife! 


Sorry but, what on earth are you talking about?

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SasaS Grand Master

SasaS

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3 hours ago, viRdjil said:

Why do you continually refuse to take him at his word with regards to sexual harassment? When said sexual harassment he meant sexual harassment.

 

 

It's an exercise in futility but one last time, you don't seem to read my posts or have any interest in the points I am trying to make, you just have some vague idea I am not your ideological sojourner so you are firing your salvos in some general direction of me hoping  or assuming that I'm some kind of Peterson's fan boy and am arguing points you need me to argue because you feel you could then easily shoot them down with ammo ideology has provided you.

We started by you stating he is blaming rape victims and being responsible for violence perpetrated by incels (you didn't specify what incidents you had in mind). In the dialogue you have provided and video you have shared (which I think I saw most of or t least controversial chunks when it came out) he doesn't do that. As far as I recall they are discussing the notion of sexual harassment in the workplace, Peterson is trying to drag the interviewer into a discussion of complexity of male-female relations in the workplace, lack of rules, he is trying to give him an example of flirting to which interviewer offers a claim he does not flirt and would not know how to flirt, despite being married (I guess he filled out a form on a computer and received his match). The interviewer is in turn trying do drag Peterson out from his  typical debating practices (say something, step back, stare at the opponent, make him insecure by reductio ad absurdum of his point then say something silly which is difficult to argue etc) and offers him the sentence about hypocrisy of sexual harassment complainants, which Peterson accepts and proceeds with the conditions and explanations  and so on.

From this context it's pretty clear they are talking about rules about unwanted sexual advances, where Peterson makes his assertion about "serious women" (I don't know what that is either) being hypocritical if they come to the workplace basically all tarted up (my interpretation) and than complaining of unwanted sexual advances (which would be the most common type of harassment in the workplace):

I disagreed with him on that, I provided an explanation why, and added that I can understand the underlying logic of that argument and tried to give an example of a difference (as I see it) between different spaces (workplace and a night club) where I think different rules of what would constitute unwanted sexual advances (as the form of harassment I think they are talking about) apply. I sort of agree with Peterson that there are no clear rules, or at least, the rules are constantly changing and that the sexual dynamic and tension between men and women is a complicated thing.

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Numero Veinticinco Grand Master

Numero Veinticinco

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3 hours ago, viRdjil said:

Why do you continually refuse to take him at his word with regards to sexual harassment? When said sexual harassment he meant sexual harassment.

 

 

So now you want him to be taken at his word and that he has said to be precise in his speech, just after dismissing the words he actually said and made out if he had said something about blaming rape victims.

 

 

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Bjornebye Grand Master

Bjornebye

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3 minutes ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

So now you want him to be taken at his word and that he has said to be precise in his speech, just after dismissing the words he actually said and made out if he had said something about blaming rape victims.

 

 

Will you have a fucking day off. 

 

You wouldn't start an argument in a phone box, you'd start arguing with the phone box for just being stood there. 

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