Someone's having a real laugh - gollum?

[LFC64]

Surely you must ask the question as to why he didn't go with Mourino as his successor thoug?

 

If Ol Piss Head really, really wanted to put the club first before his legacy he wouldn't have let the following take place.

 

Let the team slide in quality like he has done

Let the midfield become the laughing stock it is now shown to being.

Relied on Giggs and bringing Scholes out of retirement to bost his midfield.

Bought a crock like RVP for one season.

Allowed his squad to age and not have ready to step in young quality ready and available.

Would have transfers in place for this season.

Would not have picked Moyes to be his succesor.

Would not have unsettled the squad by making out Rooney asked for a transfer.

Released his book so soon.

 

They are just a few of things that spring to mind about how Fergie has ensured he is revered for that little bit longer in the current day history of Man United.

 

That article by Harris is also spot on. Fergie has a hell of a lot to answer for and I think a lot of United's fans are now realising this.

 

All that Fergie wanted to do was to have a seat on the board/in the directors box like Boby Charlton.

 

I'd say he can be accused of allowing his own ego to take certain decisions against the club's interests  (racehorses spring to mind) 

[Major Tom]

Far from delighting in the failure of his successor he is probably in a very uncormfortable position . Fuck him and the club. 

 

In a nutshell.

[Tony Moanero]

Ferguson will look a prize prick if United sack Moyes.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

To the first question, magicrat had it right. I think Ferguson saw Mourinho as somewhat of an itinerant, not wanting to stick around and forge something of his own; a short term fix. Ferguson wanted stability and someone to build something, show loyalty and someone presumably cut from what he saw as similar cloth. And probably someone Scottish. I think he's tripped over his own ego here though. Moyes is, was, and will never be, good enough. I know it's early days, but I don't see him turning this around to any great degree.

 

To the second, if Ferguson really wanted to 'ensure he is revered for that little bit longer in the current day history of Man United', well, he's gone a funny way about it. Utd fans are already questioning why the fuck he chose Moyes. And that may well be his legacy; choosing an incompetent successor. So the reverence lasted 6 months. He must be choking on his whisky.

 

I just find the whole notion pretty absurd, really. People subscribing to this are judging him merely on the fact he has been a Utd manager, and is a bit of a cunt to boot.

 

Surely if you have watched him behave in the way he has done for 26 years, then you really don't have much to judge it on do you. Take away the fact he was United manager he has and always will be a cunt.

 

That is his behaviour, how he has portrayed himself to the world, as a cunt, a self serving cunt at that.

 

Look at his battle over the horse with JP Magnier as another example. They stopped putting money in to the club because and then pulled out of buying the club because he was acting a cunt.

[dennis tooth]

Surely you must ask the question as to why he didn't go with Mourino as his successor thoug?

 

If Ol Piss Head really, really wanted to put the club first before his legacy he wouldn't have let the following take place.

 

Let the team slide in quality like he has done

Let the midfield become the laughing stock it is now shown to being.

Relied on Giggs and bringing Scholes out of retirement to bost his midfield.

Bought a crock like RVP for one season.

Allowed his squad to age and not have ready to step in young quality ready and available.

Would have transfers in place for this season.

Would not have picked Moyes to be his succesor.

Would not have unsettled the squad by making out Rooney asked for a transfer.

Released his book so soon.

 

They are just a few of things that spring to mind about how Fergie has ensured he is revered for that little bit longer in the current day history of Man United.

 

That article by Harris is also spot on. Fergie has a hell of a lot to answer for and I think a lot of United's fans are now realising this.

 

All that Fergie wanted to do was to have a seat on the board/in the directors box like Boby Charlton.

 

Never heard so much shite in my life, his reputation and legacy will be intact forever at that club.

Cheer up though, they've only had two decent managers in their history and as such their whole claims on being this massive club are based upon the acheivements of two men, Moyes is perfectly in keeping with every other mediocre manager they have had and they return to being a joke of a club.

[KMD7]

 Even with the mistakes Ferguson made in his transfer policy the last couple of seasons and the lack of real money coming from the Glazers I reckon he thought Moyes would have been a dead cert to secure the very minimum, a cl place, keeping the hordes relatively happy during this 'transition phase' while factoring in city and the chavs as their only rivals for the title. After all in his thinking, he left a title winning team there.  

 

 I don't think Ferguson factored in our's and Arsenal's resurgence this season considering Arsenal only just managed to finish 4th last season and us finishing 7th with our star man suspended and probably about to be transferred.  This allied with Moyes' spectacular incompetence so far must be a shock to him. I think he is going to receive a lot of flack  from the fans; and rightly so, the prick

[Skidfingers McGonical]

Never heard so much shite in my life, his reputation and legacy will be intact forever at that club.

Cheer up though, they've only had two decent managers in their history and as such their whole claims on being this massive club are based upon the acheivements of two men, Moyes is perfectly in keeping with every other mediocre manager they have had and they return to being a joke of a club.

 

I take it you never read your posts on the GF before sending them then dennis?

[oldhallst]

The Mess-iah.

[spider-neil]

Also it has to be said that 2 CL in 18 attempts is pretty fucking PATHETIC.

[Pureblood]

Also it has to be said that 2 CL in 18 attempts is pretty fucking PATHETIC.

 

I think he was a bit unlucky (there, I said it) to come up against that Barca team.    If we were in the CL for 18 consecutive seasons I'd be happy with a return of 2 wins. 

[Lario]

I agree . Some serious over-reading of the situation. Ferguson saw in Moyes a miserable dour Scott somehwat in his own image and decided to annoint him as his successor. A steady hand at the wheel who had shown 10 years loyalty to his previous club.What he clearly didn't want is a journeyman such as Mourinho coming in. 

What he didn't consider was that Moyes doesn't have his authority over the current squad or the charisma and track record to attract top players.Slur fucked up badly and presumably persuaded the Glazers to back his choice. Far from delighting in the failure of his successor he is probably in a very uncormfortable position . Fuck him and the club. 

 

Do you actually know what a journeyman is?

[Dr Nowt]

If there has been any sneakiness from Ferguson in terms of the appointment, I would think it's more through concern of past failings being highlighted than successes diminished.  Only realistically in Europe that could happen, and if there isn't big money to spend Mourinho wouldn't have been dominating the Champions League anytime soon with that squad.  In the sense of covering over any stains on his resume though, certainly Moyes' gratitude and awe towards him would have appealed. I get the sense he's like those guys proud to be selected to throw themselves in front of the president if someone tries to shoot him.

Mourinho playing his "I call him the boss" card was pure expediency. If Ferguson would have tried to take one of his players we would have seen the real reaction.  Likewise he would currently be braying about an entire squad unfit for purpose the same way he is his strikers at Chelsea.

Moyes on the other hand wasn't pretending one iota with the forelock-tugging, the memorable line of being horrified that he had to go to his highness' house in jeans says it all. Imagine the shame! Being arsed in the first place, and even not telling him to wait for an hour while he went to change into whatever he felt comfortable in. Says it all he was happy to stop what he was doing and race round when he supposedly anticipated it being a play for one of his key men. (Mind you, he did say he was shopping with his wife, so I suppose there is that side to it.)

Ferguson knew he wouldn't be called out on the state of the squad directly, the Glazers' relative lesser spending - which comes back to him indirectly for not having said anything while it happened on his supposedly omnipotent watch - and also that he drove the car until it was running on fumes, making sure not to leave any juice in the tank for anyone else if he could use it himself.

In that sense, the value of Moyes acting like his own personal butler at times can definitely be seen, good shout all who raised it. He's like a loyal downstairs man appointed upstairs in the olden days and thinking a fish knife is a cake slice while at dinner with dignatries. They'll be far too horrified by that to question why he's sat there in the first place and put the general decline around them on his shoulders, while he just feels honoured for the opportunity to do his humble duty.

[razor]

He just "gets" them.

[Pureblood]

All of this isn't Moyesey's fault.  Much like the previous 10 years he can't compete with the financial resources of the other club in the city.  He'd love to spend £28m on one player but he just can't do that.  He won't talk about it though and he won't mention the referees, either.  He doesn't like talking about that kind of thing.  Just gets on with it, does Davey.  Smashing chap. 

[Gnasher]

I think he was a bit unlucky (there, I said it) to come up against that Barca team.    If we were in the CL for 18 consecutive seasons I'd be happy with a return of 2 wins.

 

I take the opposite veiw. I think he was fortunate to win any. The first he got played off the park for 90 minutes till Solskaer rescued him in injury time.

 

The second he won because Terry hit a post. I heard a rumour that Terry was not even due to take that last pen, Drogba was, but he got sent off, then Avrum Grant had someone else down to take it ( Anelka?) but Terry over ruled him because his vanity made him want to be the one to win the cup with the last kick of the game, and he fucked it right up.

[Pureblood]

I take the opposite veiw. I think he was fortunate to win any. The first he got played off the park for 90 minutes till Solskaer rescued him in injury time.

 

The second he won because Terry hit a post. I heard a rumour that Terry was not even due to take that last pen, Drogba was, but he got sent off, then Avrum Grant had someone else down to take it ( Anelka?) but Terry over ruled him because his vanity made him want to be the one to win the cup with the last kick of the game, and he fucked it right up.

 

I think when you reach that many finals you kind of make your own luck.    The never say die spirit he instilled won them the cup in the Nou Camp, so credit where it's due.  He's still a cunt but he was a very good manager.

[Gym Beglin]

I think he was a bit unlucky (there, I said it) to come up against that Barca team.    If we were in the CL for 18 consecutive seasons I'd be happy with a return of 2 wins. 

 

 

I certainly wouldn't be happy with it from United's perspective, in those 18 years they've splashed the cash out time and time again and in about 77% of cases they've bought shit.

 

De Gea - £18.9m - SHIT

Jones - £16.5m - SHIT

Ferdinand - £30m - HIT

Valencia - £16m - SHIT

Veron - £28m - SHIT

Young - £17m - SHIT

Berbatov - £30m - SHIT

Rooney - £27m - HIT

Fellaini - £28m - SHIT

Van Persie - £24m - HIT

Anderson - £18m - SHIT

Nani - £17m - SHIT

Van Nistelrooy - £19m - HIT

Hargreaves - £17m - SHIT

Yorke - £13m - HIT

Stam - £12m - HIT

Saha - £11m - SHIT

Ronaldo - £12m - HIT

Smalling - £10m - SHIT

Kagawa - £12m - SHIT

Zaha - £15m - SHIT

Barthez - £8m - SHIT

Forlan - £7m - SHIT

Vidic - £7m -  HIT

Smith - £7m - SHIT

Cole - £7m - HIT

Bebe - £7.4m - SHIT

Tosic - £5m - SHIT

Tevez - £9m - HIT

Kelberson - £6m - SHIT

 

And during the same spell they sold Pique, Rossi, Pogba, Ravel Morrison, for about a combined £12m.

 

By my calculations, and not delving under £5m mark, they've spent around £295,000,000 on players that just haven't worked out or delivered what they wanted. 

 

But it's ok because they made £80m from Ronaldo sale to Madrid, and £25m on Beckham sale to Madrid....

 

 

Bunch of free-spending twats, they were paying massive money in the early days of the Premiership and now they have the temerity to question Chelsea or City when they spend massive?  If it wasn't for United blazing a trail of financial chaos then the likes of City and Chelsea wouldn't exist like this today.

 

They spent £10m on a centre back in 1998.  It took most clubs another 5 years to spend £10m on a forward, nevermind a centre back.

 

And how nobody went to prison for that John Obi Mikel dodgy deal I'll never know.

[Pureblood]

I certainly wouldn't be happy with it from United's perspective...

 

Maybe the 14 league titles or whatever it was would temper your disappointment?

[Gym Beglin]

Maybe the 14 league titles or whatever it was would temper your disappointment?

 

Not really, Europe is the top table, certainly in my time it has become so.

[stringvest]

fucking hell Funneee.  

[Section_31]

I keep reading this. It is such bullshit. Do you really believe Shankly, Paisley, Dalglish all wanted their own legacies maintained over the success of the club? I'm guessing your answer is 'no', so then why is Ferguson any different? Cos he's a 'cunt', right? Is that it? Do you really believe he is turning up to all these Utd games to cheer on the opposition?

 

I'm no fan of Ferguson but I can't believe I keep reading your particular view.

 

If anything, as you conclude, their current malaise reflects poorly on Ferguson, not well. Daniel Harris is about right. So much for a legacy.

You're forgetting the fact here that Ferguson is a sociopath and that the mancs were a vehicle for his own personal success - which is where he differs from Shanks, Paisley, Busby et al, he's more in the Mourinho/Clough mold.

 

If he loved them so much why did he drive them into the Glazers' hands? Why did he never speak out against them? Why does he even now not attract true adulation from its hard core fan base? Maybe he didn't actively plan to see the club struggle - but neither would he have wanted to be overshadowed by the next man.

 

No doubt you'll do the usual though and just say the opposite purely for the sake of it, which makes the discussion somewhat tedious.

[Stickman]

I think when you reach that many finals you kind of make your own luck.    The never say die spirit he instilled won them the cup in the Nou Camp, so credit where it's due.  He's still a cunt but he was a very good manager.

Personally I think he gets found out in Europe ....and two wins out of 18 is not great when you consider Bob won 3 out of 7 attempts.

And I believe one other thing if Bob had lost a final like they did to Barca with the first one there is no way he would have got an even bigger hiding in a final two years later from the same side.

I'd be pretty certain revenge would have been achieved.

But agree with the he's a cunt but great manager...

[Gnasher]

I think when you reach that many finals you kind of make your own luck.    The never say die spirit he instilled won them the cup in the Nou Camp, so credit where it's due.  He's still a cunt but he was a very good manager.

They've only hit three. We've hit two and we hardly bother to enter.

[Gym Beglin]

It gets even weirder though:

 

 

In terms of spending between £10-20m.

 

We signed:

Heskey, Diouf, Alonso, Babel, Mascherano, Keane, Aquilani, Johnson, Meireles, Henderson, Sturridge, Allen, Sakho, Mignolet.

 

They signed:

De Gea, Jones, Valencia, Young, Anderson, Nani, Hargreaves, Yorke, Stam, Saha, Ronaldo, Smalling, Kagawa, Zaha, Van Nistelrooy.

 

 

 

In terms of £20m+ players

 

They bought:

 Rooney, Ferdinand, Van Persie, Berbatov, Veron, Fellaini

 

We bought:

Suarez, Torres, Downing and Carroll

 

 

 

But then bear in mind, United had the youth windfall of Scholes, Beckham, Giggs, Neville G, Neville P, Butt,  the first three being £20m+ players for sure.

 

We had Gerrard, Fowler, McManaman, Carragher. 

[spider-neil]

 

 

 

In terms of spending between £10-20m.

 

 

 

They signed:

De Gea, Jones, Valencia, Young, Anderson, Nani, Hargreaves, Yorke, Stam, Saha, Ronaldo, Smalling, Kagawa, Zaha, Van Nistelrooy.

 

 

 

 

De Gea is a success and he is only going to get better.