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Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?


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Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?  

218 members have voted

  1. 1. Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?



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4 minutes ago, Hank Moody said:

That's the thing. Despite not being a Blairite, in any shape or form, and opposing the wars that cost a fuck load of money and, more importantly, a fuck load of lives, I think the left have gone off a cliff with him. I'm much more of a Brownite than a Blairite, but things - whilst a mile away from being a perfect Utopia - improved dramatically after 18 years of Tories. I can't believe that those on the left would sooner see two parties get none of their policies enacted and live under perpetual Tory rule than have a group that, whilst not matching their political ideal, would do what New Labour did and balance the financial side with decent support for people and social policies. The country would be much better under Brown or Blair than these Tories. Making out as if they're right wingers who are no different from Tories won't really get anybody anywhere. 

 

 

1 minute ago, Brownie said:

I have some sympathy with this view but personally i’d rather campaign with 100% adherence to your values and abide by the result rather than dilute your values to begin with.

 

No shit.

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1 hour ago, Hank Moody said:

Regardless of the date it was registered originally (it may or may not have gone back well before the update), it being registered in Panama or wherever else is really of little importance to the end user doing the registering, it's the registrar that would be based there. Considering they will sell all over the world, they can be based wherever they want. This is the problem I have with people saying 'sorry if you have a problem with me stating facts'. Hmm, facts are cool. Context is cooler.

 

Oh, undoubtedly the point about them being in a tax haven is nonsense. I think the more embarrassing aspect is that Skwawkbox thinks the date 2019-02-15 is a 2015 date...

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24 minutes ago, Dougie Do'ins said:

Why there won't be a by-election in Wavertree after Luciana Berger quit Labour

 

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/wont-election-wavertree-after-luciana-15849542#comments-section

I haven't read the article, is the answer because she'll get her arse handed to her on a platter?

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New Labour is definitely better than any version of the Tories but the problem is it’s also a lot closer to a certain version of the Tories than some would like to admit (ref-Tories, Blue-Labour and all that...)

 

There’s a reason why some people refer to it as “Tory-Lite” after all (whether you agree with that or not).

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Brownie said:

I have some sympathy with this view but personally i’d rather campaign with 100% adherence to your values and abide by the result rather than dilute your values to begin with.

 

That's a perfectly reasonable and I don't blame people for voting with their heart. I just get a bit disheartened because what people want is going to get further away, in my opinion. I wish the left had more ability to be cut-throats instead of trying to be everyone's best mate. We might finally get something done.

 

2 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

Oh, undoubtedly the point about them being in a tax haven is nonsense. I think the more embarrassing aspect is that Skwawkbox thinks the date 2019-02-15 is a 2015 date...

Oh, is that what they were getting at? I gave them too much credit then. I assumed the update was a renewal and it had been resisted previously. Definitely through Panama though, so it's factual in that regard. Nothing to do with this bunch though, that's the registrar. 

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1 minute ago, Brownie said:

New Labour is definitely better than any version of the Tories but the problem is it’s also a lot closer to a certain version of the Tories than some would like to admit (ref-Tories, Blue-Labour and all that...)

 

There’s a reason why some people refer to it as “Tory-Lite” after all (whether you agree with that or not).

They call it that, but when you actually look at the spending and improvements in schooling, hospitals, and various working conditions and social policies in comparison to the years that sandwich it, you see that there's a a reasonable huge chasm. 

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9 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

Oh, undoubtedly the point about them being in a tax haven is nonsense. I think the more embarrassing aspect is that Skwawkbox thinks the date 2019-02-15 is a 2015 date...

 

And yet people will still be posting utter shit off them regularly. Red Phoenix is more on the ball than they are.

 

That moron at Novara media repeated it live on the BBC as well.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, cloggypop said:

NV drives a beige car. 

Right, that's fucking it. First you have a go at my boot cut jeans, and now you say my car is beige. If you think you're going to bully me into being more of a revolutionary... you're right. It's a good tactic and it's kinda working.

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18 minutes ago, Brownie said:

I have some sympathy with this view but personally i’d rather campaign with 100% adherence to your values and abide by the result rather than dilute your values to begin with.

It also compares different eras, not to mention vote share has increased under Corbyn. 

 

Blair winning an election 15 years ago isn't proof that his politics would now.

 

Basically it isn't a clear head against heart or purity against pragmatism decision/choice.

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10 minutes ago, Hank Moody said:

Right, that's fucking it. First you have a go at my boot cut jeans, and now you say my car is beige. If you think you're going to bully me into being more of a revolutionary... you're right. It's a good tactic and it's kinda working.

Get yourself a good communist bike. Preferably a Raleigh like Corbyn has. 

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6 minutes ago, Content Providicus said:

It also compares different eras, not to mention vote share has increased under Corbyn. 

 

Blair winning an election 15 years ago isn't proof that his politics would now.

 

Basically it isn't a clear head against heart or purity against pragmatism decision/choice.

Hold on, if there's overlap between New Labour and Soft-Tories, but New Labour wouldn't win now, but the Tories are and Corbyn isn't... isn't this evidence that either people DO like that brand of politics still, or that actually something else is at play - like having a slick group that can 'play the game' to get themselves into power. 

 

For me, electability is the number one priority. If you can't get elected, it genuinely doesn't matter what your views. Corbyn might have increased the share of the vote. But then, so did May's. And, albeit narrowly, so did Miliband before him. They're up against an incredibly weak and disjointed Tory party and the best thing we can say about Labour's ability to win an election right now is that they did a bit less shit and lost by a margin that wasn't as wide. I mean... it's not great. It's positive, but fuck me, this last year has been a disaster. 

 

Argh. 

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7 minutes ago, Hank Moody said:

Hold on, if there's overlap between New Labour and Soft-Tories, but New Labour wouldn't win now, but the Tories are and Corbyn isn't... isn't this evidence that either people DO like that brand of politics still, or that actually something else is at play - like having a slick group that can 'play the game' to get themselves into power. 

 

For me, electability is the number one priority. If you can't get elected, it genuinely doesn't matter what your views. Corbyn might have increased the share of the vote. But then, so did May's. And, albeit narrowly, so did Miliband before him. They're up against an incredibly weak and disjointed Tory party and the best thing we can say about Labour's ability to win an election right now is that they did a bit less shit and lost by a margin that wasn't as wide. I mean... it's not great. It's positive, but fuck me, this last year has been a disaster. 

 

Argh. 

I personally don’t agree that electability is the number one priority. If the manifesto is shit then there’s no point in being elected.

 

If the manifesto is overly radical so as to be unelectable then that’s equally pointless.

 

You have to strike a balance between the two. Despite what the mainstream media would have you believe, the latest Labour manifesto was far from radical left and very electable in my view.

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Usual media suspects being deployed. 

 

"Very brave by PREGNANT JEWISH WOMAN to stand up to the bullies!"

 

Look let's call this what it is. Brexit and Corbyn are the same side of the coin. The masses were given the choice (Brexit referendum and Labour membership) and both times said plebs didn't go with the programme, so it's been all out assault against the people responsible ever since - I.e ordinary folks.

 

 

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