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Jordan Henderson, MBE: World Club Cup, European Cup, European Super Cup, Premier League, FA Cup, League Cup & Charity Shield Winning Captain of Liverpool (and massive sellout)


dennis tooth
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On 2/5/2019 at 12:41 PM, aRdja said:

Nonsense. Hendo is better than Keita and Lovren is far better than Matip.

 

4 minutes ago, VladimirIlyich said:

Henderson is far more assured than Keita at present,'better' is subjective. Matip is ok but I'd say Lovren and him are pretty close in all round ability.

This.

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We have Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson, Fabinho and Keita currently.

Wijnaldum and Fabinho are our best two. Keita cannot be trusted at the moment.

No one can be trusted at attacking mid, Shaqiri is better off the bench, then there is Lallana. The Hen/Mil/Wij three is ok. Fabinho in for Milner is better. 

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31 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

We have Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson, Fabinho and Keita currently.

Wijnaldum and Fabinho are our best two. Keita cannot be trusted at the moment.

No one can be trusted at attacking mid, Shaqiri is better off the bench, then there is Lallana. The Hen/Mil/Wij three is ok. Fabinho in for Milner is better. 

 

Perhaps we can get away with playing those three in the latter stages in the CL or in away games we're not supposed to control (City, Chelsea, Utd?) In the rest of the games I think they become much too static, and none of them will take on a player in the opposition third. Gini might on a breakaway, but that's about it. Think I stated last time Milner and Henderson played together that I never wanted them to partner up again in MF.

 

I still don't know why we've moved away from the 4-3-3 that has served us so well in the past, possibly Klopp thinks the two deep midfielders give us a more solid base. It mitigates some of Wijnaldum's strenghts, and I thought he had his best games this season as a 6. Both him and Fabinho are comfortable receiving the ball under pressure though, so they can both cover the role of the player next to the DM.

 

My choice of lineup in a 4-2-3-1 would be:

 

---Trent--Gomez--VVD--Robertson

----------Fabinho------Wijnaldum---

---------------Keita/Shaq------------

Salah---------Firmino-----Mane---

 

and playing 4-3-3 with one DM it'd be:

 

same back 4

------------Fabinho-----------

Milner/Keita--------------Wijnaldum

--Salah----Firmino----Mane--

 

Fabinho and Wijnaldum need to play if they are fit, and our back 4 and front 3 are untouchable when they are fit and firing. Whether you put Milner, Keita or Shaq in with them (or even Henderson) is much of a muchness imo, as they've all got huge flaws for a team trying to win the league. Against the dross I think I'd go with  Keita, as his ceiling is higher than all the other CM's bar Gini (who imo is our best MF), and he's about the only one able to (and willing to) take on the opposition players. Does my head in when we aimlessly pass the ball around like we've done the last two games with the game on the line. Go straight at them, challenge YOUR opposing players, draw a tackle (or a foul/card even), anything to ruffle the opposition a bit. There practically no use in us switching play from side to side for our FBs swinging their crosses into a packed 17-yard box, when our attackers are about a head smaller than the opposition defence. 

 

Speaking of crosses, why can't we consistently try to swing our corners and FK's from the sides INWARDS instead of outwards. I know we're atop the league in goals from set pieces, but so SHOULD we be, creating the number of FK's and corners we do (as well as having decent height in our team atm). A FK/corner delivery towards the keeper with players running full pelt is imo much more dangerous than the outswingers we're now doing, which normally land 12-15 yards from the goal. We might create something from the 2nd ball inside the box, but very rarely will headers from that distance trouble the keeper. The added bonus if nothing/no-one hits the inswinger (from FK's) is that often the keeper will have trouble saving it anyway. 

 

Anyway, derailing the thread a bit with this. Back on topic, Henderson is about the last player I'd want in a game we're favourites in and trying to force a win... I'll take all of our other midfield options (minus the current version of Lallana) instead.

 

 

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3 hours ago, lebron said:

Anyway, derailing the thread a bit with this. Back on topic, Henderson is about the last player I'd want in a game we're favourites in and trying to force a win... I'll take all of our other midfield options (minus the current version of Lallana) instead.

 

 

Dropped four points in two games we were favourites to win without him the middle.  If that does't teach you I don't know what will. 

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He would be a brilliant footballer if he grew some balls and took a positive step once in a while, like a shot on goal wouldn't be so bad. As it stands he's just a water carrier middle of the road hard working midfielder. We have missed him and Gini in the middle though. 

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2 hours ago, TK421 said:

Dropped four points in two games we were favourites to win without him the middle.  If that does't teach you I don't know what will. 

 

Wijnaldum missing was a far bigger problem. Of our current midfielders only him and Fabinho are good enough. Apart from those two I’d say Milner is closest, then maybe Henderson.

 

Jury still out on AOC and Keita for me.

 

Edit: What we’ve seen from Keita so far obviously isn’t good enough. But I reckon he may come good.

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Just now, Joey8FrogsLegs said:

 

Wijnaldum missing was a far bigger problem. Of our current midfielders only him and Fabinho are good enough. Apart from those two I’d say Milner is closest, then maybe Henderson.

 

Jury still out on AOC and Keita for me.

Wijnaldum played the full game against Leicester. 

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Just now, TK421 said:

Wijnaldum played the full game against Leicester. 

 

Sorry, I was wrong then. Didn’t watch that one due to work.

 

Still doubt very much that Henderson would’ve made much of a difference.

 

Henderson’s best games imo were in the past, against supposedly superior opponents, where huffing and puffing to unsettle the opposition was the recipe, He’s about the least creative player in the squad as I see it.

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8 minutes ago, Joey8FrogsLegs said:

 

Sorry, I was wrong then. Didn’t watch that one due to work.

 

Still doubt very much that Henderson would’ve made much of a difference.

 

Henderson’s best games imo were in the past, against supposedly superior opponents, where huffing and puffing to unsettle the opposition was the recipe, He’s about the least creative player in the squad as I see it.

In theory we had the most creative three we could put out with Keita/Shaqiri and Keita/Lallana in those games.  We also had the advantage of early goals in both games, which should have created more space for the creative players as Leicester and West Ham needed to chase the game a bit more.  In the end none of that helped us and we've blown four precious points.  

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8 minutes ago, TK421 said:

In theory we had the most creative three we could put out with Keita/Shaqiri and Keita/Lallana in those games.  We also had the advantage of early goals in both games, which should have created more space for the creative players as Leicester and West Ham needed to chase the game a bit more.  In the end none of that helped us and we've blown four precious points.  

 

Balance is a big issue. As of course is quality. Keita, Lallana and Shaqiri are all better offensively than they are defensively. And none of them are really good enough at the moment, even if Shaqiri have been in glimpses.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
9 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Getting in early here -- I knew playing him at CB would be a mistake.

Makes the decision not to sign a center back seem laughable. Then again, imagine if Henderson actually turns on a match-winning performance?

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  • Paul changed the title to Jordan Henderson, MBE: World Club Cup, European Cup, European Super Cup, Premier League, FA Cup, League Cup & Charity Shield Winning Captain of Liverpool
  • dave u changed the title to Jordan Henderson, MBE: World Club Cup, European Cup, European Super Cup, Premier League, FA Cup, League Cup & Charity Shield Winning Captain of Liverpool (and massive sellout)

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