Should Corbyn remain as Labour leader?

[Anny Road]

Says somewhat the opposte.

 

• Jeremy Corbyn voted yes on European Communities (Finance) Bill — Second Reading Show vote
• On 21 Jan 2008: Jeremy Corbyn voted no on Lisbon Treaty — Second Reading Show vote
• On 27 Feb 2008: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Lisbon Treaty — Enshrine the Lisbon Treaty into UK law Show vote
• On 3 Mar 2008: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Lisbon Treaty — Accept the changes of terminology in the Lisbon Treaty Show vote
• On 3 Mar 2008: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Lisbon Treaty — Increase of powers of European Parliament Show vote
• On 4 Mar 2008: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Lisbon Treaty — Clause on 'parliamentary control of decisions' to remain in the Bill Show vote
• On 5 Mar 2008: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Lisbon Treaty — Clause on 'Commencement' of the Bill should remain in the Bill Show vote
• On 11 Mar 2008: Jeremy Corbyn voted no on Lisbon Treaty — Third Reading Show vote
• On 11 Mar 2009: Jeremy Corbyn voted yes on Deferred Divisions — second strategic energy review and european energy networks

 

 

 

In the 1975 European Communities referendum put forward by the Labour Party in the United Kingdom, Corbyn opposed Britain's membership of the EEC.^[199] Corbyn also opposed the ratification of the Maastricht Treaty in 1993, saying: "... the whole basis of the Maastricht treaty is the establishment of a European central bank which is staffed by bankers, independent of national Governments and national economic policies, and whose sole policy is the maintenance of price stability[.] That will undermine any social objective that any Labour Government in the United Kingdom—or any other Government—would wish to carry out. ... The Maastricht treaty does not take us in the direction of the checks and balances contained in the American federal constitution[.] It takes us in the opposite direction of an unelected legislative body—the [European] Commission—and, in the case of foreign policy, a policy Commission that will be, in effect, imposing foreign policy on nation states that have fought for their own democratic accountability".^{[200][201][202]}

Corbyn also opposed the Lisbon Treaty in 2008^[203] and backed a proposed referendum on British withdrawal from the European Union in 2011.^[204] Additionally, he accused the institution of acting "brutally" in the 2015 Greek crisis, accusing the EU of allowing financiers to destroy its economy.^[205][206]

 

^{Been less vociferous sinnce 2016. Coincidence?}

[skend04]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/11/more-than-100-pro-leave-constituencies-switch-to-remain

 

So with sentiment, and constituencies moving against Brexit, whose will is being represented? If Brexit fucks the country, as is likely, then I'd hate to be living here when people were clearly moving against it. I'd really not want to be a MP either, and the way the media is working I'd especially not want to be a Labour MP.

[cloggypop]

It shows a mixture of for and against. More pro than anti if anything. You have chosen to quote only what agrees with your previous post. Which was wrong.

[Anny Road]

• On 14 Jul 2010: Jeremy Corbyn voted against establishing the European Union External Action Service. Show vote

• On 14 Dec 2010: Jeremy Corbyn voted against working closely with the European Commission to deliver a strong, principles-based framework for financial sector corporate governance. Show vote

On 25 Jan 2011: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union Bill — Clause 6 — Referendum on Emergency Financial Assistance for EU Member States Show vote

On 9 Feb 2011: Jeremy Corbyn voted not to support the Government's position that the UK should not contribute to the European Stability Mechanism and financial assistance for Euro area Member States should primarily be provided by other euro area Member States. Show vote

On 23 Mar 2011: Jeremy Corbyn voted against the creation of the European Stability Mechanism to give financial assistance to Eurozone countries in need. Show vote

On 14 Sep 2011: Jeremy Corbyn voted in favour of an EU Directive on the right of access to a lawyer in criminal proceedings and on the right to communicate upon arrest Show vote

On 23 Nov 2011: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Deferred Division — Schengen Governance Show vote

On 13 Dec 2011: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Opposition Day — European Union Show vote

On 24 Apr 2012: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union — Data Protection in the Areas of Police and Criminal Justice (EU Directive) Show vote

On 6 Nov 2012: Jeremy Corbyn voted against the UK's involvement in a European Supervisory Authority, the European Banking Authority. Show vote

On 15 Jul 2013: Jeremy Corbyn voted against opting out of all EU police and criminal justice measures adopted before December 2009 Show vote

On 15 Jul 2013: Jeremy Corbyn voted to consider the views of the Association of Chief Police Officers when deciding when to opt into Europol's European Union Agency for Law Enforcement Cooperation and Training; and against making opting in conditional on Europol not being given the power to direct national law enforcement agencies to initiate investigations or share data that conflicts with national security. Show vote

On 4 Dec 2013: Jeremy Corbyn voted against an EU trade agreement with Colombia and Peru Show vote

On 13 Jan 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Approvals) Bill — Second Reading — European Archives and Europe for Citizens Programme Show vote

On 17 Jan 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Benefit Entitlement (Restriction) Bill Show vote

On 22 Jan 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Commission Work Programme 2014 and Support for Completion of the EU Single Market Show vote

On 27 Jan 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Approvals) Bill — Clause 1 — Limitation of Scope of Europe for Citizens Programme Show vote

On 27 Jan 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Approvals) Bill — Third Reading — European Archives and Europe for Citizens Programme Show vote

On 10 Nov 2014: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on Transposing European Union Criminal Justice and Data Protection Measures into UK Law Show vote

On 19 Nov 2014: Jeremy Corbyn voted for the UK to rejoin a series of European Union schemes for closer police and judicial co-operation in criminal matters. Show vote

On 14 Dec 2015: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union Documents — Relocation of Migrants in need of International Protection Show vote

On 9 Mar 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted in support of a proposed EU directive on combating terrorism; and against working directly with other countries and against recognising that national security is a matter for individual nations. Show vote

On 14 Mar 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted not to take account of carbon dioxide emissions traded via the European Union to Emissions Trading Scheme when calculating the state of the UK carbon account for periods from 2028 onwards Show vote

On 15 Jun 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted to say the UK needs to stay in the EU. Show vote

On 6 Jul 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted in favour of giving EU nationals currently living in the UK the right to remain. Show vote

On 14 Sep 2016: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on UK Withdrawal from Membership of the European Union Show vote

On 7 Dec 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted in favour of the United Kingdom leaving the European Union and in favour of starting the process by 31 March 2017. Show vote

On 7 Dec 2016: Jeremy Corbyn voted in favour of the United Kingdom leaving the European Union and in favour of starting the process by 31 March 2017. Show vote

On 1 Feb 2017: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Bill — Decline Second Reading Show vote

On 1 Feb 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to empower the Prime Minister to give notification of the United Kingdom's intention to leave the European Union. Show vote

On 8 Feb 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to empower the Prime Minister to give notification of the United Kingdom's intention to leave the European Union. Show vote

On 8 Feb 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted for the UK to remain member of the European Atomic Agency Community (Euratom) when withdrawing from the European Union and to treat leaving Euratom separately from leaving the European Union. Show vote

On 8 Feb 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to empower the Prime Minister to give notification of the United Kingdom's intention to leave the European Union. Show vote

On 13 Mar 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to guarantee EU derived rights, and the potential to acquire residency rights, for EU and EEA citizens legally resident in the UK. Show vote

On 11 Sep 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted against ending the supremacy of EU law in UK law; against converting EU law into domestic law on the UK's exit from the European Union and against giving ministers the power to correct deficiencies in retained EU law. Show vote

On 11 Sep 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted against ending the supremacy of EU law in UK law; against converting EU law into domestic law on the UK's exit from the European Union and against giving ministers the power to correct deficiencies in retained EU law. Show vote

On 14 Nov 2017: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Withdrawal) Bill — Clause 1 — Repeal of the European Communities Act 1972 Show vote

On 14 Nov 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to require courts or tribunals to pay due regard to any relevant decision of the European Court after the UK's withdrawal from the EU Show vote

On 21 Nov 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to require the UK Government to report on changes to EU legislation which form part of UK law, and to require the Government to consider adopting such changes to ensure that the rights of workers and employees in the UK are no less favourable than they would have been had the UK remained a member of the EU or EEA. Show vote

On 21 Nov 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted for the European Union Charter of Fundamental Rights to remain part of UK law on the UK's withdrawal from the European Union. Show vote

On 21 Nov 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to retain the general principles of EU law derived from EU treaties, direct EU legislation, EU directives and European Court of justice case law, as part of UK law after the UK leaves the EU. Show vote

On 12 Dec 2017: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Withdrawal) Bill — Clause 7 — Retention of Laws Required by the UK's Membership of the Single Market Show vote

On 13 Dec 2017: Jeremy Corbyn voted to prevent ministers withdrawing the UK from the European Economic Area, the European single market. Show vote

On 20 Dec 2017: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Withdrawal) Bill — New Clause 13 — UK Retaining EU Common Customs Tarriff and Common Customs Policy Show vote

On 17 Jan 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted against the United Kingdom leaving the European Union. Show vote

On 17 Jan 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted against the United Kingdom leaving the European Union. Show vote

On 13 Jun 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted to make the UK's withdrawal from the EU conditional on seeking, as an objective for the UK's negotiation of the withdrawal agreement, full access to the internal market of the EU rather than merely European Economic Area membership. Show vote

On 13 Jun 2018: Jeremy Corbyn was absent for a vote on European Union (Withdrawal) Bill — Seek Participation in European Economic Area via EU Withdrawal Agreement Negotiations Show vote

On 13 Jun 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted to largely retain the EU "Charter of Fundamental Rights" as part of UK law following the UK's withdrawal from the European Union. Show vote

On 13 Jun 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted for incompatibility with the general principles of EU law to continue to be actionable in UK courts following the UK's withdrawal from the union. Show vote

On 13 Jun 2018: Jeremy Corbyn voted in favour of steps designed to ensure that the UK’s withdrawal from the EU does not result in the removal or diminution of any rights, powers, liabilities, obligations, restrictions, remedies and procedures that contribute to the protection and improvement of the environment.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

JC has voted against EU membership at almost every possible opportunity. Against Labour whips.

Jeremy Corbyn has never voted (in Parliament) against EU membership. He has never signed an EDM or so much as a petition calling for the UK to leave the EU.

[Anny Road]

No he just doesn't show up

[AngryOfTuebrook]

#FBPE

 

The bottom line is that Corbyn isn't a Brexiteer and never has been. But he's smart enough to recognise that there was a strong undercurrent of "giving those politicians (who are all the same and are all out-of-touch with ordinary people) a bloody nose" in the motivation for the vote of the 51.9%. Telling them "we know better than you, so we're ignoring your vote" isn’t the smartest move; in fact, it's electoral suicide and would hand total control to the right wing of the Tory Party for (what will feel like) a million years.

Further to that, we are now getting close to the point where Labour need to more strongly state "if our six tests can't be met, we're staying in".

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/11/more-than-100-pro-leave-constituencies-switch-to-remain

 

The important thing is that the campaign to remain has to build from grassroots. If it's seen as a central Westminster élite ignoring the electorate, then it will (deservedly) fail.

 

The #FBPE bollocks was used as just a stick to beat Corbyn with. The only beneficiaries of that were always going to be the Tories. The "Left Against Brexit" campaign seems to offer a much better chance of persuading enough people to stop this self-harming nonsense.

[Naz17]

Yep, this.

His policies will reduce quality of life. Fuck him.

[Numero Veinticinco]

His policies will reduce quality of life. Fuck him.

Which ones and in what way?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

No he just doesn't show up

You've just posted evidence to the contrary.

 

The pattern of his voting over the years seems to be in favour of social measures and cooperation on security and science, etc. but against increasing neoliberalism and moves to weaken democratic accountability.

 

That doesn't make him a Brexit supporter by any stretch of the imagination.

[lifetime fan]

His policies will reduce quality of life. Fuck him.

 

Prick.

[Rico1304]

You honestly think he’d be worse than Boris or Rees Mogg?

They aren’t PM so you might as well ask if he’d be better than bagpuss. You can only beat what’s in front of you. And he can’t.

 

There’s credible evidence that Brexit was financed by Russia. That should be enough to get him out of bed. But it’s not.

[Anny Road]

You've just posted evidence to the contrary.

The pattern of his voting over the years seems to be in favour of social measures and cooperation on security and science, etc. but against increasing neoliberalism and moves to weaken democratic accountability.

That doesn't make him a Brexit supporter by any stretch of the imagination.

He voted to leave in the 1975 referendum.

[sir roger]

Very impressed that Jim Murphy was able to give Corbyn advice on alienating Labour voters, as he is probably the party's greatest proponent of the trait. 

[Rico1304]

All you fuckers who agree in the Brexit thread it’s going to be catastrophic but contort to vote for JC are hypocrites.

 

Id vote for the Marxist, anti Semite, terrorist loving cunt if he’d come out anti Brexit but he won’t. Despite the majority of his party wanting it. He’d rather be in charge than see the country saved which makes him and you fools.

[Anny Road]

All you fuckers who agree in the Brexit thread it’s going to be catastrophic but contort to vote for JC are hypocrites.

Id vote for the Marxist, anti Semite, terrorist loving cunt if he’d come out anti Brexit but he won’t. Despite the majority of his party wanting it. He’d rather be in charge than see the country saved which makes him and you fools.

Despite the bollocks you have posted there it is important to remember that coming out as anti Brexit would consolidate the Tories and be political suicide plus he doesn’t want to.

[Numero Veinticinco]

All you fuckers who agree in the Brexit thread it’s going to be catastrophic but contort to vote for JC are hypocrites.

 

Id vote for the Marxist, anti Semite, terrorist loving cunt if he’d come out anti Brexit but he won’t. Despite the majority of his party wanting it. He’d rather be in charge than see the country saved which makes him and you fools.

You’ve probably had this discussion with others, I’ve not seen it if so, but considering Brexit seems to be the biggest issue for you, why did you vote for a party that was offering a referendum on it?

[Rico1304]

You’ve probably had this discussion with others, I’ve not seen it if so, but considering Brexit seems to be the biggest issue for you, why did you vote for a party that was offering a referendum on it?

I naively thought the referendum would be fair and not fucked by Russia.

 

Tomorrow’s Guardian - 100 constituencies that voted Leave in 2016 now support Remain, according to analysis seen by The Observer. The trend is at its sharpest in north England and Wales, due mainly to Brexit-voting Labour supporters changing their minds.

 

Where’s fucking Corbyn? Where the fuck is he? He wants this shit. He’s let you dumb fuckers down.

[Anny Road]

Typical Tory. Not my fault. It was the communists.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

All you fuckers who agree in the Brexit thread it’s going to be catastrophic but contort to vote for JC are hypocrites.

 

Id vote for the Marxist, anti Semite, terrorist loving cunt if he’d come out anti Brexit but he won’t. Despite the majority of his party wanting it. He’d rather be in charge than see the country saved which makes him and you fools.

Nah.

 

You're reading it wrong. As I explained before, coming out as a hard Remainer would only benefit the Tory Brexiteers.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

He voted to leave in the 1975 referendum.

Eight years before he became an MP.

 

In the 43 years since that Referendum, he has never called for the UK to leave the EU, even when some of his closest friends and allies were doing just that.

[lifetime fan]

They aren’t PM so you might as well ask if he’d be better than bagpuss. You can only beat what’s in front of you. And he can’t.

 

There’s credible evidence that Brexit was financed by Russia. That should be enough to get him out of bed. But it’s not.

 

Who are you voting for next election?

 

Corbyn or Boris/Rees Mogg?

[Anny Road]

Eight years before he became an MP.

In the 43 years since that Referendum, he has never called for the UK to leave the EU, even when some of his closest friends and allies were doing just that.

He voted leave because he was afraid increased federalisation, can’t see his mind changing since.

He voted against the Maastricht treaty saying.

"It takes us in the opposite direction of an unelected legislative body—the Commission—and, in the case of foreign policy, a policy Commission that will be, in effect, imposing foreign policy on nation states that have fought for their own democratic accountability."

 

Cant see much change there either. He has never switched 90 degrees on anything but you believe he has on this. Wake up mate. I think he is ace.

[Jenson]

All you fuckers who agree in the Brexit thread it’s going to be catastrophic but contort to vote for JC are hypocrites.

 

Id vote for the Marxist, anti Semite, terrorist loving cunt if he’d come out anti Brexit but he won’t. Despite the majority of his party wanting it. He’d rather be in charge than see the country saved which makes him and you fools.

FFS Corbyn is not the one in charge of Brexit. The useless gang of fuckers you voted for are! Only the Tory ‘rebels’ can derail what Rees-Mogg et al are pushing for and they haven’t got the balls to do it. Why the fuck aren’t you angry at them??

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

If Corbyn came out after the referendum and challenged the result by positioning Labour as a remain backing party, we'd likely be talking now about the likes of Angela Eagle, Owen Smith or Chuka Umunna stopping Brexit.

 

The previous GE UKIP vote that was fairly evenly distributed between Labour and the Tories in the 2017 GE would have been more heavily weighted towards the Tories if Labour came out in favour of remain. Plus, the "Lexiteers" while unlikely to go to the Tories may have not voted for a remain backing Labour.

 

Plus, even if Labour did come out as a remain backing party, do they even have the necessary numbers to block legislation etc? Especially with people like Frank Field and Hoey rebelling?