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Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?


Sugar Ape
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Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?  

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  1. 1. Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?



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But the Tories, but Trump, but this, but that. A lot of the left are just past the point of giving a fuck about Labour's current direction because this is all that happens. Centrists/centre-right/right wingers band together with the elites and the media to stop any meaningful change, then the left become scapegoats if the right win.

 

And the centrists that helped cause so much of this get a free pass apparently.

 

Corbyn was forced out after years of lies and it was clear that democracy in this country had about gone with the levels of crap going on in the last election. But no, it's still not enough. We want Corbyn suspended. Then he gets back in and no, it's still not enough, he can't be accepted into the party properly.

 

Just forget about us working with the establishment and spending years lying, scheming and using propaganda removing your leader, look at the Tories.

 

The general public seem to have the problem with critical thinking too because if they didn't they wouldn't have bought into the shit that brought Corbyn down in the first place. Forget that though, blame the left. And forget that this is exactly in line with what the worst scum in this country want : the left being scapegoated because they threaten the wealth of the rich, and they threaten the elites ability to wage war and profit from it. This is why Corbyn is no longer leader. Not some antisemitism bullshit.

 

At this point a lot of the left might be happy with the entire Labour Party coming crashing down so we can start again from scratch with something else. And I don't blame anyone that thinks like that one bit at this point.


And Starmer supporters can whine and moan for the next few years if it all goes to shit, but if he had to put up with what Corbyn had done they'd soon understand. But he's a Sir, and he is or was a Trilateral member, he's one of theirs. He'll never have to face what Corbyn did and the left knows that.

 

But the Tories! A lot of the youth of this country are left wing aren't they? Didn't one election map show that the country would be red if it was younger people voting only? If so, keep poking that hornet's nest I suppose, and as the years pass maybe the schemes of so many idiot Labour MP's really will come crashing down and we'll have a proper left wing party instead.

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8 hours ago, Gnasher said:

I don't think its "ballsy" at all. Its cowardly and shows the leader of the labour party afraid of certain elements in and out of the party.

Interesting. I think letting all this just fester would have been the cowardly thing to do. If he was scared of them he would have placated them. I think it’s brave to stand up to them. They’re making threats, and he inherited a crisis of their making, now they’re pissed off he’s cleaning it up. Maybe RP is right, let the split happen and see how scary the Corbynites really are. 

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7 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

But the Tories, but Trump, but this, but that. A lot of the left are just past the point of giving a fuck about Labour's current direction because this is all that happens. Centrists/centre-right/right wingers band together with the elites and the media to stop any meaningful change, then the left become scapegoats if the right win.

 

And the centrists that helped cause so much of this get a free pass apparently.

 

Corbyn was forced out after years of lies and it was clear that democracy in this country had about gone with the levels of crap going on in the last election. But no, it's still not enough. We want Corbyn suspended. Then he gets back in and no, it's still not enough, he can't be accepted into the party properly.

 

Just forget about us working with the establishment and spending years lying, scheming and using propaganda removing your leader, look at the Tories.

 

The general public seem to have the problem with critical thinking too because if they didn't they wouldn't have bought into the shit that brought Corbyn down in the first place. Forget that though, blame the left. And forget that this is exactly in line with what the worst scum in this country want : the left being scapegoated because they threaten the wealth of the rich, and they threaten the elites ability to wage war and profit from it. This is why Corbyn is no longer leader. Not some antisemitism bullshit.

 

At this point a lot of the left might be happy with the entire Labour Party coming crashing down so we can start again from scratch with something else. And I don't blame anyone that thinks like that one bit at this point.


And Starmer supporters can whine and moan for the next few years if it all goes to shit, but if he had to put up with what Corbyn had done they'd soon understand. But he's a Sir, and he is or was a Trilateral member, he's one of theirs. He'll never have to face what Corbyn did and the left knows that.

 

But the Tories! A lot of the youth of this country are left wing aren't they? Didn't one election map show that the country would be red if it was younger people voting only? If so, keep poking that hornet's nest I suppose, and as the years pass maybe the schemes of so many idiot Labour MP's really will come crashing down and we'll have a proper left wing party instead.


The critical thinking part would be to recognise the enemy hasn’t changed, only the strategy.

 

‘They’ don’t want a Labour government, it’s bad for business, so ‘they’ll’ do whatever, to whoever, to maintain the hegemony.

 

Breaking that s should be the only objective. 
 

That’s it, that’s thinking critically.

 

No amount of party bullshit should obscure that, but a pretty good fucking job is being done of that.

 

PS Starmers ‘pledges’ aren’t too dissimilar to Corbyn’s, but nobody’s interested as he’s not ‘our man’

 

Fucking grow up.

 

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All these labels piss me off, what the fuck is a 'centrist' anyway? 

 

"Oooh you're a centrist and an enemy of progress."

 

Tell you what a centrist is. Someone who doesn't give a toss about politics and certainly can't be arsed arguing about it, cares about their own job, house and family and couldn't give a fuck about Venezuela. I.e, the vast majority of the population.

 

It doesn't make you a banker, or a fascist, or a cunt. 

 

Oooh look at me I've got a Palestinian flag on my profile and I play songs about Thatcher on my ukulele, I'm a better human being than you. 

 

Fuck, right, off.

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As for all this unity stuff, it’s one man. If unity means giving in to one man otherwise his followers leave, then the way to unify the party is to remove the venom. Of course, there’s absolutely no onus of the Corbynite twats to do anything towards unity, just as it wasn’t when he had half a decade to unify they party. It’s always somebody else’s fault. Their version of the left, the ‘support Corbyn or you’re not a lefties’ left, is rotten, it’s Trump-supporter blinkered, and it’s doesn’t represent me. I’m left wing because I believe in left wing policies. My belief in left wing policies doesn’t mean I have to back a career politician who drove Labour into the ground. You’re treating it as if it’s a fucking sports team. Twats. 

 

How the fuck can you unify the party without dealing with the biggest cause of disunity? 

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3 minutes ago, Bruce Spanner said:


The critical thinking part would be to recognise the enemy hasn’t changed, only the strategy.

 

‘They’ don’t want a Labour government, it’s bad for business, so ‘they’ll’ do whatever, to whoever, to maintain the hegemony.

 

Breaking that s should be the only objective. 
 

That’s it, that’s thinking critically.

 

No amount of party bullshit should obscure that, but a pretty good fucking job is being done of that.

 

PS Starmers ‘pledges’ aren’t too dissimilar to Corbyn’s, but nobody’s interested as he’s not ‘our man’

 

Fucking grow up.

 

 

The critical thinking part would be to recognise that Corbyn could be in power now if the centrists and centre-right hadn't helped bring him down, chicken coup Starmer should know that only too well. So maybe for a lot of the left the answer is : fuck the current strategy.

 

Starmer will only be accepted because he offers no meaningful change.

 

And maybe critical thinking is knowing that Starmer's 10 pledges are just some writing with little backing it up. Maybe critical thinking is knowing that a trilateral guy is never going to "support common ownership of rail, mail, energy and water" enough to make that happen if he wins an election. Because that's not want big business wants.

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7 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

All these labels piss me off, what the fuck is a 'centrist' anyway? 

 

"Oooh you're a centrist and an enemy of progress."

 

Tell you what a centrist is. Someone who doesn't give a toss about politics and certainly can't be arsed arguing about it, cares about their own job, house and family and couldn't give a fuck about Venezuela. I.e, the vast majority of the population.

 

It doesn't make you a banker, or a fascist, or a cunt. 

 

Oooh look at me I've got a Palestinian flag on my profile and I play songs about Thatcher on my ukulele, I'm a better human being than you. 

 

Fuck, right, off.

 

What the fuck is a leftist anyway?

 

And centrists can keep not giving a fuck about others countries being destroyed, when refugees and migrants pour into their own countries though and the right takes power maybe they can fuck right off too.

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Corbyn made more effort in four years to unite the party than all of the other leaders had in the previous 33 years.Not sure how that syncs with the 'left wingers are the problem' narrative, and as for Section with his very accurate descriptions of both sides, basically Centrists 'salt of the earth' , Socialists 'cunts' I dont know where to start.

 

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5 minutes ago, Numero said:

As for all this unity stuff, it’s one man. If unity means giving in to one man otherwise his followers leave, then the way to unify the party is to remove the venom. Of course, there’s absolutely no onus of the Corbynite twats to do anything towards unity, just as it wasn’t when he had half a decade to unify they party. It’s always somebody else’s fault. Their version of the left, the ‘support Corbyn or you’re not a lefties’ left, is rotten, it’s Trump-supporter blinkered, and it’s doesn’t represent me. I’m left wing because I believe in left wing policies. My belief in left wing policies doesn’t mean I have to back a career politician who drove Labour into the ground. You’re treating it as if it’s a fucking sports team. Twats. 

 

How the fuck can you unify the party without dealing with the biggest cause of disunity? 

Your first sentence "it's one man" is untrue, the mad witches have scented blood. The labour party have recently lost 50.000 members. The Hodge squad want a member thrown off the executive for suggesting Israel encourages apartheid. It's full on and wont stop with Corbyn.

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2 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

All these labels piss me off, what the fuck is a 'centrist' anyway? 

 

"Oooh you're a centrist and an enemy of progress."

 

Tell you what a centrist is. Someone who doesn't give a toss about politics and certainly can't be arsed arguing about it, cares about their own job, house and family and couldn't give a fuck about Venezuela. I.e, the vast majority of the population.

 

It doesn't make you a banker, or a fascist, or a cunt. 

 

Oooh look at me I've got a Palestinian flag on my profile and I play songs about Thatcher on my ukulele, I'm a better human being than you. 

 

Fuck, right, off.

I believe in the welfare state, in socialised medicine, in free education, in social equality and egalitarianism... Yeah, but why aren’t you wearing a flat cap and carrying a copy of Das Kapital? Get out you centrist bastard. 

 

I’m interested in policies, not tokenism. I’m interested in getting the Tories out, not placating one man - who by the way, is proven to be a terrible leader and a terrible talisman for a movement and a really shut politician. If that makes me a right winger, that’s fine by me. I don’t define my views by what they’re called collectively. I hate Tories and right wingers not because of their label but because of the things they believe. I’m more than willing to hate left wingers on the same front. Truth is, I don’t believe many of these people give a fuck about left wing policies, it’s more about the gang they’re in. Many don't understand the political theories or why they matter. 
 

It stinks.  

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6 minutes ago, Numero said:

As for all this unity stuff, it’s one man. If unity means giving in to one man otherwise his followers leave, then the way to unify the party is to remove the venom. Of course, there’s absolutely no onus of the Corbynite twats to do anything towards unity, just as it wasn’t when he had half a decade to unify they party. It’s always somebody else’s fault. Their version of the left, the ‘support Corbyn or you’re not a lefties’ left, is rotten, it’s Trump-supporter blinkered, and it’s doesn’t represent me. I’m left wing because I believe in left wing policies. My belief in left wing policies doesn’t mean I have to back a career politician who drove Labour into the ground. You’re treating it as if it’s a fucking sports team. Twats. 

 

How the fuck can you unify the party without dealing with the biggest cause of disunity? 

 

The idea that the party has been "hijacked" by Starmer is bonkers. Think about it. Even if he was Blair II, what you're saying is:

 

Blair - centrist 

Brown - centrist 

Ed Miliband - centrist 

 

Corbyn on the slate. Non Labour members join in droves to get him elected. A separate organisation called momentum is set up that's personally loyal to his politics, campaigns and collects its own election data. Beaten soundly at an election. Chooses heiress, she doesn't win and is herself soundly beaten by Starmer. Said organisation and online outriders mobilise against him from the very beginning, before he even takes the reins, despite him winning a landslide backing of members. All because he's not their man's man.

 

Starmer - "centrist".

 

Heavens no, the right has seized control! Duplicitous fucks that they are.

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1 minute ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

The critical thinking part would be to recognise that Corbyn could be in power now if the centrists and centre-right hadn't helped bring him down, chicken coup Starmer should know that only too well. So maybe for a lot of the left the answer is : fuck the current strategy.

 

Starmer will only be accepted because he offers no meaningful change.

 

And maybe critical thinking is knowing that Starmer's 10 pledges are just some writing with little backing it up. Maybe critical thinking is knowing that a trilateral guy is never going to "support common ownership of rail, mail, energy and water" enough to make that happen if he wins an election. Because that's not want big business wants.


Could be, but isn’t. It’s done. How long are people going to cling to this nonsense that the election was stolen from him. It wasn’t. He lost. The campaign was atrocious. The leadership was atrocious. Some in the party were cunts. The Tories have an eighty seat majority. There are many arguments for why, but that’s a matter for the historians.

 

Without the endless fucking circles. 2017 great, 2019 a disaster. Neither were won and no amount of screaming in to the void will change that.

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6 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

The critical thinking part would be to recognise that Corbyn could be in power now if the centrists and centre-right hadn't helped bring him down, chicken coup Starmer should know that only too well. 

Hahahah. Oh, how I love people talking about critical thinking whilst mindlessly parroting others. 

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6 minutes ago, sir roger said:

Corbyn made more effort in four years to unite the party than all of the other leaders had in the previous 33 years.Not sure how that syncs with the 'left wingers are the problem' narrative, and as for Section with his very accurate descriptions of both sides, basically Centrists 'salt of the earth' , Socialists 'cunts' I dont know where to start.

 

You could start by not putting words into his mouth? Where did he call socialists ‘cunts’? You’re falsely equating Corbyn Pom-Pom girls with socialists. 
 

As for your first sentence... fucking hell, is Corbyn your screensaver? More to unite it! It’s bust apart at the seams because of his ineptitude and incompetence as a leader. 

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4 minutes ago, Numero said:

Hahahah. Oh, how I love people talking about critical thinking whilst mindlessly parroting others. 

 

Yeah it's just mindlessly parroting others. It has to be I suppose, because the alternative means that Starmer was part of the problem. Critical thinking is the domain of super centrists, not loony lefties obviously.

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2 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

Yeah it's just mindlessly parroting others. It has to be I suppose, because the alternative means that Starmer was part of the problem. Critical thinking is the domain of super centrists, not loony lefties obviously.

You’ve demonstrated for many years that you and critical thinking aren’t easy bedfellows. In this case, it’s just your blind partisanship. I only picked it up because in one breath you’re going on about Critical Thinking and then talking about Starmer’s involvement. 
 

There’s nothing inherently left wing about being wrong. There’s nothing inherently left wing about about tokenism. There’s nothing inherently left wing about piss poor leadership. There’s nothing left wing about losing elections. Yet because Corbyn is the overarching representative of the left, apparently, I have to accept these things? Fuck that. 

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2 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

 

The idea that the party has been "hijacked" by Starmer is bonkers. Think about it. Even if he was Blair II, what you're saying is:

 

Blair - centrist 

Brown - centrist 

Ed Miliband - centrist 

 

Corbyn on the slate. Non Labour members join in droves to get him elected. A separate organisation called momentum is set up that's personally loyal to his politics, campaigns and collects its own election data. Beaten soundly at an election. Chooses heiress, she doesn't win and is herself soundly beaten by Starmer. Said organisation and online outriders mobilise against him from the very beginning, before he even takes the reins, despite him winning a landslide backing of members. All because he's not their man's man.

 

Starmer - "centrist".

 

Heavens no, the right has seized control! Duplicitous fucks that they are.

The party from Kinnock onward spent 30 odd years ensuring that nobody of any real socialist zeal was allowed to become an mp , and if possible got rid of as a member while the party bigwigs and mps concentrated on what was important - getting themselves richer and keeping a chokehold on the party. When a potential if imperfect candidate appeared to  give a prospect of Labour going back to actually caring about people and opposing vindictive Tory poljcies of course it roused support in people ignored for donkeys years. He gets in and tries to accommodate even the worst of his enemies but gets it thrown in his face and is eventually hounded out of the party without actually breaking any rules, yet it appears it is the left that are the troublemakers. Gaslighting 101.

 

 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Numero said:

Interesting. I think letting all this just fester would have been the cowardly thing to do. If he was scared of them he would have placated them. I think it’s brave to stand up to them. They’re making threats, and he inherited a crisis of their making, now they’re pissed off he’s cleaning it up. Maybe RP is right, let the split happen and see how scary the Corbynites really are. 

Corbyn ordered a report into anti semitism and weve just had the findings of this report. The threats are all from the Hodge squad, the response by 'the left' was a reaction to Corbyn being unfairly punished in their eyes.

 

Starmer seems to have sided with the big boys in the fight and bowed to the whims of unhinged witch finders. The media, the parliamentary labour party and various dubious organisations seem to have a death wish on Corbyn and it's not brave to simply go with their every wish, I think its cowardly and foolish and all roads lead to here.

 

As for it being like extracting a tooth I think the after effects of the extraction will make the appearance of Labours face look ugly and unpalatable and will last into the foreseeable future.

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16 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Your first sentence "it's one man" is untrue, the mad witches have scented blood. The labour party have recently lost 50.000 members. The Hodge squad want a member thrown off the executive for suggesting Israel encourages apartheid. It's full on and wont stop with Corbyn.


More people have joined than left, but don’t let that get in the way of a good ol’ echo chamber ‘truth’.

 

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/keir-starmer-labour-membership-88370

 

Suppose they’re all ‘centrist’ scum chasing the capitalist shrill dollar though, right? 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, sir roger said:

The party from Kinnock onward spent 30 odd years ensuring that nobody of any real socialist zeal was allowed to become an mp , and if possible got rid of as a member while the party bigwigs and mps concentrated on what was important - getting themselves richer and keeping a chokehold on the party. When a potential if imperfect candidate appeared to  give a prospect of Labour going back to actually caring about people and opposing vindictive Tory poljcies of course it roused support in people ignored for donkeys years. He gets in and tries to accommodate even the worst of his enemies but gets it thrown in his face and is eventually hounded out of the party without actually breaking any rules, yet it appears it is the left that are the troublemakers. Gaslighting 101.

Question: who has achieved most social policies in the UK in the last 50 years? You talk about helping people as if Corbyn has a monopoly on it; left wing pollution existed long before Corbyn and it’ll exist long after him. 
 

 

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16 minutes ago, Numero said:

You could start by not putting words into his mouth? Where did he call socialists ‘cunts’? You’re falsely equating Corbyn Pom-Pom girls with socialists. 
 

As for your first sentence... fucking hell, is Corbyn your screensaver? More to unite it! It’s bust apart at the seams because of his ineptitude and incompetence as a leader. 

Section appears to have altered his post describing Centrists as doing their best for their family and country and socialusts as having a Palestinian flag on their twitter page and learning ukelele to sing about Thatcher , parrotting rubbish about Momentum but ignoring Progress , Labour First etc. seemed a fair summation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Numero said:

You’ve demonstrated for many years that you and critical thinking aren’t easy bedfellows. In this case, it’s just your blind partisanship. I only picked it up because in one breath you’re going on about Critical Thinking and then talking about Starmer’s involvement. 
 

There’s nothing inherently left wing about being wrong. There’s nothing inherently left wing about about tokenism. There’s nothing inherently left wing about piss poor leadership. There’s nothing left wing about losing elections. Yet because Corbyn is the overarching representative of the left, apparently, I have to accept these things? Fuck that. 

 

I can still critically think whilst being lectured to and gaslighted by Starmer supporters whining about Corbyn and lefties in a Corbyn thread, thanks though.

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Said it a few weeks ago, people on the left that don't have much time for Starmer and/or liked Corbyn need to make their peace now. It's gone, it's not coming back. The brief period of "control" for the left of the party has gone, and it won't be returning any time soon. Starmer doesn't give a fuck about you. Either lump it and vote for them or don't. Spending your time on this shit is futile.

 

I see it on Facebook, friends that spend every minute jumping on Starmer. I don't even care if they're right or wrong, I don't read what they're posting any more, but it's definitely futile. It isn't going to change anything. And, I do mean that, I don't buy the bullshit about "you should be attacking the Tories, etc". Regardless of its embarrassing hypocrisy (as that wing of the party did absolutely everything they could to ensure Labour couldn't win), it's simply an irrelevance. 47 year old accountant Judith from Midlands marginal isn't even aware of the existence of Squawkbox or Canary. 

 

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1 minute ago, sir roger said:

Section appears to have altered his post describing Centrists as doing their best for their family and country and socialusts as having a Palestinian flag on their twitter page and learning ukelele to sing about Thatcher , parrotting rubbish about Momentum but ignoring Progress , Labour First etc. seemed a fair summation.

I quoted him about five seconds after he posted... what’s the change? 

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