Another US Shooting

[Numero Veinticinco]

4 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

I’m pointing out that (ok Aurora was just a lunatic and not race related) 3 high profile white supremacist mass shootings have ended with the shooter in custody alive. They might throw their weapons down of course. I don’t see any of them having their neck knelt on for 9 minutes until they die. 
 

 

Yeah, though I guess I’m just questioning whether there’s really a correlation for us to draw from there. Meaning I’m not sure the reason they weren’t killed was because they were white. Many hundreds of whites are killed by cops each year. Not because they’re white but because they’re dangerous criminals. For me, I just want the police to do the hat they should do regardless of race. 
 

It’s not something I normally recommend but there’s a really good channel ok YouTube for police video cams of killings. Sometimes they make the right call, sometimes they don’t. I think more often than not it’s down to how an individual officer handles it at that moment. I like watching them from a perspective of seeing how a person deals with such a horrible situation. My take away from those is that much more training needs to be given, not that they’re generally killing blacks and letting whites live because they’re white. 

 

That’s not to gloss over the evident racial issue in the states. That exists, of course. 

[Bjornebye]

Just now, SasaS said:

Your post was not about how it was a racist attack, but how the shooter was taken alive, and how if it wasn't white, he wouldn't be, implying that the police of New Zealand, Norway and the US only kill non-white terrorists-mass shooters. 

 

1 hour ago, Bjornebye said:

Taken alive. No surprise there. Of course if it was black on white I suspect his brain would be in about a million pieces. Just a hunch. 

 

 

 

Just now, SasaS said:

Your post was not about how it was a racist attack, but how the shooter was taken alive, and how if it wasn't white, he wouldn't be, implying that the police of New Zealand, Norway and the US only kill non-white terrorists-mass shooters. 

It was a hunch. I know it doesn’t suit you but for me I find it very interesting.  
 

 

 

[Bjornebye]

Just now, Numero Veinticinco said:

Yeah, though I guess I’m just questioning whether there’s really a correlation for us to draw from there. Meaning I’m not sure the reason they weren’t killed was because they were white. Many hundreds of whites are killed by cops each year. Not because they’re white but because they’re dangerous criminals. For me, I just want the police to do the hat they should do regardless of race. 
 

It’s not something I normally recommend but there’s a really good channel ok YouTube for police video cams of killings. Sometimes they make the right call, sometimes they don’t. I think more often than not it’s down to how an individual officer handles it at that moment. I like watching them from a perspective of seeing how a person deals with such a horrible situation. My take away from those is that much more training needs to be given, not that they’re generally killing blacks and letting whites live because they’re white. 

 

That’s not to gloss over the evident racial issue in the states. That exists, of course. 

That’s my point mate. They probably did put their weapons down. I just think personally that the chances of them being taken out by a police marksman would have been much higher if they weren’t white. Just an opinion. Always interesting to debate though mate, certainly raises a few questions and eyebrows. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

3 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

That’s my point mate. They probably did put their weapons down. I just think personally that the chances of them being taken out by a police marksman would have been much higher if they weren’t white. Just an opinion. Always interesting to debate though mate, certainly raises a few questions and eyebrows. 

Indeed it does, I just wish you were allowed to raise those eyebrows and questions! 
 

I’m actually not arguing the point either way on this one. I’ve always thought it was an interesting subject and it’s something I’ve spoken with mates from the US about, and their views vary wildly. Regarding each case, I guess I’d have to read up on each individual case before making a judgement. America is a weird and wonderful place. 

[SasaS]

6 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

 

 

It was a hunch. I know it doesn’t suit you but for me I find it very interesting.  
 

 

 

I just find it tedious. There is a post to that effect by someone in almost every thread on attacks - mass shootings on here. And when it transpires it was Islamic terrorism, or it wasn't a white guy taken alive, we simply move on.

[Gnasher]

17 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

That’s my point mate. They probably did put their weapons down. I just think personally that the chances of them being taken out by a police marksman would have been much higher if they weren’t white. Just an opinion. Always interesting to debate though mate, certainly raises a few questions and eyebrows. 

I'm sorry but I think your missing the main question. This is not just a series of individual incidents, this is organised white supremacist terrorism fuelled by an ideological idea that believes  amongst other things blacks are outnumbering whites. If this was a black Muslim shooting dead whites the focus would immediately turn to the source, Isis? Al Queda? 

 

The actions you question of the police are relevant but the problem here could be far bigger and stretch far wider.

 

 

Excellent by Buttgieg here.

 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, SasaS said:

I just find it tedious. There is a post to that effect by someone in almost every thread on attacks - mass shootings on here. And when it transpires it was Islamic terrorism, or it wasn't a white guy taken alive, we simply move on.

Show an example? Show me an example of people simply moving l when it isn’t a white person. In-fact show me the e multiple that you’re implying. 
 

I find racism and people who deny that racism is a problem very fucking tedious and a huge reason why there is so much hate in the world. 

[SasaS]

11 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Show an example? Show me an example of people simply moving l when it isn’t a white person. In-fact show me the e multiple that you’re implying. 
 

I find racism and people who deny that racism is a problem very fucking tedious and a huge reason why there is so much hate in the world. 

If you don't believe me, go to any thread on terrorist attacks on here or old mass shootings. It is almost always there, usually on page one.  

[Bjornebye]

4 minutes ago, SasaS said:

If you don't believe me, go to any thread on terrorist attacks on here or old mass shootings. It is almost always there, usually on page one.  

You made the claim, you implied there are so many. Show me 

[Gnasher]

Their now needs a clampdown on anyone pushing this shit. America could start with their own politicans and political commentators, then quickly move to social media and influences from abroad. 

 

Whether the individual was taken dead or alive is a secondary argument. As with Jihadi terrorism the content passed around by terrorists and sympathisers has to be banned.

 

 

 

[Bjornebye]

Just now, Gnasher said:

Their now needs a clampdown on anyone pushing this shit. America could start with their own politicans and political commentators, then quickly move to social media and influences from abroad. 

 

Whether the individual was taken dead or alive is a secondary argument. As with Jihadi terrorism the content passed around by terrorists and sympathisers has to be banned.

 

 

 

“White supremacy” ideology needs clamping down or the people calling it out for what it is? 

[SasaS]

Just now, Bjornebye said:

You made the claim, you implied there are so many. Show me 

I don't have time nor motivation. There are pretty regular, frequent enough that I've noticed it. It's not like I said something outrageous and now I have to prove it. You just did it in this thread.

[Gnasher]

7 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

“White supremacy” ideology needs clamping down or the people calling it out for what it is? 

Both. As the lady says in above link. They stopped letting terrorists spout similar shit about Jihadism on national tv/Internet etc. America needs to treat this in a similar way. This needs stopping at source, worldwide.

[Bjornebye]

6 minutes ago, SasaS said:

I don't have time nor motivation. There are pretty regular, frequent enough that I've noticed it. It's not like I said something outrageous and now I have to prove it. You just did it in this thread.

You’re chatting shit. You’re always around with the whataboutery when racism is pointed out. Show me an example. I’ve given examples of what I claimed. Now it’s your turn. How about the Paris attacks thread? Oh …. Won’t suit your point ….. Manchester bombing ? Oh .:::::  Boston? Aaahhh …..

[Bjornebye]

2 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Both. As the lady says in above link. They stopped letting a terrorists spout similar shit about Jihadism on national tv/Internet etc. America needs to treat this in a similar way. This needs stopping at source, worldwide.

Unfortunately there are too many pricks with racist/sick ideals. And also plenty more happy to let it happen and stand around with their hands in their pockets. 

[Gnasher]

8 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Unfortunately there are too many pricks with racist/sick ideals. And also plenty more happy to let it happen and stand around with their hands in their pockets. 

I guess its up to the FBI and the American government now. This white replacement theory nonsense is being spouted more and more. The New Zealand killer used it and its all over the States.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2019/08/06/christchurch-endures-extremist-touchstone-investigators-probe-suspected-el-paso-manifesto/

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 hour ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

You’re not a massive fan of answering questions are you, @Gnasher?

I honestly didn't have you down as a coward, Gnasher. Appears I was mistaken. 

[SasaS]

9 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

You’re chatting shit. You’re always around with the whataboutery when racism is pointed out. Show me an example. I’ve given examples of what I claimed. Now it’s your turn. How about the Paris attacks thread? Oh …. Won’t suit your point ….. Manchester bombing ? Oh .:::::  Boston? Aaahhh …..

Yes, you are right I'm chatting shit, I am willing to leave it at that. We both know the posts are there, unless you believe you just made this point for the first time and that nobody on here ever makes similar points.

 

And you've provided a list of selective examples from all over the world which implies police in various Western countries deliberately let white supremacist terrorist alive, even before they are fully aware of their motivation, which further implies they are in cahoots with them.

[Numero Veinticinco]

I think most threads like this have 'if they weren't white...' type posts, normally criticising (rightly, in my view) some in the media for not calling terrorism terrorism when the perpetrator of terrorism is white but rushing to assume a terrorist attacker is a Muslim. At one point in time that might have been a fair assumption (statistically), certainly not anymore. 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, SasaS said:

Yes, you are right I'm chatting shit, I am willing to leave it at that. We both know the posts are there, unless you believe you just made this point for the first time and that nobody on here ever makes similar points.

 

Any you've provided a list of selective examples from all over the world which implies police in various Western countries deliberately let white supremacist terrorist alive, even before they are fully aware of their motivation, which further implies they are in cahoots with them.

I literally said it’s a “hunch” I didn’t pass it away as fact that white shooters don’t get shot however what I did do was leave a few examples of why I have that ‘hunch’ 

 

I don’t know either way of examples of yours are but why should I sit and look for examples to back you up? You’ve said there are loads. I disagree but am happy to be proven wrong. 

[Gnasher]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/05/great-replacement-theory-alt-right-killers-el-paso

[SasaS]

7 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

I literally said it’s a “hunch” I didn’t pass it away as fact that white shooters don’t get shot however what I did do was leave a few examples of why I have that ‘hunch’ 

 

I don’t know either way of examples of yours are but why should I sit and look for examples to back you up? You’ve said there are loads. I disagree but am happy to be proven wrong. 

I don't expect you to look for examples to support my point, at the same time, I don't have the energy or time or sufficient motivation to go over old threads to prove such posts have been frequently made because it is not something which would be hard to believe, people rushing in with interpretations that fit their narrative, and if they were not being made I wouldn't have noticed that. If you don't want to take my word for it, don't, it's OK.

[Jack the Sipper]

When are the authorities and our media going to treat far-right extremism with the same seriousness as they do its Islamic counterpart? Too often lately we're seeing these plots, targeted killings of politicians, and mass murders just batted away as lone actions by disturbed individuals because they weren't known to have been a part of a group that met, traded ideas etc of the type that we associate with Al Qaeda, Islamic State and the like.

 

Yet, in this digital, multi-media age, there's really no need for a killer to have ever physically met with others, or even to have chatted online on some dark corner of the internet - just to have sat in front of a TV or Youtube night after night legally watching some of the more infamous hosts is enough to set these people on their way. 

 

I see the latest killer left a manifesto citing the so-called great Replacement Theory as his motivation - a theory regularly propagated by Republican politicians and Fox News presenter like Tucker Carlson. Reminds me of when that cunt Breivik did something similar, citing loads of influences that were, and still are, pushing their wares in this country, in the papers or on social media.

 

Obviously, the type of cunts sympathetic to their cause would play the free speech card against any clamping down on this dangerous rhetoric. But what really, beyond a veneer of legitimacy, separates the likes of Carlson, Tommy Robinson etc from the radical Islamic preachers that are, rightly, being monitored, jailed and deported where possible when they encourage hate, encourage violence and groom impressionable fucks to carry out their dirty work? Is it just a matter of how subtle or obvious you are? Does a disclaimer against condoning murder suffice when telling viewers how their traditions, their people, their country are being obliterated by the 'other' and the nasty left-wing politicians that support them?

 

[Rico1304]

1 hour ago, SasaS said:

If you don't believe me, go to any thread on terrorist attacks on here or old mass shootings. It is almost always there, usually on page one.  

Remember when the bloke blew himself up

outside the hospital?  That just went away didn’t it.  
 

Loads of people stabbed in Germany last week.  Not a single post on here. 

[Strontium]

31 minutes ago, Jack the Sipper said:

When are the authorities and our media going to treat far-right extremism with the same seriousness as they do its Islamic counterpart?

 

I think that is happening more these days. This is from a few months ago. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/18/more-prevent-referrals-linked-to-far-right-extremism-than-islamist

 

Quote

The number of referrals to the government’s Prevent counter-terrorism programme relating to far-right extremism has exceeded those for Islamist radicalisation for the first time.

There were 1,229 referrals owing to concerns related to extreme rightwing radicalisation in the year ending 31 March, and 1,064 because of suspected Islamist radicalisation, according to official figures published on Thursday. The total number of referrals was down by 22% on the previous 12 months, to 4,915 referrals, a fall the Home Office suggested was a result of school and university closures during the coronavirus pandemic.

The Prevent programme has been dogged by claims of being a cover to spy on Muslim communities, but police concerns about far-right activity have been rising in recent years, leading to them making up a higher proportion of referrals. Accepted referrals relating to far-right extremism from the early-intervention Prevent programme to Channel, which provides more intensive support, had already outstripped those for Islamist radicalisation in recent years.

Last year, the Home Office banned the neo-Nazi group Sonnenkrieg Division (SKD), members of which have been jailed for serious offences, making membership of the group illegal and punishable by up to 10 years in prison. It also recognised the extreme rightwing group System Resistance Network as an alias of the already-proscribed organisation National Action.