Danny Baker's..

[moof]

3 minutes ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

As for this entire debacle. He posted a picture, probably out of ignorance. I've no real issue with him getting the sack, but calling him a racist, putting him the same box as white supremacists who lynched black people or gassed Jews... no. That's silly. He did something daft and paid the price. The rush to label people is pretty worrying, in my view. Along with the social media mindset that has become the norm for many over the last decade, there has come some disturbing side effects. This moral outrage at everything, always, is becoming fucking retarded ridiculous.

Who the hell put him in the same box as white supremacists who lynched black people or gassed Jews? 

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, moof said:

Who the hell put him in the same box as white supremacists who lynched black people or gassed Jews? 

You didn't see the post above calling him a white supremacist? The uproar over this, as with many things, is group-think outrage. 

 

[moof]

1 minute ago, The Woolster said:

 

I did not see my dad as an ape, he just looked like one... some white people look like apes, like Gareth Bale. The vast majority of black people do not look like apes.

 

Jokes aside though, if it is structural and unconscious, then intent is absolutely relevant! It signifies the difference between someone who is ignorant, perhaps through circumstance, and someone who is an actual racist.

You can be ignorant, not virulently racist, and still post a racist picture on twitter. I never said Danny Baker hates black people or sees himself as superior, but he posted a racist picture. Whether or not his intention was to ridicule someone based on race, that was the effect.  

[moof]

1 minute ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

You didn't see the post above calling him a white supremacist? The uproar over this, as with many things, is group-think outrage. 

 

Oh, some twitter head the ball? 

[moof]

41 minutes ago, Strontium Dog said:

 

I understand privilege just fine. What I'm doing is pointing out that it doesn't make a jot of sense.

lol

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, moof said:

Oh, some twitter head the ball? 

Yeah. I was making a comment about that, especially at the end where I'm talking about social media directly. I don't think it's unfair to cite one of the cunts, like. It's not like he's alone in thinking that way. 

[moof]

Just now, Numero Veinticinco said:

Yeah. I was making a comment about that, especially at the end where I'm talking about social media directly. I don't think it's unfair to cite one of the cunts, like. It's not like he's alone in thinking that way. 

Fair enough, mate. That bullshit barely registers with me, obviously anyone calling him a white supremacist is well off the mark 

[cloggypop]

17 minutes ago, moof said:

Who the hell put him in the same box as white supremacists who lynched black people or gassed Jews? 

Some blert on Twitter that outraged redheart so much that he felt the need to post it on here. 

[Remmie]

34 minutes ago, Elite said:

@dockers_strike

 

Anny truth in this theory that you're Danny Bakers dad?

The plot thickens....

[The Woolster]

4 minutes ago, moof said:

You can be ignorant, not virulently racist, and still post a racist picture on twitter. I never said Danny Baker hates black people or sees himself as superior, but he posted a racist picture. Whether or not his intention was to ridicule someone based on race, that was the effect.  

 

The picture in and of itself is not actually racist, is it? People have ascribed the meaning/intent to the picture, and if both parents were white, you would not say it was a racist picture.

 

It is clear that Baker is not ignorant of the possible connotations of picture, so the question is whether you believe him when he says it had not occurred to him, in which case it was not racist but he did make a mistake, or you don't believe him, in which case it is clearly a form of casual racism. Both are possible.

 

I guess you disagree with my view that calling everything that could potentially be racist as actually being racist might actually be damaging the fight against racism?

 

 

 

 

[moof]

Just now, The Woolster said:

 

The picture in and of itself is not actually racist, is it? People have ascribed the meaning/intent to the picture, and if both parents were white, you would not say it was a racist picture.

 

It is clear that Baker is not ignorant of the possible connotations of picture, so the question is whether you believe him when he says it had not occurred to him, in which case it was not racist but he did make a mistake, or you don't believe him, in which case it is clearly a form of casual racism. Both are possible.

 

I guess you disagree with my view that calling everything that could potentially be racist as actually being racist might actually be damaging the fight against racism?

 

 

 

 

 

I think calling things that are clearly racist, like a picture comparing a baby of African heritage to a chimp (the first baby with any kind of proximity to blackness in the history of the monarchy, no less), racist is good in the fight against racism. 

[moof]

In his statement released on Twitter on Friday, Baker said: “Following one of the worst days of my life I just want to formally apologise for the outrage I caused and explain how I got myself into this mess.

 

“I chose the wrong photo to illustrate a joke. Disastrously so.

“In attempting to lampoon privilege and the news cycle I went to a file of goofy pictures and saw the chimp dressed as a Lord and thought, ‘That’s the one!’

 

“Had I kept searching I might have chosen General Tom Thumb or even a baby in a crown. But I didn’t. God knows I wish had.”

The statement added: “Minutes later I was alerted by followers that this royal baby was of course mixed race and waves of panic and revulsion washed over me.

“F**k, what had I done? I needed no lessons on the centuries slurs equating simians and people of colour. Racism at it’s basest.

“I am aware black people do not need a white man to tell them this. Deleting it immediately and apologising for the awful gaffe I even foolishly tried to make light of it. (My situation that is, not the racism involved.) Too late and here I am.

“I would like once and for all to apologise to every single person who, quite naturally, took the awful connection at face value. I understand that and all of the clamour and opprobrium I have faced since. I am not feeling sorry for myself. I f****d up. Badly.

“But it was a genuine, naive and catastrophic mistake ...

“I am now paying the price for this crass and regrettable blunder and rightly so. Probably even this final word from me will extend the mania. (‘Dog whistle’ anyone?) I would like to thank friends on here for their kinder words and once again – I am so, so sorry.”

[3 Stacks]

2 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

As him @3 Stacks

Fuck off with that joke, man. It's not funny. Hades was legitimately deranged, don't group me in with that guy.

[Pureblood]

Just now, 3 Stacks said:

Fuck off with that joke, man. It's not funny. Hades was legitimately deranged, don't group me in with that guy.

Liked on behalf of the Archons.

[The Woolster]

9 minutes ago, moof said:

 

I think calling things that are clearly racist, like a picture comparing a baby of African heritage to a chimp (the first baby with any kind of proximity to blackness in the history of the monarchy, no less), racist is good in the fight against racism. 

*sigh*

If something has different possible meanings, then it is not clearly anything.

 

By the way, and I'm fine with it, because I don't think their is any intent, but some people of mixed heritage might take offence to being told they have proximity to blackness, they may consider it to be a little bit, well, racist... I'd probably try to refrain from using it in the future.

 

 

[moof]

2 minutes ago, The Woolster said:

*sigh*

If something has different possible meanings, then it is not clearly anything.

 

By the way, and I'm fine with it, because I don't think their is any intent, but some people of mixed heritage might take offence to being told they have proximity to blackness, they may consider it to be a little bit, well, racist... I'd probably try to refrain from using it in the future.

 

 

Nah, I’m cool. 

[cloggypop]

Danny Baker, when tweeting about football, always posts the same picture of I think Dustin Hoffman for a goal. He has repeated the same joke for literally years. 

 

Presumably he posted the same chimp picture as this one for all of the other royal babies. 

[Bjornebye]

1 hour ago, moof said:

In his statement released on Twitter on Friday, Baker said: “Following one of the worst days of my life I just want to formally apologise for the outrage I caused and explain how I got myself into this mess.

 

“I chose the wrong photo to illustrate a joke. Disastrously so.

“In attempting to lampoon privilege and the news cycle I went to a file of goofy pictures and saw the chimp dressed as a Lord and thought, ‘That’s the one!’

 

“Had I kept searching I might have chosen General Tom Thumb or even a baby in a crown. But I didn’t. God knows I wish had.”

The statement added: “Minutes later I was alerted by followers that this royal baby was of course mixed race and waves of panic and revulsion washed over me.

“F**k, what had I done? I needed no lessons on the centuries slurs equating simians and people of colour. Racism at it’s basest.

“I am aware black people do not need a white man to tell them this. Deleting it immediately and apologising for the awful gaffe I even foolishly tried to make light of it. (My situation that is, not the racism involved.) Too late and here I am.

“I would like once and for all to apologise to every single person who, quite naturally, took the awful connection at face value. I understand that and all of the clamour and opprobrium I have faced since. I am not feeling sorry for myself. I f****d up. Badly.

“But it was a genuine, naive and catastrophic mistake ...

“I am now paying the price for this crass and regrettable blunder and rightly so. Probably even this final word from me will extend the mania. (‘Dog whistle’ anyone?) I would like to thank friends on here for their kinder words and once again – I am so, so sorry.”

His initial responses yesterday were poorly worded and whilst that above is far more believable he has still managed a few lines to make himself look a dick. Had that been the first response I think a lot less people would be outraged. As I said yesterday, If the same BBC employee had been held in a higher regard, I very much doubt they would have sacked him. 

[Skidfingers McGonical]

1 hour ago, moof said:

You can be ignorant, not virulently racist, and still post a racist picture on twitter. I never said Danny Baker hates black people or sees himself as superior, but he posted a racist picture. Whether or not his intention was to ridicule someone based on race, that was the effect.  

The picture wasn’t racist on its own.

 

it was the added line of “Royal Baby leaves hospital” that prompted people to see the outrage.

 

if he had posted that picture with a line of “Gareth Bale’s first day at school” nobody would have batted an eye lid. Or if he’d have said nothing other than “Quality picture this”

[The Woolster]

38 minutes ago, moof said:

Nah, I’m cool. 

If you are really cool with it after being told that it could cause offence, then I am actually fucking offended by it.

 

Proximity to blackness is a term used to describe when white people are associated with or are integrated with black people/communities, so lets this clear when I say that being mixed race does not mean that I, or any other mixed race person, have a proximity to blackness, thanks.

 

[moof]

8 minutes ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

The picture wasn’t racist on its own.

 

it was the added line of “Royal Baby leaves hospital” that prompted people to see the outrage.

 

if he had posted that picture with a line of “Gareth Bale’s first day at school” nobody would have batted an eye lid. Or if he’d have said nothing other than “Quality picture this”

Obviously, mate. It was the fact he posted it about the baby that made it racist. Surely that goes without saying? 

[moof]

Just now, The Woolster said:

If you are really cool with it after being told that it could cause offence, then I am actually fucking offended by it.

 

Proximity to blackness is a term used to describe when white people are associated with or are integrated with black people/communities, so lets this clear when I say that being mixed race does not mean that I, or any other mixed race person, have a proximity to blackness, thanks.

 

What are you, a snowflake?

[Strontium]

I have thought about the claim that intent doesn't matter, and I now think it is objectively wrong rather than merely being something I disagree with.

 

Example: If you were to buy a ham sandwich for a starving homeless person as an act of kindness, but it transpired the homeless person was Muslim, then under "intent doesn't matter" rules, it would be a racist act, regardless of how it was intended. Which is patent nonsense. In my book it would only be racist if you gave a Muslim some ham with the full knowledge that he was Muslim and forbidden from eating it.

 

Intent matters.

[3 Stacks]

I've never heard of this guy, but looking him up right now, he's been in the media for 4 decades without any real scandal, no? I think it's way more likely he's just ignorant, in which case he clearly wasn't going to apologise right away when hordes of people online were attacking him from all sides. I think that's a perfectly normal human reaction. You don't just apologise about something you said when you don't realise you're in the wrong.

 

Then a day later when this thing has blown up and he's lost his livelihood, he's tried to make amends. That makes sense to me. He's behind with the times and that's his fault, but this is not outrageous, imo.

[moof]

Or you could exchange it for a cheese sandwich, like. 

 

Yes, in some specific instances intent does matter, just not in this one where an image has been broadcast to millions of people