Depression

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Moctezuma said:

I don't know how others find it, but it feels like once you've gone through a major depressive episode it always feels like it's not a million miles away again and a lot of work is needed to avoid it reoccurring.

Yep, spot on. I think it's because you know what the mind is now capable of and how hard it is to fight when it happens. I'd rather a bad physical injury than to slip anywhere close to the darkest days ever again. 

[Section_31]

8 minutes ago, Moctezuma said:

Apologies Sec missed this the first time around,

 

I think it pretty much reframes the depression being suffered around the condition/the fact you are non-neurotypical within a society where your way of perceiving and interacting with the world is in a minority.

 

I had been diagnosed at an early age I think it was picked up in my second year of school so about 6 to 7 years old, this manifested itself in daydreaming, poor reading, poor retention of written information, dreadful spelling, hesitancy around writing, slower cognitive uptake of information. I still have the educational psychologist report knocking around somewhere that states this explicitly.

 

While I had been given the diagnosis it had never actually been explained to me what this really entailed. In secondary school I had been given extra time during exams and was in some class for 'thick' kids once a week or so which didn't seem to achieve a huge amount in my recollection. 

 

Terry was the first person who broke down how this neuro divergence actually effects me and how this was linked to the depression I was suffering at the time. Below are some of the things I remember him relaying to me, though this is all now a decade plus ago so it's a long way from verbatim.

One of the main things he pointed out at the time was the deleterious effect having a condition where you are unable to express yourself effectively in written form and find reading difficult has on you over the long haul and how the constant feeling of failure to fit into neurotypical predominated society and associated expectations can eat away at you. Dyslexics on the whole therefore display a distinct lack of confidence and undervalue their being. They also tend to do badly in academic settings leading to more feelings around a lack of self-worth (you are literally finding out constantly that your peers are getting better grades than you though in conversation you can't immediately detect some awning gulf in intelligence). 

 

There have been a number of studies that indicate that the number of dyslexics in prison and other institutions is significantly higher as a proportion than neuro-typical members of the population and in part this is because of the difficulties described above, if you from managed to avoid this, in of itself that is some degree of achievement. 

Keeping this in mind helps reframe issues that a person can have when work is critiqued.

The next thing he noted was that while it manifests as a reading and writing issue for children in general due to processing issues for adults the difficulties start to become more pronounced around organisation, sequencing and working memory function (all of these are linked).

 

Dyslexics capacity to retain short term information nodes (working memory) is significantly reduced in comparison to average member of the population this means on average that dyslexics are able to retain three or four short-term pieces of information in comparison to an average person who's probably able to go to five or seven this is particularly pronounced around things like phone numbers, dance steps, learning music, locker combinations, pin numbers, multiple tasks being given (especially in verbal form-instructions) etc. Anything where you have to sequence and use short term memory pulls.

 

Ultimately that feeling where you walk into a room and have forgotten what you are doing is significantly increased in likelihood.

 

Because of this dyslexics on the whole tend to use long term memory to a far greater extent than the rest of population, this is in part why many are good storytellers so and many end up in things like acting because they are able to pull out significant chunks of information from long term memory, because they are using that function (thus increasing the brains capacity with it) to a far greater extent than most other people.

 

This overt use of long term memory starts to manifest itself in a number of ways you are far more likely to undertake patterns repeating the same actions through a given day;
•    Eating the same foodstuffs constantly/preparing the same foodstuffs
•    Using the same routes to work and other locations with very little divergence
•    Creating standardised routines through the day
•    Extremely standardised routines at weekends in comparison to neurotypical members of the population

 

While an average person will do this it becomes particularly pronounced in dyslexics as the brain is trying to give the short term memory/processing functions a break relying on older established memory to enact tasks.

 

Dyslexics who work in jobs outside of being able to do this can often struggle. 

 

This is why in the event of depression/anxiety it can be particularly difficult for dyslexics as the working memory function starts to become even more overwhelmed than people without that particular wiring of the brain.

 

I have seen undiagnosed dyslexics in later life and the opprobrium from colleagues aimed at these people is often fairly considerable, they are seen as disorganised and ‘scatty’.

 

Coping strategies are needed, most develop them through lived experience. There are some website and videos around dyslexic in adulthood which can help.

https://www.dyslexia.uk.net/adults-with-dyslexia/ 
https://www.dyslexia.uk.net/services/assistive-technology/
 

Branson's crew have made some videos here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLBUsgxhf_otK_qKoZnP0pA/videos

 

 

Cheers mate, that's really interesting stuff.

 

Yeah when I look back at my early life dyslexia played a huge part in eroding self esteem in some situations. My schools books were always a mess, and even though I never felt like a dunce, I always just 'scraped by' in exams. If I needed a C, I'd usually get a C.

 

I developed ways of teaching myself, which came in handy, as I couldn't learn in traditional ways. I remember when I was about seven or eight, when the teacher had finished explaining what we were doing, every time without fail I'd have to ask her again, and she'd get the class to explain it to me like I was a moron.

 

Conversely though, i remember once when we all got bollocked by the science teacher for not being able to remember how to figure out atomic numbers which she'd shown us 'only the other day'. She was going apeshit and nobody knew what she was on about, turned out she hadn't taught us, but I was able to figure it out just by looking at an example she'd put on the board. 

 

Everyone started asking me how to do it, even the two so called 'smart' girls in the class who later went to Oxbridge.

 

When I got my dyslexia test when I was around 23, she was fascinated because she was doing memory tests and I was doing this weird shit with my finger and had my eyes closed. She asked me what I was doing and I said I was picturing a bouncing ball landing on number sequences. I also did arithmetic by imagining dominos lighting up or going out. 

 

She reckoned my IQ was high but processing speed was average. I asked her did this mean I was thick and she said 'no, just relatively to the rest of your brain'. Basically it's like having a brand new computer with a Celeron processor I think. 

 

[Creator Supreme]

11 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

 

Cheers mate, that's really interesting stuff.

 

Yeah when I look back at my early life dyslexia played a huge part in eroding self esteem in some situations. My schools books were always a mess, and even though I never felt like a dunce, I always just 'scraped by' in exams. If I needed a C, I'd usually get a C.

 

I developed ways of teaching myself, which came in handy, as I couldn't learn in traditional ways. I remember when I was about seven or eight, when the teacher had finished explaining what we were doing, every time without fail I'd have to ask her again, and she'd get the class to explain it to me like I was a moron.

 

Conversely though, i remember once when we all got bollocked by the science teacher for not being able to remember how to figure out atomic numbers which she'd shown us 'only the other day'. She was going apeshit and nobody knew what she was on about, turned out she hadn't taught us, but I was able to figure it out just by looking at an example she'd put on the board. 

 

Everyone started asking me how to do it, even the two so called 'smart' girls in the class who later went to Oxbridge.

 

When I got my dyslexia test when I was around 23, she was fascinated because she was doing memory tests and I was doing this weird shit with my finger and had my eyes closed. She asked me what I was doing and I said I was picturing a bouncing ball landing on number sequences. I also did arithmetic by imagining dominos lighting up or going out. 

 

She reckoned my IQ was high but processing speed was average. I asked her did this mean I was thick and she said 'no, just relatively to the rest of your brain'. Basically it's like having a brand new computer with a Celeron processor I think. 

 

Interesting read that Sesch, my lad has Dyslexia (along with ADD and probably Autism if we can ever get the little fucker to go through with the assessment), and he processes things in different ways. Interesting to watch at times but also painful as it really gets to him that he's 'different'.

 

I hope we can manage to get him assessed for everything and get him some treatment and or counselling for his issues, as at the moment he barely leaves the house. It's tragic to watch a 17 year old basically put his life on ice because he isn't get the help he needs. Stories like yours help us, shows that the help is there, and that you can succeed in life despite stuff like dyslexia affecting you along the way.

[Section_31]

3 minutes ago, Creator Supreme said:

Interesting read that Sesch, my lad has Dyslexia (along with ADD and probably Autism if we can ever get the little fucker to go through with the assessment), and he processes things in different ways. Interesting to watch at times but also painful as it really gets to him that he's 'different'.

 

I hope we can manage to get him assessed for everything and get him some treatment and or counselling for his issues, as at the moment he barely leaves the house. It's tragic to watch a 17 year old basically put his life on ice because he isn't get the help he needs. Stories like yours help us, shows that the help is there, and that you can succeed in life despite stuff like dyslexia affecting you along the way.

Oh definitely. 

 

I wouldn't change anything about myself in that regard, I know that sounds conceited, but I do think differently to most people but I think that's a good thing sometimes. 

 

I don't think of dyslexia as a disability, it's just not suited to the way we teach people, but there are workarounds. 

 

I got really good A level results because I the way it was taught in college was by group discussion, so I could remember things better. In uni I really struggled because I was just sat there looking at a screen. Most of my notes were covered in drawings  of Spiderman.

 

There's plenty of dyslexic entrepreneurs, I'm pretty sure Branson in one. Because they find traditional ways of doing things fucked up. The bad side is that they can struggle to fit in,  the good side though is that they think of things other people don't.

 

Your lad will be fine, he just needs to find his niche.  

[Elite]

29 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Oh definitely. 

 

I wouldn't change anything about myself in that regard, I know that sounds conceited, but I do think differently to most people but I think that's a good thing sometimes. 

 

I don't think of dyslexia as a disability, it's just not suited to the way we teach people, but there are workarounds. 

 

I got really good A level results because I the way it was taught in college was by group discussion, so I could remember things better. In uni I really struggled because I was just sat there looking at a screen. Most of my notes were covered in drawings  of Spiderman.

 

There's plenty of dyslexic entrepreneurs, I'm pretty sure Branson in one. Because they find traditional ways of doing things fucked up. The bad side is that they can struggle to fit in,  the good side though is that they think of things other people don't.

 

Your lad will be fine, he just needs to find his niche.  

Must have been a webinar.

[Section_31]

3 hours ago, Elite said:

Must have been a webinar.

Tremendous

[Creator Supreme]

5 hours ago, Section_31 said:

Oh definitely. 

 

I wouldn't change anything about myself in that regard, I know that sounds conceited, but I do think differently to most people but I think that's a good thing sometimes. 

 

I don't think of dyslexia as a disability, it's just not suited to the way we teach people, but there are workarounds. 

 

I got really good A level results because I the way it was taught in college was by group discussion, so I could remember things better. In uni I really struggled because I was just sat there looking at a screen. Most of my notes were covered in drawings  of Spiderman.

 

There's plenty of dyslexic entrepreneurs, I'm pretty sure Branson in one. Because they find traditional ways of doing things fucked up. The bad side is that they can struggle to fit in,  the good side though is that they think of things other people don't.

 

Your lad will be fine, he just needs to find his niche.  

Thanks mate.

[Section_31]

Interesting this. Was watching a similar thing a while back about the use of psychedelics. It resets the brain, as opposed to anti depressants which are essentially trying to refill a bucket with holes in.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/climate-change/news/magic-mushrooms-psilocybin-depression-treatment-b2055640.html

[Captain Willard]

On 23/03/2022 at 10:37, Creator Supreme said:

Interesting read that Sesch, my lad has Dyslexia (along with ADD and probably Autism if we can ever get the little fucker to go through with the assessment), and he processes things in different ways. Interesting to watch at times but also painful as it really gets to him that he's 'different'.

 

I hope we can manage to get him assessed for everything and get him some treatment and or counselling for his issues, as at the moment he barely leaves the house. It's tragic to watch a 17 year old basically put his life on ice because he isn't get the help he needs. Stories like yours help us, shows that the help is there, and that you can succeed in life despite stuff like dyslexia affecting you along the way.

I’m sure he’ll be fine. I’ve got terrible dyslexia but managed to qualify as an accountant and made a 40 year carear out of it. Spell check makes life bearable. Good luck to him.  

[Creator Supreme]

3 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

I’m sure he’ll be fine. I’ve got terrible dyslexia but managed to qualify as an accountant and made a 40 year carear out of it. Spell check makes life bearable. Good luck to him.  

Cheers Cap, it's much appreciated.

[YorkshireRed]

I got talking to a lad I’ve known for many years last night.
 

A few times he’s mentioned his struggles with depression to me, I think he thinks I understand. Perhaps I do some, but lately I’ve lost any sense of confidence that I ever understood anything. I’ll always try though. 
 

The level of detail he shared was new. It wasn’t earth shattering stuff, but things around; feeling completely worthless, the truth behind his mask, his shame at being this way when others have had it much harder, the lottery that is antidepressants and/or counselling and his difficulties talking to his partner because she’s not cut from the same cloth. 

As he left he thanked me for listening. I should have thanked him for sharing. Our conversation helped me more than him, that reinforcement that others feel much of what you feel can be such a comfort. It was for me last night.

 

It’s good to talk.

 

It’s also good to listen. 

[Section_31]

repeated studies have shown that mild to moderate depressives have a more realistic take on life than most “normal” people, a phenomenon known as “depressive realism”...  As Neel Burton, author of The Meaning of Madness, put it, this is “the healthy suspicion that modern life has no meaning and that modern society is absurd and alienating”. In a goal-driven, work-oriented culture, this is deeply threatening.

[Rico1304]

Anyone listen to Adam Buxton podcast? The Irish author Marian Keyes talks about her depression and how at a low point she told her husband she was going to kill herself (as in, doing it in the next few mins) and how he stopped her in just about the strangest way possible.  

[Section_31]

11 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

Anyone listen to Adam Buxton podcast? The Irish author Marian Keyes talks about her depression and how at a low point she told her husband she was going to kill herself (as in, doing it in the next few mins) and how he stopped her in just about the strangest way possible.  

Saw an interview with her a while back where she mentioned that. 

[Oh Buoy]

9 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

Anyone listen to Adam Buxton podcast? The Irish author Marian Keyes talks about her depression and how at a low point she told her husband she was going to kill herself (as in, doing it in the next few mins) and how he stopped her in just about the strangest way possible.  

 

I mean you could have just said how but it's cool, I'll guess...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

?

[Creator Supreme]

13 minutes ago, Bot said:

 

I mean you could have just said how but it's cool, I'll guess...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

?

I laughed at that more than I probably should have, thanks mate.

[Captain Turdseye]

I look at that and wince thinking about how much paint that tape is gonna take off the wall. 
 

If they haven’t got half a tin left lying around then it’s an even bigger pain in the arse. 

[Babb'sBurstNad]

12 minutes ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I look at that and wince thinking about how much paint that tape is gonna take off the wall. 
 

If they haven’t got half a tin left lying around then it’s an even bigger pain in the arse. 

Even if they had half a tin left, that paint will come off in chunks, so the repair will be obvious.

 

They'll have to sand back an entire area around the holes.

 

That's made me livid just thinking about it.

[Section_31]

2 hours ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I look at that and wince thinking about how much paint that tape is gonna take off the wall. 
 

If they haven’t got half a tin left lying around then it’s an even bigger pain in the arse. 

Whenever I see an Echo story about a police raid I wince when they take the door down if it's a nice door. It's just heartbreaking. 

[Captain Turdseye]

I’ve been on the Prozac for three months now and it’s occurred to me over the last few days that they might just be working. 
 

I‘m still doing less than I used to and would like to be doing, but I am happier. It’s just crept up on me. 

[Babb'sBurstNad]

31 minutes ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I’ve been on the Prozac for three months now and it’s occurred to me over the last few days that they might just be working. 
 

I‘m still doing less than I used to and would like to be doing, but I am happier. It’s just crept up on me. 

Glad to hear it mate. Long may it continue.

 

Stabilisation of mental health is one of those incrementally improving things you just don't notice from day-to-day. But, if you're lucky, months or years later you can look back and realise how far you've come, and actually how happy you are.

[redinblack]

My eldest boy is struggling quite badly.

 

He has substance abuse issues, Ive spent the best part of 15 years trying various methods to address that, his depression comes and goes but the stuff he does is his way of self medicating and at the moment it is stratospheric in terms of intake and his depression is the worst its ever been.

 

I have tried everything, I have tried to get him counselling, good cop, bad cop, cut him off, smother him in love, he has built this fortress around himself and this wall of depression is something I just cant get through. The last counsellor I spoke to said " he will get better when he wants to", which is probably right but doesnt help me.

 

Im a fixer, a problem solver, its what I do for a living, but he is beating me all ends up here, I cannot drag him from the well of depression he is in and break the cycle of depression>gear>weed>depression. His depression is the single worst thing I have ever tried to face down, I can only imagine how much worse it is for him. 

 

 

[Elite]

2 minutes ago, redinblack said:

My eldest boy is struggling quite badly.

 

He has substance abuse issues, Ive spent the best part of 15 years trying various methods to address that, his depression comes and goes but the stuff he does is his way of self medicating and at the moment it is stratospheric in terms of intake and his depression is the worst its ever been.

 

I have tried everything, I have tried to get him counselling, good cop, bad cop, cut him off, smother him in love, he has built this fortress around himself and this wall of depression is something I just cant get through. The last counsellor I spoke to said " he will get better when he wants to", which is probably right but doesnt help me.

 

Im a fixer, a problem solver, its what I do for a living, but he is beating me all ends up here, I cannot drag him from the well of depression he is in and break the cycle of depression>gear>weed>depression. His depression is the single worst thing I have ever tried to face down, I can only imagine how much worse it is for him. 

 

 

Must be difficult that mate. All you can do is support him the best you can and hopefully at some point he manages to find something positive that stabilises him.

 

[Bjornebye]

6 minutes ago, redinblack said:

My eldest boy is struggling quite badly.

 

He has substance abuse issues, Ive spent the best part of 15 years trying various methods to address that, his depression comes and goes but the stuff he does is his way of self medicating and at the moment it is stratospheric in terms of intake and his depression is the worst its ever been.

 

I have tried everything, I have tried to get him counselling, good cop, bad cop, cut him off, smother him in love, he has built this fortress around himself and this wall of depression is something I just cant get through. The last counsellor I spoke to said " he will get better when he wants to", which is probably right but doesnt help me.

 

Im a fixer, a problem solver, its what I do for a living, but he is beating me all ends up here, I cannot drag him from the well of depression he is in and break the cycle of depression>gear>weed>depression. His depression is the single worst thing I have ever tried to face down, I can only imagine how much worse it is for him. 

 

 

Keep going mate, you need it and so does he. As hard as it is, he needs every bit of help you’re giving him. Maybe introduce something brand new to his life? A distraction x good luck mate 

[YorkshireRed]

35 minutes ago, redinblack said:

My eldest boy is struggling quite badly.

 

He has substance abuse issues, Ive spent the best part of 15 years trying various methods to address that, his depression comes and goes but the stuff he does is his way of self medicating and at the moment it is stratospheric in terms of intake and his depression is the worst its ever been.

 

I have tried everything, I have tried to get him counselling, good cop, bad cop, cut him off, smother him in love, he has built this fortress around himself and this wall of depression is something I just cant get through. The last counsellor I spoke to said " he will get better when he wants to", which is probably right but doesnt help me.

 

Im a fixer, a problem solver, its what I do for a living, but he is beating me all ends up here, I cannot drag him from the well of depression he is in and break the cycle of depression>gear>weed>depression. His depression is the single worst thing I have ever tried to face down, I can only imagine how much worse it is for him. 

 

 

This must be extraordinarily difficult for both of you. All you can do is love him. Whatever that means, including all you’ve tried. Whether it works or not, it’s coming from a place of love and sometimes that’s all we have. 
 

Wishing you love also.