Should the UK remain a member of the EU

[Bruce Spanner]

Good then that the India trade deal leads to a lot of ‘non white’ being given visas for manual work.

 

Gotta replace the forrins, right?

[Davelfc]

Mobile operator EE will charge new customers extra to use their mobile phones in Europe from January.

 

Those joining or upgrading from 7 July 2021 will be charged £2 a day to use their allowances in 47 European destinations from January 2022.

EE previously said it had no plans to reintroduce roaming charges in Europe.

It is the first UK operator to reintroduce the charges since the Brexit trade deal was signed at the end of December. 

 

Since 2017, mobile networks in EU countries have not been allowed to charge customers extra to use their phones in other EU countries.

There are some "fair use" limits, for example, you cannot get a mobile phone contract from Romania and then use it all year round in Italy.

 

In January 2021, EE, O2, Three and Vodafone all stated they had no plans to reintroduce roaming charges, despite Brexit giving them the option to do so.

EE said on Thursday that introducing the charges would "support investment into our UK based customer service and leading UK network". 

However, it will not charge UK customers extra to use their phones in the Republic of Ireland.

Customers travelling to the 47 affected countries will be able to buy 30-day passes to use their home tariff abroad. The cost of those will depend on which tariff customers are on.

 

On Wednesday, it was reported that O2 was going to reintroduce roaming charges.

However, it is merely adding a "fair use" data cap of 25GB a month and will not charge customers more to use their phones in the EU.

 

Fair use limits are normal and were allowed when the UK was still part of the EU. From next month, Three will be reducing its fair use limit from 20GB a month to 12GB. 

 

The UK's trade deal with the EU says that both sides will encourage operators to have "transparent and reasonable rates" for roaming, but it did not ban charges.

The government's guidelines encouraged people traveling in Europe to check with their mobile operators to find out about any roaming charges.

[Pureblood]

Get Kevin Bacon to do another advert about how great roaming charges are and that nobody gives a fuck about NI. 

[Anubis]

Six EEs of Kevin Bacon.

[Davelfc]

How am I going to be an optimist about this?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

30 minutes ago, Impostor said:

How am I going to be an optimist about this?

Just keep telling yourself that market forces will improve pay & conditions for workers  - y'know, the way they always do.

[Gnasher]

1 hour ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Just keep telling yourself that market forces will improve pay & conditions for workers  - y'know, the way they always do.

It's not market forces that have given bricklayers/waitresses/fruit pickers a well earned pay rise since Brexit Angry its the removal of EU market manipulation, swathes of cheap workers to suppress pay and keep wages low  it really seems to fuckinv irk a few on here that a hod carrier or farm worker has finally got a few strings to their bow  

 

A 60% pay rise for fruit pickers was more than overdue. As for the IN irish situation a few were so concerned with yesterday' didn't the DUP and the people of NI get a mammoth payout to support brexit and prop up a tory government?  So Brexit hasn't been that bad for them either..

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-dup-deal-brexit-legal-mps-parliament-vote-a8226056.html

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

4 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

It's not market forces that have given bricklayers/waitresses/fruit pickers a well earned pay rise since Brexit 

You were claiming that it's Workers' Playtime thanks to good old supply and demand.

 

Make your mind up.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

7 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

As for the IN irish situation a few were so concerned with yesterday' didn't the DUP and the people of NI get a mammoth payout to support brexit and prop up a tory government?  So Brexit hasn't been that bad for them either..

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-dup-deal-brexit-legal-mps-parliament-vote-a8226056.html

 

Wow.

 

I know you don't care about NI, but if you are going to post about it, at least think it through first.

[Gnasher]

7 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Wow.

 

I know you don't care about NI, but if you are going to post about it, at least think it through first.

It's not on the top of my priorities I'll admit. Anyway what de ye tink about fruit pickers getting a 60" pay rise? 

[Strontium]

16 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Anyway what de ye tink about fruit pickers getting a 60" pay rise? 

 

If fruit pickers get a 60% pay rise, but everything is 60% more expensive, where is the advantage to anyone?

[No2]

4 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

It’s not that simple. If the wages of agricultural workers go up, 2 things can happen. The cost is either passed to the consumer via a price increase or the millionaire landowners/farmers get a reduced return on their capital invested in the land. I think the latter is more likely as they face increased competition from non EU countries so harder to pass on price rises. 

This post won't age well.

[Strontium]

6 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

It’s not that simple. If the wages of agricultural workers go up, 2 things can happen. The cost is either passed to the consumer via a price increase or the millionaire landowners/farmers get a reduced return on their capital invested in the land. I think the latter is more likely as they face increased competition from non EU countries so harder to pass on price rises. 

 

Farm profits are razor thin as it is, not sure it would be as easy to just swallow the extra cost as you suggest.

 

But I was talking hypotheticals and generals really; Gnasher likes to pretend that we could just double everyone's pay and that the cost of that won't be passed onto anyone.

[No2]

19 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

Probably not. The key will be whether the NFI succeeds in restricting imports so as to be able to maintain higher prices. If they do, then yes the price of home grown food will go up along with agricultural land values. 

Homegrown food will be rebranded as premium British food when it's the same as it was yesterday, just dearer. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 hours ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

The cost is either passed to the consumer via a price increase or the millionaire landowners/farmers get a reduced return on their capital invested in the land.

Oooh, what will it be, what will it beeee????

 

Will the gazillionaire best buddies of the right-wing Government take the financial hit? Or will it be left to us schmucks to pick up the tab again.

 

The suspense is... well, non-existent, really.

[Gnasher]

4 hours ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

If fruit pickers get a 60% pay rise, but everything is 60% more expensive, where is the advantage to anyone?

I'd be very surprised if vegetables/fruit rise by 60%. Anyway havnt supermarkets made hay during the pandemic? Plus they've received generous tax payers handouts, be interesting when they bump up prices.

[Gnasher]

5 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

You were claiming that it's Workers' Playtime thanks to good old supply and demand.

 

Make your mind up.

Angry supply and demand has been unfairly weighted against the poor and working immigrants. The game has been slighted for the beneficial to abuse. If you artificially increase the Labour pool you can artificially suppress wages. Britain is now undergoing a Labour/wage realignment to what an employee is naturally worth to the employer.

 

You surely cant veiw a hod carrier from Hull or Scunthorpe having his first wage rise for five years as a bad thing?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Just now, Gnasher said:

You surely cant veiw a hod carrier from Hull or Scunthorpe having his first wage rise for five years as a bad thing?

You surely aren't still pretending that you think I do?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

8 hours ago, Impostor said:

Mobile operator EE will charge new customers extra to use their mobile phones in Europe from January.

 

Those joining or upgrading from 7 July 2021 will be charged £2 a day to use their allowances in 47 European destinations from January 2022.

EE previously said it had no plans to reintroduce roaming charges in Europe.

It is the first UK operator to reintroduce the charges since the Brexit trade deal was signed at the end of December

 

[Gnasher]

9 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

You surely aren't still pretending that you think I do?

No it was clumsily put. I'm trying to point out that these various above inflation wage rises in construction, agriculture etc proves that the EU policy of free movement of labour did suppress wages. People like Tim Martin bemoaning on subject of labour shortages within the service industry is as satisfying as it is ironic, the solution of course for bosses like Martin is staring them in the face, increase wages.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 hour ago, Gnasher said:

No it was clumsily put. I'm trying to point out that these various above inflation wage rises in construction, agriculture etc proves that the EU policy of free movement of labour did suppress wages. People like Tim Martin bemoaning on subject of labour shortages within the service industry is as satisfying as it is ironic, the solution of course for bosses like Martin is staring them in the face, increase wages.

I'm trying to point out that those wage rises don't prove anything about free movement.  There are lots of factors that influence wage rates.  The supply of labour is an important factor, but it's far from the only one.  Similarly, Brexit is really not the only factor suppressing the supply of migrant labour right now. If we want to see the real effects of Brexit on wages, we will have to wait until a "normal" post-pandemic period.

 

(My guess is that, by that time, this Tory Government, who were the main promoters of Brexit, will have made moves to make sure that it's workers - not their gazillionaire landowning, property speculating friends and donors - who will take the inevitable economic hit.)

[Gnasher]

39 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

I'm trying to point out that those wage rises don't prove anything about free movement.  There are lots of factors that influence wage rates.  The supply of labour is an important factor, but it's far from the only one.  Similarly, Brexit is really not the only factor suppressing the supply of migrant labour right now. If we want to see the real effects of Brexit on wages, we will have to wait until a "normal" post-pandemic period.

 

(My guess is that, by that time, this Tory Government, who were the main promoters of Brexit, will have made moves to make sure that it's workers - not their gazillionaire landowning, property speculating friends and donors - who will take the inevitable economic hit.)

I agree with your last paragraph but that's tories being tories. As for wage rises whilst obviously not the only reason the evidence that wage rises in certain professions have gone up partly/mainly because of Brexit is becoming overwhelming and undeniable.

[No2]

2 hours ago, Gnasher said:

No it was clumsily put. I'm trying to point out that these various above inflation wage rises in construction, agriculture etc proves that the EU policy of free movement of labour did suppress wages. People like Tim Martin bemoaning on subject of labour shortages within the service industry is as satisfying as it is ironic, the solution of course for bosses like Martin is staring them in the face, increase wages.

The pub and hospitality trade are struggling for staff throughout Europe. It's almost like people have looked at an industry that's been shut for a year and decided that could potentially be an unstable career choice. I may swerve that one.

[Gnasher]

20 minutes ago, No2 said:

The pub and hospitality trade are struggling for staff throughout Europe. It's almost like people have looked at an industry that's been shut for a year and decided that could potentially be an unstable career choice. I may swerve that one.

Yeah it is a hard hit industry, it's also similar to construction where a lot of workers veiw the job as temporary until they go off and do something else, I'm talking about students in out of term times or younger workers doing a bit of building site work to gain a bit of capital until they do something else.

[Gnasher]

Ha here we go, major supermarkets like Tesco are meeting Boris Johnson to push for temporary overseas visas to fill warehouse and haulage jobs. Their could be a shortage of Strawberries for Wimbledon.. I was waiting for that one..

 

Supermarkets have been making fucking hay during this pandemic..

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/08/business-supermarkets-government-rishi-sunak-coronavirus

 

'Industry cheifs are holding meetings with govt officials, yeah I bet they are..they could try upping wages and halting govt handouts..

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/25/uk-facing-summer-of-food-shortages-due-to-lack-of-lorry-drivers