Jump to content

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, Stouffer said:

I must be one of the lucky ones as my boss is helpful, encourages my development, makes sure I don't take too much on, creates opportunities and fights to make sure I get any pay rises I'm due.

You’re self employed aren’t you? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Rico1304 said:

End of year calibration sessions are fucking brutal places. I’ve never heard so much shit spoken in my life.  I could have quite easily murdered people in those.  Seeing insecure managers mark down high performing staff because they were jealous or scared of being replaced was infuriating.  One cunt who did it regularly is all over LinkedIn spouting about teamwork - I remember him stiffing a bloke on his team who ‘didn’t display the core values’ despite being fucking ace at his actual job.  

I hate that bullshit."Core values" "living and breathing our values ect. Does anyone really believe in this shite?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, littletedwest said:

I hate that bullshit."Core values" "living and breathing our values ect. Does anyone really believe in this shite?

It’s an industry in itself. Since the personnel department morphed into HR the people who couldn’t hack it in the real world and live in HR have to ‘add value’. When in actual fact they destroy value because they create red tape and useless and often fucking stupid policies. 
 

Don’t start me off on Insights. ‘What colour are you? I’m red and a bit green’. 
 

Me: I’m the colour that thinks this is a load of old fucking bollocks and no more sophisticated than a horoscope.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 25/06/2020 at 17:54, Rico1304 said:

Remember a few weeks ago in the trans thread when someone said ‘who’s forcing you to use that language?’  This is it happening. 

No it isn't. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Rico1304 said:

It was possible to be shit at your job, but display the core values and get a bigger bonus than someone who was good but wouldn’t play the game.  Criminal. 

Core values are hilarious, in a cringe-comedy way.  Our supposed values are just vague and meaningless words that the managers have been told to cram into all the team briefings and one-to-one staff reviews.  What happens is they just say whatever it is they want to say and then stretch these meaningless phrases across it, so they can tell their bosses that they've done a good job.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m currently in the middle of updating my CV, what a fucking load of bollocks this is. 
 

Going on about exceeding KPI’s, liaising with key stakeholders and developing professional practices. 
 

All fucking pointless when I then put Winterbourne View in my employment history. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The absolute fucking state of the dickhead who thought Jane was in the wrong.
 

https://www.askamanager.org/2021/10/my-employee-wasnt-respectful-enough-after-the-company-messed-up-her-paycheck.html

 

 

my employee wasn’t respectful enough after the company messed up her paycheck

by ALISON GREEN on OCTOBER 19, 2021
 

A reader writes:

 

I’m not comfortable with one of my new staff members and how overconfident she is. Her work is great and she needed very little training but she’s got very big britches.

 

“Jane” has only been with us for two months. Just today she asked for a meeting with me and our payroll manager. It turns out payroll made an error entering her direct deposit information that resulted in Jane not getting paid, not once but two times.

Our company requires potential candidates to complete sample assignments during the interview process and we pay them an hourly contractor rate. It turns out she didn’t get paid for her assignment period, or for the next full pay cycle. The payroll employee apologized directly to Jane in an email, because it was their error in entering her information and not following up/fixing it that resulted in Jane not getting paid. Jane was able to show emails back and forth where she checked in with the payroll employee and asked if it was fixed, which they confirmed it was. Today was payday and Jane didn’t get paid. She checked with the employee again and they acknowledged that they “thought” it was fixed. It’s upsetting for Jane, I understand, but I think she was out of line about the whole thing. People make mistakes.

 

Neither payroll nor I knew anything about it until today. We both apologized and assured her the issue would be handled. After that, she looked at me and the payroll manager and said, “I appreciate your apology, but I need you both to understand that this can’t happen again. This has put me under financial strain and I can’t continue to work for COMPANY if this isn’t corrected today.”

 

The payroll manager was heavily in agreement, but I was speechless that she’d speak to management like that.

 

Payroll handled the whole thing and cut her a check with the okay from HR. Jane had referenced that not being paid put her in financial hardship and unable to pay bills, so HR allowed the use of the employee hardship fund and gave her $500 in gift cards so she can get groceries and gas and catch up on bills. I’m just kind of floored that she’s getting gift cards after speaking to her superiors like that. I’m also uncomfortable because why is our company responsible for her fiscal irresponsibility? Her personal finances or debts are not the company’s responsibility. I just don’t think it’s the company’s responsibility to give her more than what she’s earned (the extra $500 from the employee emergency relief fund) to fix things for her if she overspent or didn’t prioritize her bills or save smartly. We also don’t know if she is actually experiencing a financial hardship or just claiming she was.

 

HR allowed her paid time to go to the bank today and deposit her check. I told our HR person that while it’s not okay Jane didn’t get paid, the way she approached it was uncalled for. HR told me, “She’s right, it can’t happen again and it shouldn’t have happened at all.”

 

I’m getting tired of the respect gap I’m seeing with younger staff. I think Jane would be better suited in a different department. I’m not comfortable having her on my team since it’s obvious she doesn’t understand she’s entry-level and not in charge.

 

Should I wait a while before suggesting she transfer to a different department?

 

 

I’m going to say this bluntly: you are very, very wrong about this situation, both as a manager and as a human.

Your company didn’t pay Jane money they owed her in the timeframe in which they were legally obligated to pay it. They did this twice.

Your company messed up, and their mistake impacted someone’s income. That’s a very big deal.

The payroll department handled this exactly as they should: they apologized, cut her a check immediately, and helped repair the damage their mistake had caused. Jane shouldn’t have to suffer for their error, and their remedies were appropriate and warranted.

 

Your objection to this because the company shouldn’t be responsible for Jane’s finances is nonsensical. Your company is responsible for paying the wages they’ve agreed to pay in the timeline they’ve agreed to pay them in. They didn’t meet that obligation, and so they fixed it. That’s not about them being responsible for Jane’s debts; it’s about them being responsible for adhering to a legal wage agreement and treating an employee well after failing at a basic responsibility and causing that person hardship.

 

Suggesting that someone who needs the paycheck they earned to be delivered to them on time “didn’t prioritize her bills or save smartly” is wildly out of touch with the reality of many people’s finances in this country and how many people live paycheck to paycheck (particularly someone entry-level who just started a job two months ago and may have been unemployed before that). But frankly, even if Jane didn’t save smartly, it’s irrelevant; your company’s mistake is what caused the problem, and it’s what’s at issue here.

 

Your speculation that Jane might be lying about her financial situation is bizarre and reflects poorly on you. It’s irrelevant and you don’t seem to have any reason for wondering that other than an apparent desire to cast Jane in a bad light.

 

You’re absolutely right that there’s a respect gap in this situation — but it’s from you toward your employees, not from Jane toward her employer.

 

There’s nothing disrespectful about Jane advocating for herself and explaining that she’d be unable to stay in the job if the payroll mistakes weren’t corrected. She gets to make that choice for herself, it’s not an unreasonable one, and it’s not disrespectful for her to spell it out. In fact, I’d argue it’s actively respectful since respect requires clear, polite, direct communication and she gave you that.

When you say Jane doesn’t seem to understand she’s entry-level and not in charge … Jane is very much in charge of where she’s willing to work and what she will and won’t tolerate. Every employee is, regardless of how junior or senior they might be.

 

Corporate power structures require deference in things like decision-making on a project, but not the sort of obeisance in all things that you seem to be looking for.

 

Somewhere along the way, you picked up a very warped idea of what employees owe their employers, but you don’t seem to have thought much about what employers owe their employees. You urgently need to do some rethinking and recalibration if you’re going to continue managing people.

 
  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Anubis said:

The absolute fucking state of the dickhead who thought Jane was in the wrong.
 

https://www.askamanager.org/2021/10/my-employee-wasnt-respectful-enough-after-the-company-messed-up-her-paycheck.html

 

 

my employee wasn’t respectful enough after the company messed up her paycheck

by ALISON GREEN on OCTOBER 19, 2021
 

A reader writes:

 

I’m not comfortable with one of my new staff members and how overconfident she is. Her work is great and she needed very little training but she’s got very big britches.

 

“Jane” has only been with us for two months. Just today she asked for a meeting with me and our payroll manager. It turns out payroll made an error entering her direct deposit information that resulted in Jane not getting paid, not once but two times.

 

Our company requires potential candidates to complete sample assignments during the interview process and we pay them an hourly contractor rate. It turns out she didn’t get paid for her assignment period, or for the next full pay cycle. The payroll employee apologized directly to Jane in an email, because it was their error in entering her information and not following up/fixing it that resulted in Jane not getting paid. Jane was able to show emails back and forth where she checked in with the payroll employee and asked if it was fixed, which they confirmed it was. Today was payday and Jane didn’t get paid. She checked with the employee again and they acknowledged that they “thought” it was fixed. It’s upsetting for Jane, I understand, but I think she was out of line about the whole thing. People make mistakes.

 

Neither payroll nor I knew anything about it until today. We both apologized and assured her the issue would be handled. After that, she looked at me and the payroll manager and said, “I appreciate your apology, but I need you both to understand that this can’t happen again. This has put me under financial strain and I can’t continue to work for COMPANY if this isn’t corrected today.”

 

The payroll manager was heavily in agreement, but I was speechless that she’d speak to management like that.

 

Payroll handled the whole thing and cut her a check with the okay from HR. Jane had referenced that not being paid put her in financial hardship and unable to pay bills, so HR allowed the use of the employee hardship fund and gave her $500 in gift cards so she can get groceries and gas and catch up on bills. I’m just kind of floored that she’s getting gift cards after speaking to her superiors like that. I’m also uncomfortable because why is our company responsible for her fiscal irresponsibility? Her personal finances or debts are not the company’s responsibility. I just don’t think it’s the company’s responsibility to give her more than what she’s earned (the extra $500 from the employee emergency relief fund) to fix things for her if she overspent or didn’t prioritize her bills or save smartly. We also don’t know if she is actually experiencing a financial hardship or just claiming she was.

 

HR allowed her paid time to go to the bank today and deposit her check. I told our HR person that while it’s not okay Jane didn’t get paid, the way she approached it was uncalled for. HR told me, “She’s right, it can’t happen again and it shouldn’t have happened at all.”

 

I’m getting tired of the respect gap I’m seeing with younger staff. I think Jane would be better suited in a different department. I’m not comfortable having her on my team since it’s obvious she doesn’t understand she’s entry-level and not in charge.

 

Should I wait a while before suggesting she transfer to a different department?

 

 

I’m going to say this bluntly: you are very, very wrong about this situation, both as a manager and as a human.

 

Your company didn’t pay Jane money they owed her in the timeframe in which they were legally obligated to pay it. They did this twice.

Your company messed up, and their mistake impacted someone’s income. That’s a very big deal.

The payroll department handled this exactly as they should: they apologized, cut her a check immediately, and helped repair the damage their mistake had caused. Jane shouldn’t have to suffer for their error, and their remedies were appropriate and warranted.

 

Your objection to this because the company shouldn’t be responsible for Jane’s finances is nonsensical. Your company is responsible for paying the wages they’ve agreed to pay in the timeline they’ve agreed to pay them in. They didn’t meet that obligation, and so they fixed it. That’s not about them being responsible for Jane’s debts; it’s about them being responsible for adhering to a legal wage agreement and treating an employee well after failing at a basic responsibility and causing that person hardship.

 

Suggesting that someone who needs the paycheck they earned to be delivered to them on time “didn’t prioritize her bills or save smartly” is wildly out of touch with the reality of many people’s finances in this country and how many people live paycheck to paycheck (particularly someone entry-level who just started a job two months ago and may have been unemployed before that). But frankly, even if Jane didn’t save smartly, it’s irrelevant; your company’s mistake is what caused the problem, and it’s what’s at issue here.

 

Your speculation that Jane might be lying about her financial situation is bizarre and reflects poorly on you. It’s irrelevant and you don’t seem to have any reason for wondering that other than an apparent desire to cast Jane in a bad light.

 

You’re absolutely right that there’s a respect gap in this situation — but it’s from you toward your employees, not from Jane toward her employer.

 

There’s nothing disrespectful about Jane advocating for herself and explaining that she’d be unable to stay in the job if the payroll mistakes weren’t corrected. She gets to make that choice for herself, it’s not an unreasonable one, and it’s not disrespectful for her to spell it out. In fact, I’d argue it’s actively respectful since respect requires clear, polite, direct communication and she gave you that.

When you say Jane doesn’t seem to understand she’s entry-level and not in charge … Jane is very much in charge of where she’s willing to work and what she will and won’t tolerate. Every employee is, regardless of how junior or senior they might be.

 

Corporate power structures require deference in things like decision-making on a project, but not the sort of obeisance in all things that you seem to be looking for.

 

Somewhere along the way, you picked up a very warped idea of what employees owe their employers, but you don’t seem to have thought much about what employers owe their employees. You urgently need to do some rethinking and recalibration if you’re going to continue managing people.

 

What a brilliant reply to an absolute twat! And HR were bang on in response to their fuck ups!

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Getting paid is the one thing an employer cannot get wrong.  It fucking grinds my gears when it happens and the normal HR response is ‘we’ll sort it next month’. Fuck that, get it sorted out now. I’ve had massive rows with people in HR about shit like this. It’s always like talking to a moron. Which they are because they work in HR. 
 

I hate HR. 

  • Upvote 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really can’t tell you how annoying I find this. I’ve had invoices of millions of pounds paid same day because of errors but then been told it’s impossible to pay someone £1k because of ‘payroll’. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rico1304 said:

Getting paid is the one thing an employer cannot get wrong.  It fucking grinds my gears when it happens and the normal HR response is ‘we’ll sort it next month’. Fuck that, get it sorted out now. I’ve had massive rows with people in HR about shit like this. It’s always like talking to a moron. Which they are because they work in HR. 
 

I hate HR. 

 

16 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

I really can’t tell you how annoying I find this. I’ve had invoices of millions of pounds paid same day because of errors but then been told it’s impossible to pay someone £1k because of ‘payroll’. 

Bang on, on both!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 03/03/2021 at 08:12, YorkshireRed said:

This is my ‘go to’ thread when my decision to go self employed hits the inevitable bumps in the road. 
 

Although I’m financially worse off, I’m reminded that I’m considerably better off in every other way.

 

I feel your pain but I’m glad it’s your pain and not mine. Never again!

 

Thanks and in your faces. 

 

The last few years since I've been studying full time alongside trying to keep business ticking over and having a massive depressive episode have been really grim. Then being entitled to no support at all during lockdown has been really difficult just keeping my head above water.

 

However, I was thinking about things the other day. My friend/semi business partner in something new I am moving into also works for a very large multi national and they have a team meeting every morning on Teams. With them working from home he's been doing some days up at the farm I work out of as it's quieter and he can get more work done. Every time I hear one of these meetings and see how pointless they always are I am reminded exactly why I'd rather not be back involved in that shit anymore.

 

I'd like more money as right now I'm seriously skint, however, at the same time I have close to zero bills, no mortgage and own a couple of cars that are worth more than some peoples houses (I bought them at way lower prices than that). 

 

Once I'm finished with being back at Uni next year I reckon between the degree and my past experience I can either go somewhere in an engineering management type job or in one of the big finance type companies and be earning silly money almost immediately. Accenture tried to headhunt me a few years ago and the further I got into the process the more I realised I just had no desire to be back in that kind of world again.

 

I have no desire to do so at all though as I'll be wanting to hang myself within months. I'd rather have less income, rally something sensible instead of a 100 grand money pit and have as much time to actually do what I want or work on stuff I'm interested in rather than being trapped in "blue sky thinking" style corporate hell.

 

 

On 04/03/2021 at 19:39, JagSquared said:

I’m a contractor and have recruitment agents rings me from time to time. 

 

From my experiences with recruitment agencies every single one of them is staffed by incompetent, lying bastards who know nothing about anything and just spout shite constantly. They are up there with estate agents and anyone who works in HR as being a net drain on humanity.  

 

 

 

 

On 08/04/2021 at 10:31, Section_31 said:

Why is it not the done thing to be asked why you're there and to reply "because I need a job?". 

 

 

Before going back into Uni I applied for night shift at the local Sainsbury's and didn't get it. I shop in there occasionally and actually know most of the staff etc. OK so actually asked the manager afterwards why I didn't get it when I was in there a bit later. 

 

Had the inevitable "you're too qualified so they're concerned you'll just leave". 

 

Problem was in the interview I had to give the usual shit pretending I saw the place as some kind of career, when the honest answer was "I have income from selling stuff, I just want something where I can come in, do some really basic work I don't need to think about and then go home. Oh and having discounted shopping is a nice perk too". 

 

Places claim they want honesty but they really actually don't as if I had said that they wouldn't have touched me with a barge pole. 

 

 

On 08/04/2021 at 13:13, Section_31 said:

 

It's very much a tool of the modern labour force, where once most people had a job at an organisation and went home at 5pm, now you have to be a 'brand', essentially a 24/7 Billy bullshitter. 

 

 

That description is about 99.9% of the lecturers at Uni. They post inane shit pretending to be doing some amazing shit, but then if you read the papers they publish it's mostly utter bullshit with no depth that doesn't expand knowledge or research at all.

 

 

On 09/04/2021 at 11:50, Section_31 said:

It wouldn't be so bad if the average company was genuinely grateful. The CEO gave a shout out to some wanker who'd worked right through the night during black Friday a few years back, he was laid off about three months later. 

 

I literally made myself ill working through lunchbreaks and shit and 10/12  hour days for people in my late 20s and early 30s, it's simply not worth it. 

 

I will have posted this on here before but the main thing I learned from working for others is that people don't give a fuck about you. 

 

Had a year on the sick as I was borderline suicidal in my 20's, largely because of work. When I got back it was very readily apparent that in a building of hundreds almost all of which wanted me to help them with stuff that other than the guy who worked under me no one give the remotest fuck whether I lived or died. I was treated even worse when I returned than before I was ill, because I had the audacity to be mentally ill. 

 

To quote Doug Stanhope "Don't work hard, you still die in the end" or as my grandad used to point out "see that graveyard son, most of those thought they were indispensable". 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Rico1304 said:

Getting paid is the one thing an employer cannot get wrong.  It fucking grinds my gears when it happens and the normal HR response is ‘we’ll sort it next month’. Fuck that, get it sorted out now. I’ve had massive rows with people in HR about shit like this. It’s always like talking to a moron. Which they are because they work in HR. 
 

I hate HR. 

Or "Personnel" as it used to be called. Theres the line in one of the Dirty Harry films, might be Magnum Force, where Harry is in a row with some jobsworth and he says "I was in Personnel for 15 years" "Personnel? Personnel's for Assholes"

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 09/04/2021 at 23:34, cloggypop said:

Wankers

My corporate strapline is "Fuck You Pay Me".

 

Im an independent contractor and whilst its not plain sailing I wouldnt be anything else for the remainder of my working life. Mission Statements, Core Values, 360 degree feedback, Corporate "Fun Days" ( an oxymoron if ever there was one) take it all and stick it up your arse.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Chairman Meow said:

Then being entitled to no support at all during lockdown has been really difficult just keeping my head above water.

This was certainly a downside. I’m a Limited Company Director, mainly because my then biggest Client needed me to be. I’ve had zero work from them since the pandemic and didn’t have accounts from a period to enable me to qualify for any government support. It’s been tricky but many have struggled and will continue to struggle far more than me.

 

I earned 80% less than my last corporate annual salary in 2020 and it will be something like 40% less this year. 
 

I still wouldn’t change it though. The non financial benefits are definitely more than worth the income hit. Maybe not 80% though, if I can get it to 25% less next year, that’ll do me. 
 

This week I’ve had to work hard, it’s been stressful. If I had to live like this every week, I’d be in serious trouble, no matter how much I was earning. Instead, I’m taking the day off. Going out with the dog and will enjoy a nice coffee and cake in a dog friendly cafe. 
 

Your mental health comes first. Don’t let others judge you. Be kind to yourself and recognise that ‘success’ comes in many different boxes. I try to see mine as:

 

1. My business is still here. It’s profitable and it allows me a much better work life balance.

 

2. Partly because of No.1, I’m still alive, still in a relationship and I have time to appreciate the important things.

 

3. I think I’m a better person, certainly more empathetic. Still a cunt in many ways, but at least I have some saving graces now. 
 

4. Every day I don’t have to work in a corporate environment is priceless. 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Iv'e read some of those crappy management books but the ONLY one I remember was written by a bloke called Townsend who turned around Avis Rent a Car.

 

It gets to the chapter headed Personnel Department. It simply states 'Fire this Department'.

 

Then goes on to the next chapter.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 19/07/2021 at 14:08, lifetime fan said:

I’m currently in the middle of updating my CV, what a fucking load of bollocks this is. 
 

Going on about exceeding KPI’s, liaising with key stakeholders and developing professional practices. 
 

All fucking pointless when I then put Winterbourne View in my employment history. A

Easily remedied, Lifey:

 

* "Worked as an undercover investigator for the Care Standards Commission at Winterbourne View."

* "Worked next to Naga Mulchetty on the BBC Breakfast sofa for a stint."

 

Looks better now, doesn't it?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, YorkshireRed said:

This was certainly a downside. I’m a Limited Company Director, mainly because my then biggest Client needed me to be. I’ve had zero work from them since the pandemic and didn’t have accounts from a period to enable me to qualify for any government support. It’s been tricky but many have struggled and will continue to struggle far more than me.

 

I earned 80% less than my last corporate annual salary in 2020 and it will be something like 40% less this year. 
 

I still wouldn’t change it though. The non financial benefits are definitely more than worth the income hit. Maybe not 80% though, if I can get it to 25% less next year, that’ll do me. 
 

This week I’ve had to work hard, it’s been stressful. If I had to live like this every week, I’d be in serious trouble, no matter how much I was earning. Instead, I’m taking the day off. Going out with the dog and will enjoy a nice coffee and cake in a dog friendly cafe. 
 

Your mental health comes first. Don’t let others judge you. Be kind to yourself and recognise that ‘success’ comes in many different boxes. I try to see mine as:

 

1. My business is still here. It’s profitable and it allows me a much better work life balance.

 

2. Partly because of No.1, I’m still alive, still in a relationship and I have time to appreciate the important things.

 

3. I think I’m a better person, certainly more empathetic. Still a cunt in many ways, but at least I have some saving graces now. 
 

4. Every day I don’t have to work in a corporate environment is priceless. 

5. Working at home I'm available for parties with the lesbians at any time

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, Rico1304 said:

Getting paid is the one thing an employer cannot get wrong.  It fucking grinds my gears when it happens and the normal HR response is ‘we’ll sort it next month’. Fuck that, get it sorted out now. I’ve had massive rows with people in HR about shit like this. It’s always like talking to a moron. Which they are because they work in HR. 
 

I hate HR. 

 

People give civil servants shit, but HR is truly the repository of the mediocre.

 

As a whole, they are only marginally less stupid than estate agents.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My old man told me once "be good at making it or selling it" that's where there money is and you're less likely to get laid off. HR makes that a lie, they create fuck all but are seemingly indispensable.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We’ve just let someone go from HR whose CV is stellar - I mean top brands and organisations.  She is absolutely fucking hopeless.  She literally couldn’t even organise a Christmas do.  Thing is the ones left are even worse! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×