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Picking at the relegation carcass


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Leicester have very much been the exception not the norm. As well as they've done (and they've done incredibly well), their basic template is NOT the one for us to follow. They sit very deep, cede possession and look to break at pace on the counter. That requires the opposition to dominate proceedings and the vast majority of teams against Liverpool - regardless of how strong or otherwise our squad is or how well we're doing at the time - look to play on the counter against us instead. It's a legacy of our previous decades of domination that has stuck, much like Man Utd's opponents shitting the bed at Old Trafford even though Man Utd have been considerably weaker than in their heyday for some time now. Old mentalities still prevail.

 

Where Leicester and Ranieri have been clever this year is in knowing that the vast majority of teams in this league struggle to play on the front foot, dominate possession and create chances against defenders sitting so deep. Where they've been fortunate is that their counter attacks have been unusually more clinical than is normally the case and that their key players have all remained fit.

 

I've theorised before that for an underdog (which Leicester are) to prevail, they need 3 things to come together. Firstly, they need to play above themselves, which Leicester have. Secondly their opponents need to perform below themselves, which the other teams bar Spurs (who are also considered underdogs when it comes to a title race) have done. Lastly, they need a huge slice of luck which again they have had a lot of. Not in terms of refereeing decisions and the like, but that their counter attacks have been so clinical compared to the statistical norm.

 

When a team wins something, they usually find that there is much more onus on them to dictate terms in matches the following season, and opponents usually up their game against them. Leicester are so close to the title right now but they'd need to show that this season is no fluke. The regular contenders will regroup and reinvest, and Leicester will lack the element of surprise they've had this year.

 

Let me cite one player as an example - Ngolo Kante. I know he isn't merely a ballwinner but that is the main emphasis of his game, and he has been exceptional at it this year. Since his defenders usually camp out on the edge of their own box and his team usually allow the opposition to control possession, he operates in that part of the pitch 20-40 yards outside his own penalty area. If he was playing for a side which defend with a much higher line and also dominate possession, would he be as effective?

 

I think you're missing the main reason and that is PED's. I wouldn't be surprised if it comes out in the next 10 years that they were doping and the title is stripped from them retrospectively.

 

There's something very suspicious about them. It's not just the likes of Vardy, Mahrez and Kante that are playing like world class players this season, it's players like Ulloa, Okazaki and Albrighton, never has been players, that are running non stop like energiser bunnies for a full 90 mins. Most of that first eleven have played over 3000 minutes in the premier league this season and they're out running and out working the top teams, still, at this stage of the season, without any rotation of players.

 

With us we had a front four of Suarez, Sterling, Sturridge and Coutinho, and let's not forget we ran out of steam at the end, even with the greatest player in the world carrying us. They're getting those kind of performances from players considered also rans last season. it makes you think what the fuck is going on there?

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Leicester have very much been the exception not the norm. As well as they've done (and they've done incredibly well), their basic template is NOT the one for us to follow. They sit very deep, cede possession and look to break at pace on the counter. That requires the opposition to dominate proceedings and the vast majority of teams against Liverpool - regardless of how strong or otherwise our squad is or how well we're doing at the time - look to play on the counter against us instead. It's a legacy of our previous decades of domination that has stuck, much like Man Utd's opponents shitting the bed at Old Trafford even though Man Utd have been considerably weaker than in their heyday for some time now. Old mentalities still prevail.

 

Where Leicester and Ranieri have been clever this year is in knowing that the vast majority of teams in this league struggle to play on the front foot, dominate possession and create chances against defenders sitting so deep. Where they've been fortunate is that their counter attacks have been unusually more clinical than is normally the case and that their key players have all remained fit.

 

I've theorised before that for an underdog (which Leicester are) to prevail, they need 3 things to come together. Firstly, they need to play above themselves, which Leicester have. Secondly their opponents need to perform below themselves, which the other teams bar Spurs (who are also considered underdogs when it comes to a title race) have done. Lastly, they need a huge slice of luck which again they have had a lot of. Not in terms of refereeing decisions and the like, but that their counter attacks have been so clinical compared to the statistical norm.

 

When a team wins something, they usually find that there is much more onus on them to dictate terms in matches the following season, and opponents usually up their game against them. Leicester are so close to the title right now but they'd need to show that this season is no fluke. The regular contenders will regroup and reinvest, and Leicester will lack the element of surprise they've had this year.

 

Let me cite one player as an example - Ngolo Kante. I know he isn't merely a ballwinner but that is the main emphasis of his game, and he has been exceptional at it this year. Since his defenders usually camp out on the edge of their own box and his team usually allow the opposition to control possession, he operates in that part of the pitch 20-40 yards outside his own penalty area. If he was playing for a side which defend with a much higher line and also dominate possession, would he be as effective?

Im not saying anything about using Leicester as a template, I'm merely just pointing out that you don't necessarily have to buy from the top table, or buy players with experience of winning things as one poster said. You just have to buy the RIGHT players to fit into the tactics that you're gonna play, Ranieri has done exactly that. There are bargains to be had in lower leagues or smaller teams throughout Europe and for the first time in quite a while I have every confidence in our Manager to Do just that

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Haven't we circled the rotting remains of fallen clubs already? Villa: Downing, Benteke and despite being free) Milner, via Villa. Then we picked over Burnley for Ings. He may still come good, and could have an impact, but he's not getting on the pitch ahead of a fit Sturridge or Origi.

If we're going bargain basement cruising, I'd rather we looked elsewhere, and at the behest of the manager.

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Nobodys really wrong in the debate.

 

You're usually better off trying to pick up players from clubs who aren't totally shit. It's generally a trend that holds true.

 

But to suggest there's no good players at any of the clubs mentioned would be untrue. 

 

It's just would the price be right to take a punt. Like Sissoko at Newcastle. He could be a very good squad player if he was going for 2/3 million if they go down. He presses and works hard. And in a better unit he could be an important cog in the machine. 

 

It's when you spend 20 million on lads from midtable clubs who are shit thats the problem. 

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None of the above.

Actually Tim Krul is better than Mignolet, but a) we should be aiming higher and b) he's been out injured most of this season, which is a potential risk.

I think we should steer clear.

 

If we get him, it will be a Krul, Krul summer.

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Nobodys really wrong in the debate.

 

You're usually better off trying to pick up players from clubs who aren't totally shit. It's generally a trend that holds true.

 

But to suggest there's no good players at any of the clubs mentioned would be untrue. 

 

It's just would the price be right to take a punt. Like Sissoko at Newcastle. He could be a very good squad player if he was going for 2/3 million if they go down. He presses and works hard. And in a better unit he could be an important cog in the machine. 

 

It's when you spend 20 million on lads from midtable clubs who are shit thats the problem. 

 

Further to my previous point, if your squad is stacked with players well versed in competing for titles and trophies and that is something your team routinely does, it's not a problem to add a player or two from bottom-of-the-table clubs who are not familiar with such things. If the players have the talent and the hunger, they can add a valuable extra to your squad. Hopefully they'll also see what it takes to compete for things at the top level by training and playing alongside those who already do that for you and slowly become experienced winners with knowhow themselves. And the cycle continues.

 

The problem is when you routinely shop at that end of the market and end up with a squad full of talented players but little knowhow as to how to get the job done at the highest level. Especially for a team like Liverpool where they are always expected to do so. The pressure is high but the knowhow and reassurance that they're doing things the right way is not there. There is always that element of doubt and it will show in the performances and results.

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Nobodys really wrong in the debate.

 

You're usually better off trying to pick up players from clubs who aren't totally shit. It's generally a trend that holds true.

 

But to suggest there's no good players at any of the clubs mentioned would be untrue. 

 

It's just would the price be right to take a punt. Like Sissoko at Newcastle. He could be a very good squad player if he was going for 2/3 million if they go down. He presses and works hard. And in a better unit he could be an important cog in the machine. 

 

It's when you spend 20 million on lads from midtable clubs who are shit thats the problem. 

 

We've already got a squad full of squad players. We need to buy four or five players that will improve the first team.

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We've already got a squad full of squad players. We need to buy four or five players that will improve the first team.

 

No disagreement here, which is why I mentioned that going for players from these clubs would only be worth it if it was really cheap deal. 

 

Any big money signings should be the real deal or have massive potential and not be 20 million punts on bang average lads that can do a job. 

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No disagreement here, which is why I mentioned that going for players from these clubs would only be worth it if it was really cheap deal. 

 

Any big money signings should be the real deal or have massive potential and not be 20 million punts on bang average lads that can do a job. 

 

The cheap deals just don't really exist in reality. Even if Sissoko, for example, was on a free we'd pay him about 80 grand a week and he'd probably want a 4 year deal. 

 

He (or any other "cheap" squad player type of signing) may well turn out to be a success, but I think there is also a fairly decent chance the following summer's turd pile might be added to.

 

We just seem to have been on one continuous recycling of squad players mission for about two decades.

 

Alarm bells go off when phrases such as "could do a job", "useful addition", and the infamous "could surprise a few people", start being uttered about a player.

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"Could do a job" = "Can do a similar/marginally better job then the shitbird we currently have in that position"

"Useful addition" = "individually adds nothing but might contribute to the collective in a marginal sense"

"Might surprise a few people" = "had one good season about 5 years ago and fingers crossed can recover that form"

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"Could do a job" usually implies they can play in more than one position, and that they're not very good at any of them.

 

"Useful addition" means the player doesn't have one single attribute that is above average.

 

"Might surprise a few people" this usually refers to the magnitude of shitness.

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