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Should the UK remain a member of the EU

  

316 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the UK remain a member of the EU

    • Yes
      258
    • No
      58


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8 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

 

I posted about that a while ago as I had a right ballache trying to send some parts over to Northern Ireland.

 

Guidance is really vague on it, the couriers aren't totally clear on what's going on and like everything the useless fucks in government right now have no clear idea on what's going on.

 

 

Was talking to the guy who I get my packaging from yesterday. Prices of everything are rising at a ridiculous rate, plus there are supply issues as well. 

 

There is no way on fucking earth that inflation for people day to day is going to be in the 2 to 4 percent range at the rate basic supplies and material costs are going up. 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Chairman Meow said:

 

I posted about that a while ago as I had a right ballache trying to send some parts over to Northern Ireland.

 

Guidance is really vague on it, the couriers aren't totally clear on what's going on and like everything the useless fucks in government right now have no clear idea on what's going on.

 

 

Was talking to the guy who I get my packaging from yesterday. Prices of everything are rising at a ridiculous rate, plus there are supply issues as well. 

 

There is no way on fucking earth that inflation for people day to day is going to be in the 2 to 4 percent range at the rate basic supplies and material costs are going up. 

 

 

 

And at this point companies will reduces lines and bulk import single lines to reduce costs and choice with other more exotic* lines coming at a significant premium.

 

Brexitana revels in it's blandest, it builds character.

 

*stuff that used to be freely available in our open competitive economy.

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The new Tory attack line seems to be that buisness have had it so good for so long on cheap labour they deserve to take the hit now.

 

It takes two seconds thought to unpack that the governemnt is free to set minimum wage expectations, working legislation and frameworks, standards, apprenticeships levels, standards and focus' and yet at everypoint they have failed to leading to this clusterfuck.

 

At every jucnture they have shit on the little man, at every avenue they have chosen to make working lives more insecure, fractured and precarious and they have the fucking audacity to now turn around and blame people they worked with hand in hand creating this insecurity and for operating within frameworks they legislated and trumpeted?

 

They're blaming the bigger boys for smasing the greenhouse windows and giving it puppy dog eyes trying to convince people.

 

I'm not sure they can stare this one down and go after 'big buisness' it a fucking stupid strategy on their part and will isolate their backers, unless of course this is the bigger picture disaster capitalist fever dream they hoped for and now can hover up failing companies and their assests.

 

Seems odd all round, but maybe that's all they have as they've destroyed most things already.

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3 hours ago, skend04 said:

https://www.scotsman.com/business/consumer/surge-in-interest-in-hgv-vacancies-for-uk-from-india-and-pakistan-3406593

 

Gnasher will be foaming. Even cheaper labour!

 

I welcome more people that look like me. Obviously as long as they aren't surveyors because then I'll have to accept lower wages.

This is where the Labour Party should step in, they won't but its an open goal similar to when the country witnessed cheap veg pickers packed on chartered flights during the outset of Covid.

 

In general I'm all for giving non Europeans the same rights and opportunities as people from the EU, I believe the system was badly flawed and unjust, it was unfair on those from futher parts, ie Asian doctors, West Indian nurses etc, as long as its not for the reason of simply lowering the wage rate.

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3 hours ago, Bruce Spanner said:

The new Tory attack line seems to be that buisness have had it so good for so long on cheap labour they deserve to take the hit now.

 

It takes two seconds thought to unpack that the governemnt is free to set minimum wage expectations, working legislation and frameworks, standards, apprenticeships levels, standards and focus' and yet at everypoint they have failed to leading to this clusterfuck.

 

At every jucnture they have shit on the little man, at every avenue they have chosen to make working lives more insecure, fractured and precarious and they have the fucking audacity to now turn around and blame people they worked with hand in hand creating this insecurity and for operating within frameworks they legislated and trumpeted?

 

They're blaming the bigger boys for smasing the greenhouse windows and giving it puppy dog eyes trying to convince people.

 

I'm not sure they can stare this one down and go after 'big buisness' it a fucking stupid strategy on their part and will isolate their backers, unless of course this is the bigger picture disaster capitalist fever dream they hoped for and now can hover up failing companies and their assests.

 

Seems odd all round, but maybe that's all they have as they've destroyed most things already.

It's an election winning strategy devised by Cummings and Cairn and its a strategy Labour should've adopted years ago.

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4 minutes ago, skend04 said:

Missed the bit where it says piecework. I'm fairly certain that this is the rate they've always been giving, it all depends on how quickly people can work. 

Are you seriously suggesting people in Agriculture/Haulage/Hospitality are not experiencing wage increases because of Covid/Brexit ?  It's no wonder Labour are miles behind in the polls, living on a different fucking planet.

 

https://labourheartlands.com/cabbage-pickers-offered-30-an-hour-thats-240-for-an-eight-hour-day/

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1 minute ago, Gnasher said:

Are you seriously suggesting people in Agriculture/Haulage/Hospitality are not experiencing wage increases because of Covid/Brexit ?  It's no wonder Labour are miles behind in the polls, living on a different fucking planet.

 

https://labourheartlands.com/cabbage-pickers-offered-30-an-hour-thats-240-for-an-eight-hour-day/

Do you know what piecework is?

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37 minutes ago, skend04 said:

Missed the bit where it says piecework. I'm fairly certain that this is the rate they've always been giving, it all depends on how quickly people can work. 

I'd bet its not the rate they had previously been given.

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It's a given right? Not sure why folks are arguing with Gnasher really. Seems to be a circular argument in this thread.

 

Brexit (and covid) have lessened the suppy of labour which has resulted in increased wages and job opportunities. Good news for the worker, bad news for company profits and/or the end consumer.

 

Freedom of movement was always about having an abundant supply of labour, which naturally resulted in lower wages and fewer opportunities. Not great for those on the receiving end, but good news for the consumer, company profits, and the economy (in theory).

 

Brexit has raised wages and opportunities in some sectors. At least in the short term. Whether or not this Tory government will allow their dividends and pensions and bribes from industry to be affected long term is another story. Our trade agreement with the Australians will bring a bunch of BBQ bearing fruit pickers to replace the EU fruit pickers each year - I would expect similar trade deals to get wages in other sectors of the economy back to where the Tories want them longer term.

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57 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Are you seriously suggesting people in Agriculture/Haulage/Hospitality are not experiencing wage increases because of Covid/Brexit ?  It's no wonder Labour are miles behind in the polls, living on a different fucking planet.

 

https://labourheartlands.com/cabbage-pickers-offered-30-an-hour-thats-240-for-an-eight-hour-day/

Cabbage is £0.47 in Tesco. How many cabbages would one need to pick to earn £62,000?

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29 minutes ago, M_B said:

It's a given right? Not sure why folks are arguing with Gnasher really. Seems to be a circular argument in this thread.

 

Brexit (and covid) have lessened the suppy of labour which has resulted in increased wages and job opportunities. Good news for the worker, bad news for company profits and/or the end consumer.

 

Freedom of movement was always about having an abundant supply of labour, which naturally resulted in lower wages and fewer opportunities. Not great for those on the receiving end, but good news for the consumer, company profits, and the economy (in theory).

 

Brexit has raised wages and opportunities in some sectors. At least in the short term. Whether or not this Tory government will allow their dividends and pensions and bribes from industry to be affected long term is another story. Our trade agreement with the Australians will bring a bunch of BBQ bearing fruit pickers to replace the EU fruit pickers each year - I would expect similar trade deals to get wages in other sectors of the economy back to where the Tories want them longer term.

 

Because it's conflating two issues.

 

Firstly, wages in Europe are up in all those areas, sometimes up to three/four times as much as the UK, it's in the thread previously, so to say this is a brexit bonus is ridiculous straw clutching, yet is being wheeled out as such. But it is all based on a false metric anyway as pandemic level wages are being used to work out the average which massively skews the results, as does the fact that most lower paid workers lost their jobs, relatively, at the beginning of the pandemic raising the avarage further. Real growth is behind inflation and growth is stalled at pre pandemic levels still, no matter how many will harump Q2Q metrics, for the vast, vast majority no matter how the gov try to spin it and will lead to real suffering in the short, medium and long term unless something is done. Look at who we have governing and tell me, do you see this happening?

 

Secondly, the things that are Brexit related specifically, shortages on the shelves etc are being linked to covid which they are not, it's becuase the whole UK supply system outsourced as much as humanly possible and they, those responsible for brexit, have just made it much more difficult and costly to import/export, yet they are intent on blaming the forrins. In the UK we are just being shown for the lack of vision, forsight and investment. Tory austerity and free market ideology laid bare and, again, this is going to lead to short, medium and long term harm to millions upon millions. Both individuals and people/families will suffer for this abject failure of government.

 

Two issues which are making the other inexplicibly worse, one we needed to react to and one we needed to plan for and 'we've' been found wanting in our response to both.

 

You can't just choose which supports your argument and obscure those that don't, it's simply dishonest to do so.

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46 minutes ago, M_B said:

It's a given right? Not sure why folks are arguing with Gnasher really. Seems to be a circular argument in this thread.

 

Brexit (and covid) have lessened the suppy of labour which has resulted in increased wages and job opportunities. Good news for the worker, bad news for company profits and/or the end consumer.

 

Freedom of movement was always about having an abundant supply of labour, which naturally resulted in lower wages and fewer opportunities. Not great for those on the receiving end, but good news for the consumer, company profits, and the economy (in theory).

 

Brexit has raised wages and opportunities in some sectors. At least in the short term. Whether or not this Tory government will allow their dividends and pensions and bribes from industry to be affected long term is another story. Our trade agreement with the Australians will bring a bunch of BBQ bearing fruit pickers to replace the EU fruit pickers each year - I would expect similar trade deals to get wages in other sectors of the economy back to where the Tories want them longer term.

Good post. In their defence I think some posters are playing the man and taking their eye off the ball. A lot of Labour members failure to admit to simple supply and demand issues regarding employment is giving the Conservatives a free hit, and they're smashing it straight out the park, it'll unfortunately mean they'll walk another election.

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42 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Good post. In their defence I think some posters are playing the man and taking their eye off the ball. A lot of Labour members failure to admit to simple supply and demand issues regarding employment is giving the Conservatives a free hit, and they're smashing it straight out the park, it'll unfortunately mean they'll walk another election.

I'll get my "I love Kier" t-shirt out knowing how well you previous predictions have gone. Labour government incoming 2024.

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3 minutes ago, skend04 said:

I'll get my "I love Kier" t-shirt out knowing how well you previous predictions have gone. Labour government incoming 2024.

Yawn, and as I mention posters playing the man not the ball.

 

 

I take it you're talking about my prediction that Brexit would split the Tories? Well it did cause the downfall of two tory prime ministers and various other high calibre Conservatives figures such as George Osborne. I admit I didn't factor in the tories recieving the kiss of life from Jo Swinson and l the lib dems, the  Dup, the BBC and the right wing of the Labour Party, some of whom then went and fucked  off to form the pro EU Change UK party ( whatever become of them?).

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The Tories are 2-1 ON, to win most seats at the next election. Starmer is 5-1 to be next PM. Wait till the tories get their act together and the Boris/Laura tourbus rattles up am down the motorway talking soundbite shit.

 

If Labour Party members want to fly the flag for Romanian fruit pickers, Latvian lorry drivers and the Brussels billionaire elite who control the EU the Labour party will get fucking slaughtered again at the next election. Sorry but its the truth.

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Apparently, this is an exchange between some FBPE bloke - perfectly filling the role of the kind of twat @Gnasher has been railing against for five years - and a Bulgarian woman living in London.

 

Screenshot_2021-10-05-17-28-38-72_0b2fce7a16bf2b728d6ffa28c8d60efb.jpg

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I'm happy now, i think we can all relax, it looks like they really have a plan this time...

 

I also like how he talks of Scotland like an abused spouse, that'll steady some nerves north of the border.

 

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