Tottenham Away

[fin-bat]

Tottenham scored our goal for us, how much luck do you want?

 

It's all very well saying we were excellent, but we still hardly looked like scoring.

 

But then, what do you expect, we didn't add goalscorers to the squad in the summer; in fact, we shipped most of our attacking players out.

 

There is a movement to insulate Rodgers from criticism by shifting the blame onto the squad he inherited. This only works if you buy into the fiction that he inherited rubbish that required a massive overhaul, which I don't.

 

Once again, I feel like I have to remind people how good the majority of our performances were last season, and for the most part all that was absent was quality finishing. All we needed was to add quality forwards to the team. Instead FSG got someone in to slash and burn and build a new team on the cheap, which thus far is yielding predictable results.

 

I don´t know who you are chap, but your post shines like a sore thumb among all this dross.

[Bjornebye]

Code reminds me of Ricky Halton in this thread.

[Guest San Don]

I'm a 48 year old owlarse mate and I struggle to understand how people think Gerrard is finished. He is 32 and undeniably past his peak which at his age is normal but he still has a touch of class and his experience is invaluable.

 

Lucas, when ready, will come into the side as we already know.

 

It's no secret either Shelvey is highly rated by Rodgers but he's not ready to shift Gerrard on a permanent basis just yet.

 

get 2 strikers in jan window.

Brendan, stop fucking about, open your eyes and see what most of football can see.

 

Don't you mean the owners? It's common knowledge Rodgers wants two or 3 attacking options who can play along the front line but are you saying he's at fault for not being able to get them in the summer?

 

Downing looks set to be the makeweight for any inbounds, but he can't do much about that until january.

 

Henderson I have defended in the past but as new players come in over the next window or two, whoever they are, I can only see him slipping further down the pecking order. I don't think he is 'shit' but as he doesn't offer a goal threat and as Rodgers was prepared to offload him in the summer I don't think he will be here long term.

 

Agree on the decisions though. It's past a joke now

 

Top post my man.

[Guest San Don]

Tottenham scored our goal for us, how much luck do you want?

 

It's all very well saying we were excellent, but we still hardly looked like scoring.

 

But then, what do you expect, we didn't add goalscorers to the squad in the summer; in fact, we shipped most of our attacking players out.

 

There is a movement to insulate Rodgers from criticism by shifting the blame onto the squad he inherited. This only works if you buy into the fiction that he inherited rubbish that required a massive overhaul, which I don't.

 

Once again, I feel like I have to remind people how good the majority of our performances were last season, and for the most part all that was absent was quality finishing. All we needed was to add quality forwards to the team. Instead FSG got someone in to slash and burn and build a new team on the cheap, which thus far is yielding predictable results.

 

And another top post.

[barosrocks]

I hope you know that the majority is usually always wrong.

 

If I had bothered I would rip that post above a part as easily as teams are cutting through our midfield.

 

I will not bother though because Numero is not exactly the smartest is he, my guess is that he's never really kicked a ball in his life?

 

Can I see the stats to prove it please?

[Section_31]

Tottenham scored our goal for us, how much luck do you want?

 

It's all very well saying we were excellent, but we still hardly looked like scoring.

 

But then, what do you expect, we didn't add goalscorers to the squad in the summer; in fact, we shipped most of our attacking players out.

 

There is a movement to insulate Rodgers from criticism by shifting the blame onto the squad he inherited. This only works if you buy into the fiction that he inherited rubbish that required a massive overhaul, which I don't.

 

Once again, I feel like I have to remind people how good the majority of our performances were last season, and for the most part all that was absent was quality finishing. All we needed was to add quality forwards to the team. Instead FSG got someone in to slash and burn and build a new team on the cheap, which thus far is yielding predictable results.

 

Most of our attacking players were shite though, that's why they got fucked off.

 

Notice how people aren't mentioning Carroll much lately as he's hardly set the world alight down there has he?

 

I'm not sold on Rodgers myself, but he did inherit a truly awful side IMO, we spunked so much money on some of the shittest players ever to pull on a red shirt over the last two years, just a heartbreaking waste of money. The entire midfield was shite, as was Carroll, as in absolutely pointless having them on the pitch.

 

Code can back up my claims wth the following stats expressed via the medium of dance.

 

[Code]

Hahaha I could not rep as I've probably negged too many people the last 24 hours, but apart from the last part I dont really agree.

 

The players people complain about were good enough for 5/6 of the season last year and they reached two cup finals.

 

The only answer to why they now are not good enough must be that Kenny is a genius compared to Rodgers.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

 

The only answer to why they now are not good enough must be that Kenny is a genius compared to Rodgers.

 

The genius that led the team to less points in his last 14 games - having spent vastly more money making the team 'his' - compared to Rodgers' first 14 games. Yeah, awesome.

[Guest San Don]

Most of our attacking players were shite though, that's why they got fucked off.

 

Notice how people aren't mentioning Carroll much lately as he's hardly set the world alight down there has he?

 

I'm not sold on Rodgers myself, but he did inherit a truly awful side IMO, we spunked so much money on some of the shittest players ever to pull on a red shirt over the last two years, just a heartbreaking waste of money. The entire midfield was shite, as was Carroll, as in absolutely pointless having them on the pitch.

 

Code can back up my claims wth the following stats expressed via the medium of dance.

 

It took Peter Crouch something like 18 games before he scored for Liverpool (and I seem to remember there was a lot of debate as to whether or not his first was actually his).

 

Maybe you said the same things about Crouch being a waste of money at the time?

 

Fact is, I'd put my money on the King getting better results with the players he left the club with.

[Guest San Don]

The genius that led the team to less points in his last 14 games - having spent vastly more money making the team 'his' - compared to Rodgers' first 14 games. Yeah, awesome.

 

Seriously, have a fucking word with yourself and show some respect to this club's greatest ever servant. He might have got somethings wrong but until you compare like for like games coming out with shite like that is really just shite.

[Coro]

we spunked so much money on some of the shittest players ever to pull on a red shirt over the last two years, just a heartbreaking waste of money. The entire midfield was shite, as was Carroll, as in absolutely pointless having them on the pitch.

 

 

This kind of hyperbole needs to stop. Screaming at the curtains as the house burns down. 'Oh but he's got a ponytail.' 'We need to buy foreign players.' 'Give the kids a chance.' All by the by whilst there is no clear strategy in place.

 

Andy Carroll didn't join a winning team. He joined a club in steady decline run by American businessmen who hired a DoF after taking advice from a Baseball GM. Dalglish inherited a far worse situation than Rodgers. Last years signings are now made to look worse because of the change of manager. It's usually the case. Dalglish should have been given the time and goodwill to see his ideas develop just like Rodgers should be given that time, now.

 

Continuity is key, not money spent. The quicker supporters realise that heaping pressure on trivialities such as a 21 year old midfielder is counter productive, start thinking responsibly and playing their part, the better. Yeah, screaming obscenities at Stewart Downing via a laptop maybe instantly gratifying but all in all it's just fuelling a vicious cycle. People saying the January window is key to how we should view FSG have got it all wrong. FSG need to show they're capable of running a football club. This isn't done by making a couple of signings in January to make up for the mess they caused in the summer window. They need to stop making messes in the first place. Hand responsibility to someone with the right credentials and wait patiently for the return. Trust those who know what they're doing. Give them the minimum of 3 years. Back them with what's available and let the support rest easy again. The appointment of Hodgson opened up wounds that badly need healing. Thus far FSG have gone about the healing process in the worst possible way. Their chunk of luck has been in the anomaly that is Suarez who has slowed our decline almost single handedly. Yet, we don't need a miracle worker much like we didn't need to pay 35 million for a largely unproven 22 year old striker. We just need a clear strategy put in place by those who understand football and backed by those who understand business.

[Code]

Seriously, have a fucking word with yourself and show some respect to this club's greatest ever servant. He might have got somethings wrong but until you compare like for like games coming out with shite like that is really just shite.

 

Numero is special.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Seriously, have a fucking word with yourself and show some respect to this club's greatest ever servant. He might have got somethings wrong but until you compare like for like games coming out with shite like that is really just shite.

 

You can only judge Rodgers on the side he took over. Code claims it's the best side ever inherited by a Liverpool manager, and the difference between how Kenny did and how Rodgers is doing is Kenny's genius. That's total bollocks, so I'm going to pick up on it. It's not about lack of respect, it's about Code's self-deluded little world he's trying to push.

 

The 14 games preceding Rodgers' 14 were horrendous. 9 losses (United, Arsenal, Sunderland, QPR, Wigan, Newcastle, West Brom, Fulham and Swansea), picking up 13 points. That's the team that Rodgers took over. Well, apart from losing Bellamy, Kuyt, Maxi and the £35m megastar striker. That's 4 of our top six goal scorers.

 

I'm not happy with the way things are going, but Code's slant on this is fucking unbearable to quite a few of us. He's a deluded moron and, as anybody can see by the response to him, he's not liked very much.

[Anubis]

I think you'll find this particular part of your sentence came across as sneering, which is why Sand Don, rightly, pulled you.

 

The genius that led the team to less points in his last 14 games

 

You're all in on Rodgers - and there's nothing wrong with that - but show a bit of respect for the one manager we had who had to deal with the club's most shattering moment, and did so with dignity.

[Guest San Don]

You can only judge Rodgers on the side he took over. Code claims it's the best side ever inherited by a Liverpool manager, and the difference between how Kenny did and how Rodgers is doing is Kenny's genius. That's total bollocks, so I'm going to pick up on it. It's not about lack of respect, it's about Code's self-deluded little world he's trying to push.

 

The 14 games preceding Rodgers' 14 were horrendous. 9 losses (United, Arsenal, Sunderland, QPR, Wigan, Newcastle, West Brom, Fulham and Swansea), picking up 13 points. That's the team that Rodgers took over. Well, apart from losing Bellamy, Kuyt, Maxi and the £35m megastar striker. That's 4 of our top six goal scorers.

 

I'm not happy with the way things are going, but Code's slant on this is fucking unbearable to quite a few of us. He's a deluded moron and, as anybody can see by the response to him, he's not liked very much.

 

If you have a problem with what code says, direct it to him. Dont go on condescendingly about this club's greatest.

 

If you dont like the decisions he made then fair enough but, give the man some fucking respect. Dont go on mockingly about his genius. That's what Im saying.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

I'm referring to Code's stance, not Kenny's dealings with a tragedy that happened over 20 years ago. If San Don, or anybody else, is unable to see that, well, fuck 'em.

 

I don't feel the need to constantly bleat about Kenny - I'm comfortable idolising him in private, I've nothing to prove on that front - but I take exception to Code saying it was some sort of perceived genius of Kenny's that separated what he did to what Rodgers is doing.

 

For me, it's not even about Kenny. It's about realising what position we're actually in, what he actually took over, and how he's actually doing in comparison to last season.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

If you have a problem with what code says, direct it to him. Dont go on condescendingly about this club's greatest.

 

Firstly, I'll say what the fuck I like. I don't need your fucking permission, nor do I require your fucking approval. Secondly, I wasn't even referring to Kenny as a person or a manager, I was referring to the perceived act of genius made up in Code's mind. The act of genius that Kenny himself would call disappointing because he's not a total idiot.

 

If you dont like the decisions he made then fair enough but, give the man some fucking respect. Dont go on mockingly about his genius. That's what Im saying.

 

I wasn't mocking his genius, you oversensitive tit. I was mocking Code.

[Coro]

 

For me, it's not even about Kenny. It's about realising what position we're actually in, what he actually took over, and how he's actually doing in comparison to last season.

 

Something you failed to do with Dalglish.

 

You've done a complete about turn as if you've saved all your goodwill for Rodgers. I find that odd.

[Section_31]

It took Peter Crouch something like 18 games before he scored for Liverpool (and I seem to remember there was a lot of debate as to whether or not his first was actually his).

 

Maybe you said the same things about Crouch being a waste of money at the time?

 

Fact is, I'd put my money on the King getting better results with the players he left the club with.

 

Crouch was shite, IMO.

 

This kind of hyperbole needs to stop. Screaming at the curtains as the house burns down. 'Oh but he's got a ponytail.' 'We need to buy foreign players.' 'Give the kids a chance.' All by the by whilst there is no clear strategy in place.

 

Andy Carroll didn't join a winning team. He joined a club in steady decline run by American businessmen who hired a DoF after taking advice from a Baseball GM. Dalglish inherited a far worse situation than Rodgers. Last years signings are now made to look worse because of the change of manager. It's usually the case. Dalglish should have been given the time and goodwill to see his ideas develop just like Rodgers should be given that time, now.

 

Mate, seriously, Henderson, Adam, Downing and Carroll were/are shite.

 

I'm too tired to go into any more detail than that, but if you get shite players who're also shithouses, you get shit results.

 

Dalglish worked wonders when he first took over, I don't see why admitting that means Rodgers has had it any easier, it doesn't, where Dalglish fell down was blowing so much money on truly awful players. The first thing Rodgers had to do was promote a 17 year old to replace a 20 million pound waste of skin, and buy a midfielder to replace Adam - both have improved on the people they replaced, undoubtedly so.

[HJohal]

I think we have to be realistic that the club was in a bad mess when FSG bought the club - they said as much by stating that the club had a horrific wage bill for what was a poor quality squad.

 

Kenny/Comolli were given the opportunity to short cut the 'healing' process by being given a large transfer budget to lift the team from 6th to 4th - it did not work and consequently we will now have to take our medicine and re-build. This is why we effectively are in year 0 - where the priority is to remove the under performers from the squad and re-invest the resources. This process started in the summer with the sale of Kuyt, Bellamy, Adam, Aquilani and Maxi. It will be continued next calendar year by the sales of Cole, Downing, Carroll, Doni and probably Henderson and the likely retirement of Carragher. A conservative guess is that this is an annual saving of ~ 42M - 1/3 of the wage bill. This is probably what Rodgers implied when he said this year the owners wanted to 'balance the books'

 

If we re-invest well in Jan and the summer the club could move very quickly up the table given the lack of quality in the premier league outside the Manchester clubs.

 

Even if the club re-invested 25M per year in wages - that is the equivalent of 5 world class players on a £100k p.w (i.e Suarez) - that would should make a significant difference in the overall quality of the squad with the young talent we have coming through the academy.

 

It was always likely that the club would drift after, in effect, going into administration - I am confident this year is the bottom as we finally try to clear up the mess of several failed regimes.

Edited November 29, 2012 by HJohal

[TheHitman]

Hank Code is Code, but do you not think some of the hyperbole being spouted the other way is driving him on a bit, here are some examples.

 

Swansea played some of the best football in Europe last season.

 

We are playing the best we have done for 10-12 years.

 

Joe Allen is our Alonso/Xavi.

 

Borini and Allen were a bargain.

 

Not too mention some substitutions which are being labelled as signs of great tactical awareness when in most instances he has made a few wrong calls to start with.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Something you failed to do with Dalglish.

 

You've done a complete about turn as if you've saved all your goodwill for Rodgers. I find that odd.

 

I didn't fail to do it with Dalglish, Coro. You've constructed some strange caricature of me in your mind about how I judged Kenny.

[Captain]

Something you failed to do with Dalglish.

 

Something you failed to do with Benítez.

[Coro]

 

 

Mate, seriously, Henderson, Adam, Downing and Carroll were/are shite.

 

I'm too tired to go into any more detail than that, but if you get shite players who're also shithouses, you get shit results.

 

Dalglish worked wonders when he first took over, I don't see why admitting that means Rodgers has had it any easier, it doesn't, where Dalglish fell down was blowing so much money on truly awful players. The first thing Rodgers had to do was promote a 17 year old to replace a 20 million pound waste of skin, and buy a midfielder to replace Adam - both have improved on the people they replaced, undoubtedly so.

 

You're missing my point. If the club continues to be run like it has been then the majority of our signings will continue to be 'shite'.

 

If we're going to give the responsibility of those signings to Dalglish then it's another of his signings that has almost single handedly been keeping us afloat.

 

As I say, a clear strategy helps in maximising the potential of signings made and limiting rather than compounding of any mistakes made by the manager.

[Coro]

Something you failed to do with Benítez.

 

I'm sorry, you must have me mistaken for someone else.

 

I didn't fail to do it with Dalglish, Coro. You've constructed some strange caricature of me in your mind about how I judged Kenny.

 

You did. I remember trying, maybe somewhat clumsily, to put some perspective on the situation Dalglish had inherited. You responded by describing Hicks and Gillett and the damage they had caused as a 'meaningless excuse'.