Coutinho’s replacement...

[Evil_Ways]

Doubt Arsenal would entertain it now though. That would be a double blow for their chances of finishing top 4.

[TheHowieLama]

Call me a conspiracy theorist but are we expected to believe that the owners overruled Klopp in the summer and now, despite him having one of his most productive seasons and with a world cup in the summer, they are have changed their minds and given Klopp the final say.

 

They are an investment company, I cannot believe they are giving anyone but themselves a say in the sale of a 150m asset. That's not a dig in any way. I just don't believe, regardless of what is said in public, that Klopp gets a say in a 150m transaction.

 

I think you are wrong and dont understand. They veto'ed in the summer because the offer for the asset was not high enough. It was about 80 m upfront.

 

Once it crossed the threshold of acceptance they let El Kloppo make the call.

[Moo]

I think you are wrong and dont understand. They veto'ed in the summer because the offer for the asset was not high enough. It was about 80 m upfront.

 

Once it crossed the threshold of acceptance they let El Kloppo make the call.

Even if you go along with the "Klopp wanted him out" newspaper stories those same stories have said FSG made a stand in the summer out of principle.

So I agree with the original poster that the idea their principles changed in 4 months is unlikely.

IMO, Coutinho was kept in the summer because the VVD deal fell through, once VVD was done FSG wanted to recoup that outlay with the Coutinho money.

We'll soon see anyway, if we don't use the money this January window with 3 weeks to go I think it'll be pretty obvious who sold Coutinho and why.

[WhiskeyJar]

Even if you go along with the "Klopp wanted him out" newspaper stories those same stories have said FSG made a stand in the summer out of principle.

So I agree with the original poster that the idea their principles changed in 4 months is unlikely.

IMO, Coutinho was kept in the summer because the VVD deal fell through, once VVD was done FSG wanted to recoup that outlay with the Coutinho money.

I honestly don't think that selling Coutinho was a balance sheet act from FSG. If it was we would have had a raging Klopp.

 

Buying VVD and selling Countinho was independent of each other, my personal belief.

[suzy]

Just turned on SSN and they're outside the hospital in Barcelona where Phil is having his medical - really??

[suzy]

While i dont think he would come here over City. I do think he would come here over staying at Arsenal. He witnessed first hand how we bumfucked them twice this season. Yes apart from 5 minutes last game.

 

Or perhaps he'd want to work with Klopp? Or has he seen how Oxlade has come on away from Arsenal?

[Moo]

I honestly don't think that selling Coutinho was a balance sheet act from FSG. If it was we would have had a raging Klopp.

 

Buying VVD and selling Countinho was independent of each other, my personal belief.

Or a Klopp who's used to his best players being sold, and is realistic about the situations in football and conditions at LFC.

[Guest]

Or a Klopp who's used to his best players being sold, and is realistic about the situations in football and conditions at LFC.

If he knew the club would always sell his best players from under him, do you really think he would still be here?

 

The statement from the club is quite significant I think :

 

"Liverpool FC can confirm Philippe Coutinho will be leaving the club after a transfer agreement was reached with FC Barcelona, subject to medical and agreement of personal terms.

 

"The player now has permission to complete the usual formalities to conclude the transfer immediately."

 

No well wishes, no thank you for your service, no good luck in your future career. Perhaps there may be a statement offering these things once it's all confirmed and concluded in which case perhaps the club sold him without the manager's agreement but it looks more likely that his transfer is the result of him wanting to go and doing anything and everything he could to make sure it happened. 

 

Reading between the lines, the club wanted him to stay, as did the manager but he made it impossible to keep him. If the best players don't want to stay, there's not a lot anyone can do about it.

 

Personally I think until the perceived 'worst' players leave the club, the best ones will always be liable to want to ply their trade with 'better' players.

[Pureblood]

No well wishes, no thank you for your service, no good luck in your future career. 

 

"Philippe has made a fantastic contribution to this club over his five years of service and as disappointed as we are he doesn’t want to extend that, the relationship we have for him means with a heavy heart we wish him well."

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/01/06/liverpool-agree-142-million-deal-sell-philippe-coutinho-barcelona/

[Pureblood]

The statement from the club is pure vom. 

 

[Moo]

 

If he knew the club would always sell his best players from under him, do you really think he would still be here?

 

The statement from the club is quite significant I think :

 

"Liverpool FC can confirm Philippe Coutinho will be leaving the club after a transfer agreement was reached with FC Barcelona, subject to medical and agreement of personal terms.

 

"The player now has permission to complete the usual formalities to conclude the transfer immediately."

 

No well wishes, no thank you for your service, no good luck in your future career. Perhaps there may be a statement offering these things once it's all confirmed and concluded in which case perhaps the club sold him without the manager's agreement but it looks more likely that his transfer is the result of him wanting to go and doing anything and everything he could to make sure it happened.

 

Reading between the lines, the club wanted him to stay, as did the manager but he made it impossible to keep him. If the best players don't want to stay, there's not a lot anyone can do about it.

 

Personally I think until the perceived 'worst' players leave the club, the best ones will always be liable to want to ply their trade with 'better' players.

Oh of course Coutinho did everything he could to leave, but we could have just said no, especially in January.

 

Klopp likes a challenge, he sees Liverpool as a challenge and has the confidence in his ability to achieve something despite those challenges and no doubt he'll give it a good go. But he eventually left Dortmund after realising he couldn't take them any further.

[Jose Jones]

Oh of course Coutinho did everything he could to leave, but we could have just said no, especially in January.

 

Klopp likes a challenge, he sees Liverpool as a challenge and has the confidence in his ability to achieve something despite those challenges and no doubt he'll give it a good go. But he eventually left Dortmund after realising he couldn't take them any further.

We obviously reached the point where the money was enough for the owners and Coutinho going on strike again was enough for Klopp.

[JustTosh]

The deal with VVD was made long before the transfer window opened. There’s every reason to believe the Coutinho deal was made before the window opened too. The 6-7 days delay before the official announcement could be for one or more tactical reasons.

It may well be that we have a deal done for the replacement as well, only it’s not been made public news yet.

Lemar? Mahrez? Someone else? Dunno but I’d wait another week before making the conclusion we won’t replace Cou. I think we will. Gut feeling says Mahrez.

[Jose Jones]

I think the OC was the squad replacement before Klopp rejigs the midfield once Keita gets here next season. Don’t really expect us to sign a direct replacement. Maybe a centre forward or more defensive midfielder?

[an tha]

Would like to be proven wrong but I reckon Oxlade-Chamberlain, Keita and VVD are the 'Coutinho money' buys.

[Pureblood]

When Barcelona lost Neymar they immediately went out and bought Ousmane Dembele, and tried as hard as they could to get Coutinho going as far as to get him to strike for the whole of August.  That's how a real big club behaves. 

 

When we lose Coutinho we sit there and go "hmm, we can get through until summer I think". 

[Lee909]

I think the OC was the squad replacement before Klopp rejigs the midfield once Keita gets here next season. Don’t really expect us to sign a direct replacement. Maybe a centre forward or more defensive midfielder?

 

 

Said similar a week or so ago

I can see us moving to either a 4-2-3-1 with a traditional number 10 or dropping Bobby to the 10 and getting another striker in or i could see a 4-3-3 with two number 8 box to box types ahead of a sitting playmaker or defensive shield,whicj would make sense with the Goretzka links. Him and Nabby in front of a deeplying lying midfielder. Still gives us Mane and Salah wide and Firmino up top

[WhiskeyJar]

Oh of course Coutinho did everything he could to leave, but we could have just said no, especially in January.

 

Klopp likes a challenge, he sees Liverpool as a challenge and has the confidence in his ability to achieve something despite those challenges and no doubt he'll give it a good go. But he eventually left Dortmund after realising he couldn't take them any further.

Didn't he say in an interview a few months ago that he still believes he is the man for the job?

 

I think he accepts it; that footballers moving on is part of the game and instead of disrupting the dressing room he would rather sell an unhappy player. He does value camaraderie and that might just be the deciding factor here, despite the qualities Coutinho has.

 

Is it gamble? Absolutely yes but it is also the same gamble if we decided to keep him against his wishes. That dressing room may have become toxic.

[A_S]

We obviously reached the point where the money was enough for the owners and Coutinho going on strike again was enough for Klopp.

Yep. I also wonder if Klopp thinks that Mo's ridiculously smooth transition into this team has somewhat alleviated the reliance on Coutinho for goals.

[Sputnik1]

Early pics of his replacement emerge,

 

[Ne Moe Imya]

When Barcelona lost Neymar they immediately went out and bought Ousmane Dembele, and tried as hard as they could to get Coutinho going as far as to get him to strike for the whole of August.  That's how a real big club behaves. 

 

When we lose Coutinho we sit there and go "hmm, we can get through until summer I think". 

 

Ousmane Dembele is a good player. However, they paid £100m for him, which is ridiculously overpriced.

 

And as for them "trying as hard as they could," isn't that what we're doing? Trying as hard as we can to get either Lemar or Keita early? And when we don't succeed, will you say "well, at least we tried as hard as we could" like Barca did?

 

I honestly can't believe how knee-jerk our fanbase has become. Remember how our owners pushed hard for the Andy Carroll move when they had the Torres money in hand and knew how bad the PR would be if they didn't spend it? That worked out really well, no?

 

The only person to blame here is Phil. He wanted out so badly that Klopp, who must know of the risk this is to our CL qualification and even CL campaign, said it was better for him to leave now than to wait until the summer. He wanted out so badly that he paid a reported £12m of HIS OWN MONEY back to Liverpool to help us agree a fee. He must have been absolutely toxic in the dressing room, otherwise there's no way I can see Klopp sanctioning this move.

 

So yeah, we're in a bad situation. But it's not the owners' fault - they're just letting Klopp call the shots when it comes to foolball issues rather than forcing him to keep a player he doesn't want so their image looks better to the fans. It's not really Klopp's fault if he thinks we're better off without a disruptive presence in the dressing room, even if he is one of our best players. And it's not Monaco's or Leipzig's fault for not wanting to sell their best players in January, regardless of the price.

 

It's a bad situation that's come about because Barca are a club of entitled wankers who used their "magical" allure to cause one of our best players, a player who we had rescued at the nadir of his career, to act so reprehensibly that our manager wants shut of him at the possible cost of CL qualification.

 

It sucks, but instead of begging for a knee-jerk reaction, I'm happy for the club to take a step back. In the end, long-term, this can be a good thing. That amount of money should allow us to buy a top goalkeeper, a top DM and a top replacement for Coutinho. It really should. 

 

But that will never happen if we rush over to Monaco and say "please bend us over and have at us, because we need to make a statement for the fans who are upset."

[Elite]

based on nothing at all. Klopp wanted him out.

Did he tell you that personally?

[stringvest]

Did he tell you that personally?

No, but Dave’s sources did

[Jose Jones]

Would like to be proven wrong but I reckon Oxlade-Chamberlain, Keita and VVD are the 'Coutinho money' buys.

Not all of them, but definitely a chunk.

FSG will not be spending their own money or putting the club in debt to finance signings.

I think we had “budgeted” up to 50 million for Virgil in the summer, so were relatively happy to then kick it up to 75 as we knew Coutinho was going to bring in a massive wedge at some point.

 

The last second opportunistic OC signing for more than he really should have gone for due to his contract, was again made knowing Coutinho was probably gone within 12 months.

[an tha]

That amount of money should allow us to buy a top goalkeeper, a top DM and a top replacement for Coutinho. It really should.

What about if that money has already been spent in the owners minds - namely on Oxlade, VVD and Keita?

 

And save for the usual modest spend in the summer that is as much as we see in terms of squad investment/reshaping?