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Should the UK remain a member of the EU


Anny Road
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317 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the UK remain a member of the EU

    • Yes
      259
    • No
      58


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10 minutes ago, Anny Road said:

Bring it the fuck on.

Anarchy and the destruction of the British Establishment. End of the royals. Let fire burn.

 

Except I suspect we will get shafted and they will make a wedge.

All any government would have to do is make the lights go off for an hour and all the anarchy would stop 

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3 minutes ago, rico1304 said:

All any government would have to do is make the lights go off for an hour and all the anarchy would stop 

Seriously is that how weak you imagine our resistance would be. Guess you never lived in Liverpool in the 70s/80's the lights went out all the time. i'm still fighting

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Rico is not wrong there, maybe not an hour but this is a society, a generation in a society that has never felt real hardship. Now I know that's relative some people struggle as much as any have but generally speaking the vast majority of people in this country have lived a life of privilege and peace that possibly any other generation  in history before have ever seen. I also think it's generations that have lost community  thoug. I think that's been devastating.

 

Doesn't mean that should justify the fractures and wrong doings in society. Why slide backwards. 

 

I'm pissed a bit.

 

By generation I generally mean after the 2nd world war from the oldest person alive today to the youngest. Feels like we fling responsibility from one age group to the next when it's in the hands of the capable living. 

 

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I just think human beings are inherently violent creatures, and every 100 years or so, we need to have a big fuck off straightener about some shit, and then afterwards we think "thank fuck that's over, we all got a bit out of hand there" and vow for it to never happen again.

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I'm currently on placement in a small farming community and had a chat with some colleagues on Friday. It turned to Brexit and as it happens they all voted out. 

 

Actually managed to have a genuine discussion about our reasons for voting the way we did.  No-one  even mentioned immigration once. The feeling in the farming community there is that if super cheap imports of fruit and veg were to become harder for the big supermarkets they'd be forced to use British farms more. One said that they simply can't grow carrots as cheaply as they can be imported. These are 4th or 5th generation farming families tending the same land and they reckon that £ for lb the value of their crops has never been lower and attribute a lot of it to imports. 

 

It was nice to just agree to disagree at the end and not go into a slanging match. The joys of face to face discussion instead of internet eh? 

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1 minute ago, Paulie Dangerously said:

I'm currently on placement in a small farming community and had a chat with some colleagues on Friday. It turned to Brexit and as it happens they all voted out. 

 

Actually managed to have a genuine discussion about our reasons for voting the way we did.  No-one  even mentioned immigration once. The feeling in the farming community there is that if super cheap imports of fruit and veg were to become harder for the big supermarkets they'd be forced to use British farms more. One said that they simply can't grow carrots as cheaply as they can be imported. These are 4th or 5th generation farming families tending the same land and they reckon that £ for lb the value of their crops has never been lower and attribute a lot of it to imports. 

 

It was nice to just agree to disagree at the end and not go into a slanging match. The joys of face to face discussion instead of internet eh? 

Fuck off remoaning cunt

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2 hours ago, Paulie Dangerously said:

Actually managed to have a genuine discussion about our reasons for voting the way we did.  No-one  even mentioned immigration once. The feeling in the farming community there is that if super cheap imports of fruit and veg were to become harder for the big supermarkets they'd be forced to use British farms more. One said that they simply can't grow carrots as cheaply as they can be imported. These are 4th or 5th generation farming families tending the same land and they reckon that £ for lb the value of their crops has never been lower and attribute a lot of it to imports. 

 

I've no doubt whatsoever that this is true. The difference is that I think it's rather a good thing that competition in a free market allows the consumer to buy fruit and vegetables much more cheaply. I don't find "I want to limit people's freedom so they're forced to buy my stuff" to be a particularly persuasive argument. 

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14 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

I've no doubt whatsoever that this is true. The difference is that I think it's rather a good thing that competition in a free market allows the consumer to buy fruit and vegetables much more cheaply. I don't find "I want to limit people's freedom so they're forced to buy my stuff" to be a particularly persuasive argument. 

Nor do I, but they do. Because, like Rico when he voted for the Tories, they’re just trying to vote in their own interests. Unfortunately, it’s a myopic view that fucks them in other areas. 

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1 hour ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

I've no doubt whatsoever that this is true. The difference is that I think it's rather a good thing that competition in a free market allows the consumer to buy fruit and vegetables much more cheaply. I don't find "I want to limit people's freedom so they're forced to buy my stuff" to be a particularly persuasive argument. 

Of course, but that's a consumer point of view. If the fruit and veg was locally sourced, firstly it'd be fresher because it doesn't have to travel across the world - which has nutritional benefits. Secondly, the cost environmentally of the energy resources needed to deliver it would be less. Thirdly, beneficial to the UK population in the sense it's more lucrative to become a farmer with those protections in place - which gives people more incentive to become farmers themselves, because the margins are higher.

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2 minutes ago, Boss said:

Of course, but that's a consumer point of view. If the fruit and veg was locally sourced, firstly it'd be fresher because it doesn't have to travel across the world - which has nutritional benefits. Secondly, the cost environmentally of the energy resources needed to deliver it would be less. Thirdly, beneficial to the UK population in the sense it's more lucrative to become a farmer with those protections in place - which gives people more incentive to become farmers themselves, because the margins are higher.

We don’t have enough arable land to grow our own food.   

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If you cannot grow competitive produce with all the farming subsidies, much lower transportation costs and usually some open or hidden protective tariffs then there is not much point in incentivizing people to become farmers by raising the price of food through not allowing customers choice. Isn't there already plenty of market for locally sourced, organic, fresher or higher quality as it is?

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19 minutes ago, Boss said:

Of course, but that's a consumer point of view. If the fruit and veg was locally sourced, firstly it'd be fresher because it doesn't have to travel across the world - which has nutritional benefits. Secondly, the cost environmentally of the energy resources needed to deliver it would be less. Thirdly, beneficial to the UK population in the sense it's more lucrative to become a farmer with those protections in place - which gives people more incentive to become farmers themselves, because the margins are higher.

 

Absolutely it's a consumer point of view, because I take the not uneasonable stance that our food supply chain should be run primarily for the benefit of the consumer rather than the benefit of agribusiness. As to your substantive points...

 

Firstly, I've never detected any freshness problems in the fruit and veg in our shops. If there were, then shops would source produce closer to home, and indeed, do, where they feel it necessary. Secondly, food miles is a rather simplistic way of looking at energy expenditure on crop production, and you must also consider that growing crops is often much more efficient where the weather is warmer - imagine the energy expense of growing bananas in an Essex greenhouse, and you'll see what I mean - not to mention when out of season in this country (the strawberries I've been eating lately have been mainly sourced from Egypt, because nobody is producing them in this country at this time of year). Thirdly, and perhaps most straightforwardly - why on earth would we want to give people an incentive to become farmers?

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