Transgender stuff - what's going on?

[s(k)aturation]

No worries.

Any time you have an inkling that your opinion may be tending towards reactionary old crank unsupported by evidence, sense or empathy just drop me a line.

 

 

These are some comments about and quotes from the founder of the Safe Schools program:

 

 

Up to half of young people were likely to be same-sex-attracted, Safe Schools creator Roz Ward claimed at a recent forum where she spoke in defence­ of the controversial program...

Ms Ward, who managed the Safe Schools Coalition Victoria until the state government took it over in March, has been on an unofficial roadshow promoting the program regardless...

Speaking at a Victoria University event organised for Pride Week last month, Ms Ward ... addressed her own “coming­ out” as a 16-year-old before talking about how the Safe Schools program aimed to challenge “heteronormativity”.

According to Ms Ward, the often-cited claim that 10 per cent of people were likely to be attracted to their own sex — a figure Safe School’s materials also relied upon — was a “joke”. “It’s more like 40-50 per cent of young people who are not ­exclusively attracted to the opposit­e sex,” she said. “That’s how fluid sexuality is headed.”

 

 

Some people - everyday parents of kids at primary school and ordinary people in communities (and not just a handful of old white politicians who think aboriginals are dole bludgers and should get a job) - were/have been concerned about some of the contentions and motivations of this woman and the program she helped create. I don't think any legitimate concerns were against teaching tolerance, anti-bullying or "it's OK to be different"... I think the concerns were more around her reasonably radical opinion that up to 50% of young people might have gay leanings and that this was the way things are "headed". Some people, not unreasonably I think, question weather Ward's position blurred the line between "educating" and "campaigning" or, dare I put it another way, having an agenda.

 

​For the record, I have a 9-year-old son and a 6-year-old daughter and I don't give a flying fuck whether they are/will be straight, gay or somewhere in between... as long as they have fun, are safe and hopefully find happiness.

 

However, I have concerns - not unreasonably I think - with Ward's contentions and whether they might perhaps have compromised her impartiality as an educator. There were public debates and discourse about this in the media - on the ABC's Q&A among other places. The issue hasn't just been raised and played out among a few old white male politicians.

 

I don't consider myself a bigot or a homophobe, and I don't think other people that might have had queries about Roz Ward's thinking were necessarily bigots or homophobes either.

 

Now usually, I'm happy to throw myself at the mercy of the Jose Jones tribunal for indiscretions in the "reactionary old crank" department - and I do apologise for any earlier post unsupported by evidence - but I think I'll stick to my guns on this one if it's OK with you, JJ.

And I'm happy to live with whatever labels might be inevitably thrown at me because of it.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

These are some comments about and quotes from the founder of the Safe Schools program:

 

 

  Up to half of young people were likely to be same-sex-attracted, Safe Schools creator Roz Ward claimed at a recent forum where she spoke in defence­ of the controversial program...

Ms Ward, who managed the Safe Schools Coalition Victoria until the state government took it over in March, has been on an unofficial roadshow promoting the program regardless...

Speaking at a Victoria University event organised for Pride Week last month, Ms Ward ... addressed her own “coming­ out” as a 16-year-old before talking about how the Safe Schools program aimed to challenge “heteronormativity”.

According to Ms Ward, the often-cited claim that 10 per cent of people were likely to be attracted to their own sex — a figure Safe School’s materials also relied upon — was a “joke”. “It’s more like 40-50 per cent of young people who are not ­exclusively attracted to the opposit­e sex,” she said. “That’s how fluid sexuality is headed.”

 

 

Some people - everyday parents of kids at primary school and ordinary people in communities (and not just a handful of old white politicians who think aboriginals are dole bludgers and should get a job) - were/have been concerned about some of the contentions and motivations of this woman and the program she helped create. I don't think any legitimate concerns were against teaching tolerance, anti-bullying or "it's OK to be different"... I think the concerns were more around her reasonably radical opinion that up to 50% of young people might have gay leanings and that this was the way things are "headed". Some people, not unreasonably I think, question weather Ward's position blurred the line between "educating" and "campaigning" or, dare I put it another way, having an agenda.

 

​For the record, I have a 9-year-old son and a 6-year-old daughter and I don't give a flying fuck whether they are/will be straight, gay or somewhere in between... as long as they have fun, are safe and hopefully find happiness.

 

However, I have concerns - not unreasonably I think - with Ward's contentions and whether they might perhaps have compromised her impartiality as an educator. There were public debates and discourse about this in the media - on the ABC's Q&A among other places. The issue hasn't just been raised and played out among a few old white male politicians.

 

I don't consider myself a bigot or a homophobe, and I don't think other people that might have had queries about Roz Ward's thinking were necessarily bigots or homophobes either.

 

Now usually, I'm happy to throw myself at the mercy of the Jose Jones tribunal for indiscretions in the "reactionary old crank" department - and I do apologise for any earlier post unsupported by evidence - but I think I'll stick to my guns on this one if it's OK with you, JJ.

And I'm happy to live with whatever labels might be inevitably thrown at me because of it.

 

Logic would suggest that given the way the world still looks down on those that don't fit the norm, that the widely accepted figure of 10% is still on the low side. Added to that, she's opened the definition up considerably with "of young people who are not ­exclusively attracted" and it doesn't seem like the most ridiculous claim. Maybe on the high side, but only time will tell.

 

At the end of the day no one is forcing anyone to fuck someone they don't want to. It's about accepting the truth, that there are 7 billion people on this planet and none of them deserve abuse, exclusion or mistreatment because of who they are attracted to. If they aren't harming anyone, where is the problem?

[s(k)aturation]

Logic would suggest that given the way the world still looks down on those that don't fit the norm, that the widely accepted figure of 10% is still on the low side. Added to that, she's opened the definition up considerably with "of young people who are not ­exclusively attracted" and it doesn't seem like the most ridiculous claim. Maybe on the high side, but only time will tell.

 

 

Indeed.

I was merely pointing out that it courted controversy - and that it wasn't just intolerant bigoted cunts who took issue with it.

[Karl_b]

Gender identity and, related, the concept of masculinity are important topics. I wonder if a lot of the bad feeling towards the LGBTQ community comes from people who, consciously or not, fear the demise of traditional masculinity? As stereotypical gender roles change and, subsequently, the very idea of gender can also change then it represents a huge shift in a patriarchal society, something many men will find uneasy.

 

Mostly I find myself wondering why people care so much about what other people do and why we're so keen to throw up barriers between people through identity.

[s(k)aturation]

At the end of the day no one is forcing anyone to fuck someone they don't want to. It's about accepting the truth, that there are 7 billion people on this planet and none of them deserve abuse, exclusion or mistreatment because of who they are attracted to. If they aren't harming anyone, where is the problem?

 

 

And indeed, again.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Indeed.

I was merely pointing out that it courted controversy - and that it wasn't just intolerant bigoted cunts who took issue with it.

 

Fair enough.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

That story reminded me of Lucy Meadows, the transgender teacher who killed herself after Richard Littlejohn led a media mob after her. He reckons he was just worried about the kids being "confused" too.

 

Is there a more hateful sack of fucking shit still heaving in the world? He's a cretin and I volunteer as tribute to beat him with a lead pipe, so he can no longer spread his hate.

 

"McDonalds serving HALAL beef? What next? Compulsory BURKAS FOR YOUR CAT?!?! Hmmmm?"

 

Fuck up you guaranteed nonce.

[VladimirIlyich]

Did you hear those 2 lumps who had taken their child out of school because he was 'confused' when another child had come into school sometimes dressed in trousers and sometimes in a skirt?

 

Never thought of getting him to talk about his confusion and trying to provide assurance and a simple age appropriate explanation rather than go along with your idea of home schooling him because you can't accept other people's difference.

 

Having said that I am definitely with those who have questioned making an 'issue' out a six year old expressing thoughts that do not match conforming stereotypes.

If a 6 year old is going into school in a skirt and is a 'boy' then this is because their parents/guardians are dressing them that way,surely?

[Rico1304]

Common sense has to apply. If a lad wants to wear a dress let him, but don't automatically assume he wants to wear one everyday and call him a girl. After all if he wanted to be dress as a soldier you wouldn't sign him up for the army.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

If a 6 year old is going into school in a skirt and is a 'boy' then this is because their parents/guardians are allowing them to dress that way,surely?

[VladimirIlyich]

 

If a 6 year old is going into school in a skirt and is a 'boy' then this is because their parents/guardians are allowing them to dress that way,surely?

Slip of the pen. They ARE dressing them that way I mean. Do any 6 year old 'boys' ask to go to school in a dress?

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Slip of the pen. They ARE dressing them that way I mean. Do any 6 year old 'boys' ask to go to school in a dress?

 

I assume this one did. Are you suggesting the parents are forcing their 'boy' to wear dresses to school against their will?

[Dr Arthur De Sabre]

I've worked with a couple of people who were transgender - first was a bit of an unctuous, affected prick when he worked with us - a few staff knew he was transgender before he left, I had no idea and just walked past him in the street and was a bit baffled, that I knew the face but couldn't fit it with the fishnet tights and trench coat that were accompanying it.

 

Second person was on my team and I had to manage them whilst they were going through the initial outage, very difficult, to be fair most people in the org were pretty sound about it (publicly), but it was a difficult time with suicide attempts, hospital admissions, work was very much on the back burner for them to deal with. eventually left the company for a clean start in nursing, proper fucking head fuck though, but I tried to deal with it via saying up front - yer a mate, and am gonna support yer, but I will likely drop a few bollocks along the way (pun intended), when you are speaking to people on the phone you kind of get used to that person being of one gender and addressing them as such. to be fair she dealt with the whole situation well, and with humour where possible, but fuck me the effect it had on her / her family etc was pretty heavy.

[Rico1304]

We had a woman in Manchester office who transitioned from a man in the late 90's. The company where great and at her request moved her to another office for a fresh start. Unfortunately that office was Shaw in Oldham. Think The Bronx with flat caps.

[lifetime fan]

Had my aunt on the phone Sunday dinner time - my cousins wife went away for the weekend last week.

 

She came back and told Liam she was leaving him, wanted a divorce and wanted to become a man.

[Bobby Hundreds]

Did she go to the isle of man.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Did she go to the isle of man.

[Redder Lurtz]

Not bothered either way what people want to do with their genders or their sexuality. The "news" story that annoyed me, though, was the one accompanied by the headline "Man Gives Birth" after a woman who'd legally reassigned her gender from female to male had a baby. Man did not give birth; she had a baby because she is a woman. Physics cares not one jot about your legally defined gender.

 

Other than media sensationalism none of the gender related stuff bothers me, live and let live. Unless you're 'funneee' of course, in which case you can fuck off and die.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Common sense has to apply. If a lad wants to wear a dress let him, but don't automatically assume he wants to wear one everyday and call him a girl. After all if he wanted to be dress as a soldier you wouldn't sign him up for the army.

Are you Paul Hollywood ?

[Josef Svejk]

Didn't we have our very own transsexual on this forum? Nantwich-something-or-other?

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Had my aunt on the phone Sunday dinner time - my cousins wife went away for the weekend last week.

She came back and told Liam she was leaving him, wanted a divorce and wanted to become a man.

She probably flew Air Transat.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Didn't we have our very own transsexual on this forum? Nantwich-something-or-other?

 

Fuuuunnneee chased him out of town

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Had my aunt on the phone Sunday dinner time - my cousins wife went away for the weekend last week.

 

She came back and told Liam she was leaving him, wanted a divorce and wanted to become a man.

 

It takes balls to make that decision.

[Fowlers God]

Don’t oppress me much-

Alright shania Twain

[TheHowieLama]

Skirts>Kilts