Transgender stuff - what's going on?

[Paulie Dangerously]

6 hours ago, Section_31 said:

I thought it was the other way around? That she was probably trying not to offend men who transitioned and can't have kids because they don't have the plumbing, so there's "women" which anyone can be or "birthing people" who only people who give birth can be. But they too can be men if they transition, I think. 

 

It's all bollocks anyway. We have always been at war with Erasure.

 

Nice

[Rico1304]

Seems like a sensible solution to the sporting issue. 
 

 

[SasaS]

59 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

Seems like a sensible solution to the sporting issue. 
 

 

Men's track and field is in a way already a non-gender category. Only women's sport is gender /sex protected. So they can already compete with men.

[Rico1304]

11 minutes ago, SasaS said:

Men's track and field is in a way already a non-gender category. Only women's sport is gender /sex protected. So they can already compete with men.

Believe me, I know that.  But if this is a way of keeping women’s sports for women and accommodating anyone who doesn’t feel comfortable in men’s sports it seems sensible.  Obviously until the TW win everything and then the non-binary people get sick of losing. 

[cloggypop]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/crime/alabama-bank-robbery-plastic-surgery-b1846310.html?utm_content=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1620837051

[Bjornebye]

 

 

Fuck off. 

[redheart]

8 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

 

 

Fuck off. 

 

I hope that the next announcement started with "Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen and boys and girls...and also jumped up little shitehawks who think that the world revolves them..."

[Rico1304]

8 minutes ago, redheart said:

 

I hope that the next announcement started with "Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen and boys and girls...and also jumped up little shitehawks who think that the world revolves them..."

As ever, someone’s been through his tweets and found him using the same phrase.  
 

Im a bit surprised no one has posted the clip of the 2 yr old kid who’s parents are convinced he’s trans. I mean 2 yr olds are completely capable of making that choice right?  

[Numero Veinticinco]

48 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

 

 

Fuck off. 

‘Stop being a cunt and get on the fucking train, mate’ would have been the response when I was growing up. 

[Bjornebye]

7 minutes ago, Numero said:

‘Stop being a cunt and get on the fucking train, mate’ would have been the response when I was growing up. 

I’m all for people bumming each other or whatever they want I’m not arsed but that’s just bollocks and the poor announcer who was just being a happy camper will have had a word in his ear because some jumped up attention seeking grass bag decided his feelings are more important than the rest of the world. Imagine being a sad little me me me grass like that. 

[Section_31]

I must have missed all the non binary Orca whales, seagulls and fucking ants. Attention-seeking shite. 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Section_31 said:

I must have missed all the non binary Orca whales, seagulls and fucking ants. Attention-seeking shite. 

The seagulls in town identify as Hawkmen to be fair mate 

[Numero Veinticinco]

11 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

I’m all for people bumming each other or whatever they want I’m not arsed but that’s just bollocks and the poor announcer who was just being a happy camper will have had a word in his ear because some jumped up attention seeking grass bag decided his feelings are more important than the rest of the world. Imagine being a sad little me me me grass like that. 

I don’t even have an issue with people being gender non-binary if we accept that gender norms are socially created (which some might not) and that they’re different from biological sex. I just g go ave an issue with him being a complete cunt and wanting either them to change it to a generic gender pronoun so that the 99% are overridden, or added some nonsense on just for their own happiness. Get the fuck over yourselves, dickheads. Your whims just aren’t that important. 

[johnsusername]

That statement from the LNER is a shit out as well. Should have just said 'we're sorry you were offended Laurence.' and left it there. Kowtowing to attention seeking cunts gets no-one nowhere.

 

 

 

[Mudface]

Laurence is an RMT rep and works on the railways. He doesn't look exactly non-binary in the pics on his Instagram, the beard and 'tache kind of makes me think he's a man, like. He's also a hypocritical, virtue-signalling wanker-

 

Edit- this is a good thread as well.

 

 

 

 

[Section_31]

9 minutes ago, Numero said:

I don’t even have an issue with people being gender non-binary if we accept that gender norms are socially created (which some might not) and that they’re different from biological sex. I just g go ave an issue with him being a complete cunt and wanting either them to change it to a generic gender pronoun so that the 99% are overridden, or added some nonsense on just for their own happiness. Get the fuck over yourselves, dickheads. Your whims just aren’t that important. 

Can of worms etc but he/she is used to denote sex IMO, not gender. You're not called a bloke because you feel like you're a bloke and your dad bought you an action man for Christmas, you're called a bloke because you've got a cock.

[sh#t waffle]

Generally find it quite difficult to get too worked up about this stuff, but Laurence is clearly a bit of a twat. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Can of worms etc but he/she is used to denote sex IMO, not gender. You're not called a bloke because you feel like you're a bloke and your dad bought you an action man for Christmas, you're called a bloke because you've got a cock.

That is certainly how we would have seen things as normal for most of our lives. I generally still see things like that, but I think that female and male are biological sex classifications, then other gender based terms that are more commonly applied to peopled the male sex (man, he, dude, bloke, etc) and female sex (women, girl, chick, lass, etc) can be fucked around with to placate people on the fringes if it makes them feel better. If we must. Human biology is a strange thing and we all start out female at the very early stages of creation (well, kinda. It’s more accurate to say prior to sexual differentiation only the X gene expresses. But as far as my point goes, it’ll do) so I’m open to the ‘feel like you’re in the wrong body’ stuff. But let’s be honest here, the people who genuinely are born male and feel, look, and act very feminine, then want to transition probably have the support of most people on here. It’s actually seemingly gone well beyond that now, with the long held trends reversed with lots of young girls wanting to transition - a massive boom - and I think it’s social media, YouTube, and friends groups that are the cause. Then there’s twats like the bearded fella, Laurence, who is probably just a gay guy being a twat. There’s so much celebration and making people feel ‘special’ about this ‘coming out party’ culture that people who don’t feel special might well be drawn to it. Whatever it is, it needs dealing with because it has the potential to be quite dangerous for those transitioning. We can also deal with it without resorting to being twats about it and resorting to only talking about weirdo kiddy fiddlers and rapists trying to play the system. It’s a wider issue, and we should probably not reduce it to bizarre edge cases that would really harm people if you made laws and judgements based on those. 
 

There’s a lot that needs sorting about this issue. Thankfully we have a sensible crew in government that I’m sure will not resort to popularism. 
 

Hmmn. 
 

[Bjornebye]

He’s actually doing more damage than good without realising. Look at me me me. Wonder what sort of porn he watches?

[TheDrowningMan]

 

41 minutes ago, Numero said:

That is certainly how we would have seen things as normal for most of our lives. I generally still see things like that, but I think that female and male are biological sex classifications, then other gender based terms that are more commonly applied to peopled the male sex (man, he, dude, bloke, etc) and female sex (women, girl, chick, lass, etc) can be fucked around with to placate people on the fringes if it makes them feel better. If we must. Human biology is a strange thing and we all start out female at the very early stages of creation (well, kinda. It’s more accurate to say prior to sexual differentiation only the X gene expresses. But as far as my point goes, it’ll do) so I’m open to the ‘feel like you’re in the wrong body’ stuff. But let’s be honest here, the people who genuinely are born male and feel, look, and act very feminine, then want to transition probably have the support of most people on here. It’s actually seemingly gone well beyond that now, with the long held trends reversed with lots of young girls wanting to transition - a massive boom - and I think it’s social media, YouTube, and friends groups that are the cause. Then there’s twats like the bearded fella, Laurence, who is probably just a gay guy being a twat. There’s so much celebration and making people feel ‘special’ about this ‘coming out party’ culture that people who don’t feel special might well be drawn to it. Whatever it is, it needs dealing with because it has the potential to be quite dangerous for those transitioning. We can also deal with it without resorting to being twats about it and resorting to only talking about weirdo kiddy fiddlers and rapists trying to play the system. It’s a wider issue, and we should probably not reduce it to bizarre edge cases that would really harm people if you made laws and judgements based on those. 
 

There’s a lot that needs sorting about this issue. Thankfully we have a sensible crew in government that I’m sure will not resort to popularism. 
 

Hmmn. 
 

 

One of my kids found herself in this rabbit hole during lockdown. I think it was a combination of puberty hitting and the consumption of more social media than usual, because there was never a hint of unhappiness or dysphoria beforehand. For what it’s worth, even before that, when she wanted to do nothing but dress up in the most outlandish dresses and love all things girly my partner had a suspicion she might turn out to be gay and, lo and behold, that seems to be the case.
 

On chatting to her, it seems to stem from disillusionment with having to feel like shit and bleed every month as well as finding being mostly shut away for over a year really hard to cope with. It has really opened my eyes to how influential peer groups - even remote ones you only see through a screen - can be. When you’re already disaffected and not really interested in being a stereotypical boy, girl, man or woman, a movement of people who’re lauded as very special might seem quite appealing, with the irony being that it then becomes another stereotype. Not this, not that, probably not this so you must be this!
 

I don’t doubt that gender dysphoria is a very real and cruel thing that afflicts some people, but there’s been a conflation with the idea that if you don’t fit into one of society's little boxes you must be this thing from one of the other ones. There are also those whose kink has become their identity - I’m not talking solely about the really dubious (and I assume very, very rare) sort who might be angling for access to vulnerable people but people who we are supposed to believe are incontrovertibly female and express that solely through 18-rated Twitter accounts and anime avatars, 

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, TheDrowningMan said:

 

 

One of my kids found herself in this rabbit hole during lockdown. I think it was a combination of puberty hitting and the consumption of more social media than usual, because there was never a hint of unhappiness or dysphoria beforehand. For what it’s worth, even before that, when she wanted to do nothing but dress up in the most outlandish dresses and love all things girly my partner had a suspicion she might turn out to be gay and, lo and behold, that seems to be the case.
 

On chatting to her, it seems to stem from disillusionment with having to feel like shit and bleed every month as well as finding being mostly shut away for over a year really hard to cope with. It has really opened my eyes to how influential peer groups - even remote ones you only see through a screen - can be. When you’re already disaffected and not really interested in the pre-ticked boxes, a movement of people who’re lauded as very special might seem quite appealing, with the irony being that it then becomes another pre-ticked box. Not this, not that, probably not this so you must be this!
 

I don’t doubt that gender dysphoria is a very real and cruel thing that afflicts some people, but there’s been a conflation with the idea that if you don’t fit into one of society's little boxes you must be this thing from one of its other ones. There are also people whose kink has become their identity - I’m not talking solely about the really dubious (and I assume very, very rare) sort who might be angling to access to vulnerable people but people who we are supposed to believe are incontrovertibly female express that solely through 18-rate Twitter accounts and anime avatars, 

Yeah, that’s not uncommon at all at the moment mate. There was a study released recently about it, I can remember which podcast I heard it on, but the woman who did the study was interviewed. It might have been the Michael Shermer show (edit: yes, it is. Episode 160. Abigail Shrier). I recommend a listen to that. It’s very enlightening. 

[Pidge]

Yeah, I think it's an example of how people looking for answers will find one.

[TheDrowningMan]

23 minutes ago, Numero said:

Yeah, that’s not uncommon at all at the moment mate. There was a study released recently about it, I can remember which podcast I heard it on, but the woman who did the study was interviewed. It might have been the Michael Shermer show (edit: yes, it is. Episode 160. Abigail Shrier). I recommend a listen to that. It’s very enlightening. 

Thanks, will have to give it a listen.
 

It's a tough subject for me, because I’ve always been at pains to ensure people, regardless of identity, orientation or whatever are treated in a dignified, respectful and equal manner. I just see a radical and, I think, quite careless simplification on this topic and I think a lot of genuinely kind, well-meaning people are among them. I’m not going to address an adult trans-woman as anything other than she or her, but at the same time I don’t think anyone's default response to their five year old son wearing dresses and having camp affectations should be that they’ve probably got a daughter.

 

I will say there’s a certain uncomfortable irony in knowing that because I chose to dig a bit deeper and not just declare that my daughter is now my son (for the record, at no point was I dismissive or derogatory; she'll find her truth, but it must be hers and not social media's) quite a few people on the same end of the political spectrum as I’ve been for more or less my entire life would love to get me sacked from my job and end up blacklisted in perpetuity.

[Pidge]

49 minutes ago, TheDrowningMan said:

Thanks, will have to give it a listen.
 

It's a tough subject for me, because I’ve always been at pains to ensure people, regardless of identity, orientation or whatever are treated in a dignified, respectful and equal manner. I just see a radical and, I think, quite careless simplification on this topic and I think a lot of genuinely kind, well-meaning people are among them. I’m not going to address an adult trans-woman as anything other than she or her, but at the same time I don’t think anyone's default response to their five year old son wearing dresses and having camp affectations should be that they’ve probably got a daughter.

 

I will say there’s a certain uncomfortable irony in knowing that because I chose to dig a bit deeper and not just declare that my daughter is now my son (for the record, at no point was I dismissive or derogatory; she'll find her truth, but it must be hers and not social media's) quite a few people on the same end of the political spectrum as I’ve been for more or less my entire life would love to get me sacked from my job and end up blacklisted in perpetuity.

It's sounds as though you've taken the right approach, listened to her and tried to help consider her feelings without driving an extreme answer one way or another. Not many more dignified or respectful things you could do as a parent and struggle to think many people would really object to that (other than those projecting their own issues).

[johnsusername]