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Are you happy about Benteke?

    The Christian Benteke saga looks to be nearing it's conclusion after the Reds activated his release clause by agreeing to pay Aston Villa a whopping £32.5m for the big Belgian. The news hasn't been met with universal approval amongst the fans so we asked three of our contributors for their view on what will be the second most expensive signing in club history should the deal go through...

The first thing to state about this issue is that I've always believed that the club should back the manager. I felt there was clear justification to remove him at the end of the season and, despite liking and rating him, would have sent him packing once Jurgen Klopp's availability was confirmed. However, FSG have stood by their man and are therefore committed to backing him or else it's tantamount to telling him to pack his bags anyway. So in that regard, I think this is an important signing. 

 

In terms of the player himself, he's obviously a talent. He is very powerful, great in the air and has good touch and awareness. Best of all though is that he has a one in two record over the last three seasons for Villa. Furthermore, he utterly destroyed us at Anfield in Rodgers' first season, bullying Martin Skrtel to such an extent I literally felt embarrassed to watch. 

 

Unusually, I was sat in the Main Stand in line with the edge of the area that day and Benteke repeatedly turned Skrtel inside out and knocked him all over the place right in front of me. That made a strong impression that I haven't forgotten and I'm therefore not in the daft "He's rubbish" camp that has emerged amongst Reds this summer. 

 

However, what is concerning about this imminent signing is the way Brendan seems to base his transfer targets around performances against us as it has backfired in a number of cases of late; not least with Dejan Lovren. Raising your game against Liverpool is what you'd expect from every player in the league. We need to look at how they do against everyone else as well though. 

 

And in that regard, Benteke's goal record looks good: 49 in 101 over three seasons. However, there are peaks and troughs within that figure with a great first season followed by sporadic purple patches and a serious injury. That said, under Sherwood, he quite clearly began to spark once more - but the issue is why and how. 

 

For me, therein lies the problem. Benteke has predominantly played in a different way to how we operate. He's been asked to feed off service from the flanks and has responded well. However that is emphatically not our game and nor do I see it becoming so either as we simply don't have the players for it. 

 

In fact, to me this transfer smacks of further murky thinking from the manager around his system of play. Last summer we seemed to throw the blueprint out of the window and grab players unsuited to the mobile "diamond plus two" style that had taken us so close to the title. Don't get me wrong, I know there isn't a Luis Mk II out there. However, there are approximations and I think we'd be far better served going for tricky mobile types rather than a (flat track?) bully like Benteke. 

 

That all said, I'll suspend my disbelief and back him to the hilt. Don't be mistaken, though - this almost certainly represents Rodgers' last chance at a Red future because if he doesn't make an investment of this size count, he'll be gone quicker than you can say, "Jurgen to the rescue!"

 

Let's hope he can set the team up to get the lad firing then because the last thing this club needs is yet another revolution of playing and coaching staff that sees more money flushed down the drain. That's certainly what'll happen if he doesn't. 

 

No pressure there then, Christian! Welcome to Liverpool. 

 

Paul Natton

@OxtonSoulBoy

 


 

I’m on the fence. I rate Benteke very highly and on his day he’s as good as almost any striker in the Premier League. He’s been unplayable against us a few times and is a much better footballer than he’s given credit for. He’s not just a lump who scores headers and comparisons with Andy Carroll are way off beam and unfair. He’s a clever link player who likes to drop off and get involved in the build up, and he loves a sneaky back heel.

 

All that said, he also thrives on crosses and Tim Sherwood got the best out of him by getting balls into the box early from wide areas. He didn’t do it by playing wingers who get to the byline and whip crosses over, Sherwood played a midfield diamond and it was the full backs or midfielders who supplied the crosses, often from deep. We have players who can do that, but it’s not been Rodgers’ style and we cross the ball less than anybody else in the league, so will that now change? Presumably it will, otherwise what’s the point in spending so much on Benteke?

 

It’s not that he can’t be successful without that kind of service, but without it you’re not getting the maximum from the player. Why go for Benteke and have him at 75% effectiveness when you could get someone more suited to how you play and have them at 100% of their capability? It’s like signing a teenage Michael Owen and telling him he’s not allowed to run fast or telling Adam Lallana he can’t do Cruyff turns and run his fingers through his hair every ten seconds.

 

So I have some doubts about how successful this signing will be, but I’m far from being totally against it. I do like the options we now have in terms of playing either 4-3-3 or a 4-4-2 diamond. Benteke could play through the middle on his own, or in a two with Roberto Firmino, Divock Origi or Danny Ings. And if and when Sturridge returns at full capacity there’s no reason they couldn’t form an effective pairing.

 

 

I’m not at all worried that Benteke will be a complete flop because he’s too good a player for that. He’ll either be brilliant or average.

 

Dave Usher

@theliverpoolway

 


 

Before I even start I should say that I hope Benteke is a roaring success at Liverpool and he scores loads of goals for us. Right, now that I’ve said that I have to admit that I’m completely underwhelmed by Benteke signing for Liverpool. I won’t deny that my reasons aren’t grounded in fact or reason but then that’s part of being a football fan isn’t it?

 

First off, whatever Aston Villa are selling, I’m not buying. Nothing good ever came out of Aston Villa. The last signing we made from there was one of the worst we ever made, I still get shivers watching that player underperforming in games, flat-out disappearing when the going got tough and then don’t forget that the one time he did score, he shushed the Kop. Yes, Stewart Downing’s shadow lingers long over my thoughts on Aston Villa and Liverpool transfers.

 

Of course this is a completely unreasonable line of thinking and it’s not one that I take completely seriously (although the Downing stuff is all true, he was CRAP) but it does parlay into something else. There’s nothing attractive about signing a player from Aston Villa, they’re a dull team with dull fans who are dull to watch. Now Tactic Timmy did rectify that somewhat last season by making his defenders defend like, well, us for the latter part of the season but still, exciting players don’t come from Villa.

 

If we’re splashing north of £30 million on a player then I’d like said player to come from a big team and be a big name. Is that shallow? Absolutely but again, there’s a kernel of sense in there (no, there is) because what Benteke really lays bare is that Liverpool’s transfer policy is based on a flawed premise that it’s not the outlay on fee that matters but the wages the player is paid. Liverpool are willing to pay £30 million, that’s great, but surely we can agree that there are other players out there who would cost in the same region but who are better players and would be a better fit for our style of play. The difference between buying a big name player from a Champions League team and someone from a mid-table Premier League team is that a big name player will already be on large wages whereas someone from a mid-table Premier League team is likely to be on a lot less.

 

In the history of football transfers no player has ever moved clubs for the same wage, they’ve always had an increase. Liverpool don’t want to commit to big wages with a new signing, so they’re happy to increase Benteke’s wage from say 60k to 100k rather than buy a player who wants a raise from something like 150k to 180k. That philosophy is flawed for me as it’ll always mean that the club is compromising its player searches before they’ve even begun.

 

So I’ll finish as I started. I want nothing more than for this transfer to work out for the player and the club. I hope I’m proven wrong and that my spurious reasoning is shown up. There’s still that nagging doubt in the back of my mind that the club is repeating past mistakes, trying to buy big by identifying players by wage and not by how talented they are. I really hope I’m wrong.

 

Julian Richards

@Juleswithnoname

 


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Just can't get my head around the fee, and that he's basically going to be the final player through the door.

I still look at our striker options and it's definitely one short. Problem being that we've paid so much for Benteke that it renders another signing impossible, and he de facto becomes our first choice striker because he's the most expensive.

 

 

STRIKER OPTIONS CL CONTENDERS (PL goals in brackets) :

 

LIVERPOOL: Benteke (42), Sturridge (61), Ings (11), Origi (0) = 114

 

MAN CITY : Bony (27), Aguero (78), Dzeko (50), Jovetic (8) = 163

 

ARSENAL : Giroud (41), Sanchez (16), Walcott (50), Welbeck (50) = 157

 

UNITED : Rooney (185), Depay (0), Hernandez (37), Wilson (3) = 225

 

CHELSEA : Costa (20), Falcao (4), Remy (27), Bamford (0) = 51

 

 

You can take anything you want from that info, but for me the most important thing in terms of winning games is that you have enough people in your side to score goals at any point.

Chelsea's forward don't have a lot of PL goals between them, but if Costa stays fit all season then they're laughing. But if he does pick up an injury then I don't fancy Chelsea's chances much.

 

United are massively dependent on Rooney, and it's yet to be seen how effective Depay will be. It's a risk.

 

City have a very good balance of strikers with goals under their belt, they will challenge for everything.

 

Same with Arsenal, it's a well-balanced attacking quartet with experience and goals and pace.

 

Our line-up is not as strong, there are big questionmarks around Sturridge's fitness, and Origi's ability, and whereas Ings and Benteke look like they will score goals in this division, we're not talking about searing pace and outrageous goals from all angles here.

 

 

I find it hard to stomach that City got Bony for £7m less than we're paying for Benteke.

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STRIKER OPTIONS CL CONTENDERS (PL goals in brackets) :

 

LIVERPOOL: Benteke (42), Sturridge (61), Ings (11), Origi (0) = 114

 

MAN CITY : Bony (27), Aguero (78), Dzeko (50), Jovetic (8) = 163

 

ARSENAL : Giroud (41), Sanchez (16), Walcott (50), Welbeck (50) = 157

 

UNITED : Rooney (185), Depay (0), Hernandez (37), Wilson (3) = 225

 

CHELSEA : Costa (20), Falcao (4), Remy (27), Bamford (0) = 51

 

Since some of those players were playing in other leagues, I think it's a lot more useful to do this in terms of goals scored at pro level over the past 3 seasons, total (regardless of league).  In which case it looks like:

 

Liverpool: Benteke (49), Sturridge (40), Ings (40), Origi (16) = 145

 

Man City: Bony (73), Aguero (77), Dzeko (47), Jovetic (24) = 221

 

Arsenal: Giroud (58), Sanchez (57), Walcott (34), Welbeck (20) = 169

 

Man United: Rooney (49), Depay (45), Hernandez (36), Wilson (4) = 134

 

Chelsea: Costa (77), Falcao (51), Remy (31), Bamford (48) = 207

 

Now, obviously, some of those goals came against lower league opposition and should be discounted somewhat (primarily Bamford and Ings) and some came in the Dutch league where you could also argue for a discounted value, though less of one (Depay and Bony, mostly) but this shows a bit better the kind of form these players are in.

 

Even better would be one done by non-penalty goals/90 minutes on the pitch, but this took me more than 5 minutes so I'm definitely not sitting down to do all that.  Even at this level you can look at it and right away see that the Mancs are one striker away (and they're likely to add one) from taking them pretty distant from us, so our best hope is that Arsenal implode for some reason if we're to get fourth.

 

Real shame we didn't get Depay - he would have slotted in as a better version of Sterling, and would have cost less as well.  That is a huge missed opportunity, as was the chance to nick Dzeko who I think would have been a better fit for us than Benteke as well as costing about half the price.

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Since some of those players were playing in other leagues, I think it's a lot more useful to do this in terms of goals scored at pro level over the past 3 seasons, total (regardless of league). In which case it looks like:

 

Liverpool: Benteke (49), Sturridge (40), Ings (40), Origi (16) = 145

 

Man City: Bony (73), Aguero (77), Dzeko (47), Jovetic (24) = 221

 

Arsenal: Giroud (58), Sanchez (57), Walcott (34), Welbeck (20) = 169

 

Man United: Rooney (49), Depay (45), Hernandez (36), Wilson (4) = 134

 

Chelsea: Costa (77), Falcao (51), Remy (31), Bamford (48) = 207

 

Now, obviously, some of those goals came against lower league opposition and should be discounted somewhat (primarily Bamford and Ings) and some came in the Dutch league where you could also argue for a discounted value, though less of one (Depay and Bony, mostly) but this shows a bit better the kind of form these players are in.

 

Even better would be one done by non-penalty goals/90 minutes on the pitch, but this took me more than 5 minutes so I'm definitely not sitting down to do all that. Even at this level you can look at it and right away see that the Mancs are one striker away (and they're likely to add one) from taking them pretty distant from us, so our best hope is that Arsenal implode for some reason if we're to get fourth.

 

Real shame we didn't get Depay - he would have slotted in as a better version of Sterling, and would have cost less as well. That is a huge missed opportunity, as was the chance to nick Dzeko who I think would have been a better fit for us than Benteke as well as costing about half the price.

If you are including Depay surely you also have to include Firmino?

Since Depay seems to have been our first go to replace Sterling and Firmino second.

He's scored 39 in the last 3 seasons by your measures I think.

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I think he needs to hit the ground running as he was somewhat inconsistent at Villa.

Yep, although maintaining a good scoring ratio throughout his time at Villa, his actual goals scored usually came in patches. It would be nice if he could spread it out a bit throughout the season.

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I am pretty happy with Benteke. Whilst hes not on paper the ideal fit for our style of play he's a quality striker that can effectively lead the line, He's also as good a player as we can likely get given we don't have CL football or 50 or 60 mill to splash out on getting someone that's potentially better. So all joking aside well done to the club signing this guy and welcome aboard the Bounty Mr Christian,

 

The one that intrigues me is Gomez , Of all our signings i have sneaky suspicion this lad could be special . I'm looking forward to seeing him get his chance 

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It doesn't make sense to me, I would rather a first choice plan A than a first choice plan B.

 

That said, he's very good at what he does and the money in football is beyond a fucking joke now, so I can't complain except on tactical grounds.

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Big Ben is no Torres or Suarez but he's exactly what we need,he scores 1 in every 2 games,he stays central and actually gets in the box unlike Mario and Borini.

 

If teams press us high we can dink it up to him for 5 minutes and get back on front foot.think we will mix our style up a lot more now

 

If teams sit deep and block us off centrally like last year?atleast we'll have a striker who will be in centre of goal worrying CBs giving our CAMs more space

 

We'll have a forward who gets in box and bangs it into back of the net which will be nice to see again

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I love the argument that he's not a Rodgers player, I'm pretty sure Rodgers wanted him, and signed him, he's clearly got plans for him, which I really hope come off.

 

Like he clearly had plans for Can and Markovic when he signed them? Was the clear plans always to play them at centre-back and right wing-back respectively?

 

Rodgers himself doesn't know what a Rodgers player is.

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I like the criticism that he hits purple patches.  What I would give for a purple patch from one of our strikers. We barely mustered a crimson or maroon patch last season.   In fact there were no patches at all.  Patchless, that's what we were.  

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It doesn't make sense to me, I would rather a first choice plan A than a first choice plan B.

 

You have no evidence to suggest that's true. Why not call him a Plan C behind Ings and Firmino?
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I like the criticism that he hits purple patches. What I would give for a purple patch from one of our strikers. We barely mustered a crimson or maroon patch last season. In fact there were no patches at all. Patchless, that's what we were.

It is true though, and not really a criticism, more of an observation. It can be argued that it was due to a combination of poor tactics, regaining match fitness and playing in a dire team.

 

We've spent a lot of money on him, so questions should be asked. Can he bring consistency into his game by playing in a better team? Can he adapt to altered tactics? who do we have to play to his strengths to ensure he provides a constant goal return?

 

without knocking his overall goal return, which is quite respectable, I'd personally like to see him score a goal every two games literally, rather than go through an extremely long dry patch and getting a couple of goals in a few games which boosts his stats. That for me is what really defines consistency in a striker. And though I have doubts whether he can achieve that, I truly hope that he can attain and maintain that level.

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