PODCAST: Red or Dead?

2 hours ago, Red_or_Dead said:

Surprised no-one mentioned the kangaroo court of the FA report into the Evra incident regarding Suarez.  But, other than that a great listen!

 

 

It was a kangaroo court, you’re right, but I just don’t think at this point, it’s worth making that point. He said something to a black player that was deemed offensive by that player. End of story. 
 

This wasn’t a Holgate/Bobby situation where it was pure bollocks. 

I'll never not think the whole thing was a complete stitch up, but I don't have the energy or motivation to bother arguing that case all over again all these years later. 

So....

This was supposed to be at the end of the pod but I had to chop it in case Adele sued me.

Dave's ten minute, passionate insight into his love and let down by Suarez was beautiful. 

I laughed like a drain at Adrianna routinely bringing Dave crashing back down to earth. I dread the day when my son (8) is going to do the same to me.

18 hours ago, dave u said:

 

This was supposed to be at the end of the pod but I had to chop it in case Adele sued me.

Hahah

Daves Adele story turned my stomach the utter Wrongun.

4 minutes ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

Daves Adele story turned my stomach the utter Wrongun.

I don't event want no Jell-O now. Who gonna wanna eat Jell-O after I heard what I heard?

On 09/10/2021 at 19:40, Chris said:

Wait til you hear Dave's heartwarming tale of lost love, with a certain songstress serenading him...

 

 

I’m half way through this and it’s the most enjoyable podcast I’ve listened to this season out of any.  Really really good.  I’ve a 3 hour drive to Shannon Airport early tomorrow morning so this will start the journey. 
 

Although when Jules announced at the very start that he doesn’t give a shit once a player leaves the club I did question the casting for this episode, but luckily Jules has been really good and I’ve found myself agreeing with him the most I think. 
 

So far I’m 100% in agreement with Chris on Suarez. I’m particularly loving the Diouf comment. 
 

The Coutinho and Sterling stuff was what I feel too. With Coutinho I’d go further and say that I think Klopp would have identified him early doors as someone he could move on for big money as he didn’t fit the style anyway. I reckon it was all a show about building statues, etc. 
 

I’ve stopped it at the Torres chat. I’m looking forward to my early drive now. I suspect the Alonso chat won’t annoy me at all…

Johnny is defo going to take all of that back when he hears us ripping all the absolute fucking weirdo's who turned against Xabi.

Funny thing is, I went overboard on that specifically as I knew he'd be listening! I almost name checked him at one point too, just to wind him up even more.

I think you’re all going to be in for a shock…….

when you hear I skipped past that part. 

1 hour ago, JohnnyH said:

I think you’re all going to be in for a shock…….

 

 

 

 

 

when you hear I skipped past that part. 

Basically like when I skip City and United games on MOTD unless they get beat.

On 10/10/2021 at 06:03, Chris said:

 

Michael Owen scored 158 Liverpool goals, won the Ballon d'Or while at Liverpool, won the FA Cup pretty much by himself in 2001 and contributed more than anyone to our treble cup season in 2001. He's the best young player I've ever seen and, if not for weird circumstances, would have come back to Liverpool long before he was forced to choose between Man United and Stoke. 

 

Michael Owen scores the goals Halle-lu-uh-yah.

You got one thing particularly wrong in your defence of Owen for me. You said it wasn’t really divisive when he left, and nobody really wished him ill but I’m not having that.

the “where we’re you in Istanbul” chant that was sung to him on his first return to anfield (with Newcastle?) was loud and strong and showed what it had meant to people when he jibbed us.

I wrote how I felt about him after he did that podcast interview with Owen where he felt really sorry for himself for how hard done by he’d been by the fans. Not having it. 
 

I can feel sorry for how it ended with us not liking him and him not being the legend he should’ve been, but I’m not having it to feel it’s our fault. He chose his bed.

he can work his way back in, but he’ll never be loved by me again. wall of champions input appreciated, good times remembered, but no more.

On 10/10/2021 at 20:34, dave u said:

 

This was supposed to be at the end of the pod but I had to chop it in case Adele sued me.

I was listening while decorating my

girls bedroom and my

missus came up just as you’d finished your Suarez love story, so I made her take my phone and listen to the opening 11 minutes.

she has no respect for me, but she can now at least understand I’m not alone.

I once said to her, fairly early in our relationship (and in the context of a conversation we were having, not as a completely arsehole thing to say) that “I’ve been in love once, I can’t imagine it happening another time”.

I think we both thought I meant the ex-wife, but on reflection I probably sub-consciously meant Luis.

I’m sitting here in the ridiculously named “Barack Obama Plaza” which is a services in Offaly on the motorway between Dublin and Limerick. Thus named because Obama’s great great great something or other was born up the road from here, I’m guessing before the services opened. 
 

I’ve now finished the episode and still

think it was one of the best of the year. A match report will never be a “best of year” because how can it be?  But something like this one is great as you get a trip down memory lane, get to listen to discussions about player not really talked about any more, and get to confirm your long held thought that Dave is a fanny when you listen to his pining patheticness around Suarez and heartbreak pop music. So well done to all. Hope you can come up with something similar at the next international break. 
 

As for discussion points-

Owen - couldn’t agree more. The sense of ridiculousness Dave has for the Alonso haters is the same as I have for Owen haters. Owen is more of a Liverpool legend then every other player discussed on that podcast and many not. His contribution to the club is written on the legends wall which you can’t say for so many other players who are thought of as “legends”. 
 

Collymore, McManaman, Torres, I feel pretty much the same. Although with Torres I don’t think he downed tools as much as people say or that by the time he’s gone to Chelsea he’s forgotten how to play, I think he was already a spent force in that final spell with us. It was partly not arsed, and partly his game had gone. Still not a “red” though. 
 

Alonso - yeah, I pretty much agree with most of that was said.

In truth, my main I issue was never massively with Alonso as much as it was with that cohort of fans who just turned on Benitez overnight. The lack of respect from them for a manager who brought us arguably our greatest every night, and an FA Cup (our last one) the year after always grated. I just hated that our fans, who I thought were special, were clearly just the same as any other spoilt, ungrateful fans. Now if you were annoyed at Rafa, that’s fine. It’s the ones who immediately started abusing him that turned me. I couldn’t, and still can’t, understand that level of ingratitude. And Dave hit on that with the “Rafa Wars” stuff. It was horrible. The “anti Rafa taliban” and all that. Deeply unpleasant stuff that would never have happened before the internet as the binary, you either love him or hate him crap that the internet does doesn’t exist when the discussion is over a pint. 
 

As for Alonso? I noticed how Dave said it was bolox he played poorly for two years, and then promptly made a few excuses for why he wasn’t at his best…. But I agree with that. He wasn’t “poor” but he was not 2004/05 or 2008/09 as evidenced by the fact no one came in to buy him when he was available in 2008  However, he should never have even for sale, as 2008 Alonso was still very good with obvious space for improvement. As evidenced the following season. I remember in the past trying to put myself in Rafas shoes to explain why he might have thought the way he did (and making it clear I was doing exactly that) and immediately just getting abuse on the forum for “despising Xabi” and so just giving up on the conversation. You could never just have a normal conversation about it. That’s what made it such a big issues. 
 

But the press leaks from Alonso about how Rafa forced him out annoyed me a bit too. Clearly done to ingratiate himself with the fans. If he’d just said he wanted to go back to Spain and the change to move to Real was too good I’d have been cool with it. But tocause more division was annoying.

I also didn’t want Gareth Barry, but revisionism goes both ways. The idea Barry was crap is about as daft as the idea Alonso was crap for 2 years. Barry went to City and won the league and also won the fans MVP for the season. He was seen as pivotal in their midfield. So you can’t moan about revisionism to make one argument but then use to make another. However, Barry was not what we needed, so I didn’t get to the link either, no matter now much Stevie Gerard wanted it to happen. 
 

Anyway, I’d have Alonso as a red. His contribution to Istanbul, The FA Cup run the next year, the 2008/09 title challenge and many other moments means he is a red. 
 

And just a quick one on Aquilani. So many people speak of the lad from a place of ignorance. I was living in Italy when he was playing and saw him play live a load of times. He was superb. I remember when Ferguson came in for him at Utd and I was gutted, but then delighted when it didn’t happen. And I was then over the moon when we got him. It was a disaster of course due to injury and him never settling, but to judge the reason for signing him on his time AFTER signing him is wrong. He was a brilliant player. You don’t get to be a full Italian international in midfield without being a very very good player. So I can 100% fully understand why we went for him. Slam how it went at Liverpool absolutely but stating it was crazy that we went for him based on what happened AFTER we bought him is wrong. 
 

Great episode though lads. Thanks for doing it. 

Just listening now.

Loving Dave’s pining for Suarez when Go West, Adele and Depeche Mode come on the radio. 

1 hour ago, JohnnyH said:

I’m sitting here in the ridiculously named “Barack Obama Plaza” which is a services in Offaly on the motorway between Dublin and Limerick. Thus named because Obama’s great great great something or other was born up the road from here, I’m guessing before the services opened. 
 

I’ve now finished the episode and still

think it was one of the best of the year. A match report will never be a “best of year” because how can it be?  But something like this one is great as you get a trip down memory lane, get to listen to discussions about player not really talked about any more, and get to confirm your long held thought that Dave is a fanny when you listen to his pining patheticness around Suarez and heartbreak pop music. So well done to all. Hope you can come up with something similar at the next international break. 
 

As for discussion points-

 

Owen - couldn’t agree more. The sense of ridiculousness Dave has for the Alonso haters is the same as I have for Owen haters. Owen is more of a Liverpool legend then every other player discussed on that podcast and many not. His contribution to the club is written on the legends wall which you can’t say for so many other players who are thought of as “legends”. 
 

Collymore, McManaman, Torres, I feel pretty much the same. Although with Torres I don’t think he downed tools as much as people say or that by the time he’s gone to Chelsea he’s forgotten how to play, I think he was already a spent force in that final spell with us. It was partly not arsed, and partly his game had gone. Still not a “red” though. 
 

Alonso - yeah, I pretty much agree with most of that was said.

In truth, my main I issue was never massively with Alonso as much as it was with that cohort of fans who just turned on Benitez overnight. The lack of respect from them for a manager who brought us arguably our greatest every night, and an FA Cup (our last one) the year after always grated. I just hated that our fans, who I thought were special, were clearly just the same as any other spoilt, ungrateful fans. Now if you were annoyed at Rafa, that’s fine. It’s the ones who immediately started abusing him that turned me. I couldn’t, and still can’t, understand that level of ingratitude. And Dave hit on that with the “Rafa Wars” stuff. It was horrible. The “anti Rafa taliban” and all that. Deeply unpleasant stuff that would never have happened before the internet as the binary, you either love him or hate him crap that the internet does doesn’t exist when the discussion is over a pint. 
 

As for Alonso? I noticed how Dave said it was bolox he played poorly for two years, and then promptly made a few excuses for why he wasn’t at his best…. But I agree with that. He wasn’t “poor” but he was not 2004/05 or 2008/09 as evidenced by the fact no one came in to buy him when he was available in 2008  However, he should never have even for sale, as 2008 Alonso was still very good with obvious space for improvement. As evidenced the following season. I remember in the past trying to put myself in Rafas shoes to explain why he might have thought the way he did (and making it clear I was doing exactly that) and immediately just getting abuse on the forum for “despising Xabi” and so just giving up on the conversation. You could never just have a normal conversation about it. That’s what made it such a big issues. 
 

But the press leaks from Alonso about how Rafa forced him out annoyed me a bit too. Clearly done to ingratiate himself with the fans. If he’d just said he wanted to go back to Spain and the change to move to Real was too good I’d have been cool with it. But tocause more division was annoying.

 

I also didn’t want Gareth Barry, but revisionism goes both ways. The idea Barry was crap is about as daft as the idea Alonso was crap for 2 years. Barry went to City and won the league and also won the fans MVP for the season. He was seen as pivotal in their midfield. So you can’t moan about revisionism to make one argument but then use to make another. However, Barry was not what we needed, so I didn’t get to the link either, no matter now much Stevie Gerard wanted it to happen. 
 

Anyway, I’d have Alonso as a red. His contribution to Istanbul, The FA Cup run the next year, the 2008/09 title challenge and many other moments means he is a red. 
 

And just a quick one on Aquilani. So many people speak of the lad from a place of ignorance. I was living in Italy when he was playing and saw him play live a load of times. He was superb. I remember when Ferguson came in for him at Utd and I was gutted, but then delighted when it didn’t happen. And I was then over the moon when we got him. It was a disaster of course due to injury and him never settling, but to judge the reason for signing him on his time AFTER signing him is wrong. He was a brilliant player. You don’t get to be a full Italian international in midfield without being a very very good player. So I can 100% fully understand why we went for him. Slam how it went at Liverpool absolutely but stating it was crazy that we went for him based on what happened AFTER we bought him is wrong. 
 

Great episode though lads. Thanks for doing it. 

 

Cost you a well deserved rep that. Negged. 

Just to clarify.

I didn't call Gareth Barry 'crap'. I called him 'crab'.

(He was crap though, relative to Alonso anyway).

1 minute ago, dave u said:

Just to clarify.

 

I didn't call Gareth Barry 'crap'. I called him 'crab'.

 

(He was crap though, relative to Alonso anyway).

Not as bad as “World Class El-Hadj Diouf.

Spat my coffee out everywhere at that. And you are right about Suarez. 

12 minutes ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

Cost you a well deserved rep that. Negged. 

Fair. But I did that because that was specifically what they voted him. He wasn’t their best player just the one they felt was most important to the overall. So your neg was actually to Man City fans, which I’m fully in favour of. 

1 hour ago, JohnnyH said:

And I was then over the moon when we got him. It was a disaster of course due to injury and him never settling, but to judge the reason for signing him on his time AFTER signing him is wrong. He was a brilliant player. You don’t get to be a full Italian international in midfield without being a very very good player. So I can 100% fully understand why we went for him. Slam how it went at Liverpool absolutely but stating it was crazy that we went for him based on what happened AFTER we bought him is wrong. 
 

Great episode though lads. Thanks for doing it. 

 

*cough* Fabio Borini

28 minutes ago, JohnnyH said:

Fair. But I did that because that was specifically what they voted him. He wasn’t their best player just the one they felt was most important to the overall. So your neg was actually to Man City fans, which I’m fully in favour of. 

Ha! I just assumed you’d gone all “Soccer” on us. 

6 hours ago, Bob Spunkmouse said:

You got one thing particularly wrong in your defence of Owen for me. You said it wasn’t really divisive when he left, and nobody really wished him ill but I’m not having that.

 

the “where we’re you in Istanbul” chant that was sung to him on his first return to anfield (with Newcastle?) was loud and strong and showed what it had meant to people when he jibbed us.

 

I wrote how I felt about him after he did that podcast interview with Owen where he felt really sorry for himself for how hard done by he’d been by the fans. Not having it. 
 

I can feel sorry for how it ended with us not liking him and him not being the legend he should’ve been, but I’m not having it to feel it’s our fault. He chose his bed.

 

he can work his way back in, but he’ll never be loved by me again. wall of champions input appreciated, good times remembered, but no more.

This took me back a bit. I just listened back to the Owen segment and I actually didn't say any of that. Maybe you're thinking of the McManaman bit? 

No problems with anything else you said, you're perfectly entitled to that stance and I know in many ways I'm in the minority in how I feel about Owen.

37 minutes ago, Chris said:

 

This took me back a bit. I just listened back to the Owen segment and I actually didn't say any of that. Maybe you're thinking of the McManaman bit? 

 

No problems with anything else you said, you're perfectly entitled to that stance and I know in many ways I'm in the minority in how I feel about Owen.

Bollocks. So because they were your words from your mouth, and you’ve taken the time to go back and re-listen to them to confirm, I’m supposed to just accept that I got It wrong without any proof?!?! Fuck that. 
 

I stand by what I said, and if anything believe it even more now.

(fair enough, my bad).