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A few thoughts from the Southampton game - by Paul Natton

1. So for the first time in our history we’ve won the first seven games of a season. First time. In our history. Seven!!! Won!!!

 

2. PSG excepted though, we’ve barely hit third gear and today was very much in that vein. However it wasn’t about riding our luck or scraping through. We’re just very, very good and can beat most sides we face without breaking a sweat. 

 

3. I don’t mean to imply arrogance or complacency though. We’ve been grafting constantly in every game and the third gear thing is about form rather than choice or attitude. That said, there is something hugely satisfying about us being able to experiment with the line up as we did here and still emerge as eminently comfortable winners. 

 

4. Klopp went with Shaqiri in midfield, resting Milner in exchange, but also switched the front three around with Salah through the middle, Mané right and Bobby left (in the first half at least). It wasn’t exactly fluent and yet it led to three first half goals. He’s getting this whole squad thing eminently right so far and indeed starting to step it up at just the right time. 

 

5. Shaqiri looked lively on his first start, working hard and linking well with his teammates. His free kick for Mo’s goal was sensational and it was disappointing that he emerged onto the bench for the second half. Hopefully that was just a precaution from Klopp with Wednesday night in mind, as he’d taken a clattering about 35 minutes in. Either way though, he was good and I’ll be disappointed if he isn’t starting when we play Chelsea in the league cup. He looks hungry, aggressive and very Kloppball-esque. For thirteen million quid. Sound. 

 

6. Despite Klopp dipping his toes into rotation today (before no doubt fully embracing it on Wednesday night), he stuck with his front three and, while he wasn’t on fire, Mo looked sharper again. He’s now got three goals and two assists in six league games. Not bad for a lad who’s apparently out of form. He could have had more too, with what seemed a weird offside decision denying him at least the brace. 

 

7. Virgil going off gave the crowd a wobble with The Kop noticeably more jittery afterwards. However, that was surely more testament to his universally accepted importance to the side rather than any perceived drop off on the pitch in his absence as Joe G came on and, despite playing on the other side to normal, was very Virgil-like in his composure and class on the ball. Indeed there was one moment where he shut down a Southampton break on our left flank on his own that was absolutely brilliant, stealing the ball and laying it off to Robbo (who unfortunately contrived to immediately give it away). 

 

8. Which brings me to our joke of a captain. I mean, can you believe this? He ripped Robbo’s head off not once, but twice for that error and we all know he’s not fit to wear the armband/is a crab/never shows his teeth/(insert more random internet gobshite bollocks). All sarcasm aside, I haven’t heard a single complaint about Hendo at the match since the season he arrived under Kenny and played like a timid kid when deployed on the right. He was good again today, just like he always is, playing that cog-in-the-Kloppball-machine role to perfection. The moral of this story? We’ve got some bad blerts following us online and Hendo is boss. 

 

9.  While I’m on about the midfield, the TLW lads were all chatting before the game and Spurs’ less than stellar start was discussed in relation to their lack of signings and in the context of what ours have done for us. For all the broader rumblings about Fabinho barely featuring, people seem to be missing the impact the new signings have had on our existing midfielders. Certainly Gini and Milner have raised their games (almost unbelievably in Milner’s case after his brilliance last year) and that is exactly what happens at title winning clubs. That’s not to say we will win the title, but it’s clear that the momentum is relentlessly forward and much of it is currently the result of improvements from the more unsung players of last season. 

 

10. So, the great start to the campaign continues apace and there’s no reason to think that can’t continue in the week. I expect we’ll see a dramatically changed side, but these players are so well drilled that I don’t envisage a problem against Chelsea on Wednesday. In fact, I think this winning run is going to be sustained up to and including City so settled and reassuringly drilled have we been. There, I’ve said it: we'll beat Chelsea and City. Come on you Reds!!!

 

Paul Natton

Edited by dave u


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9 minutes ago, Alex_K said:

 

Bit of a cliche thing to say this -- when, the 1960s? Because for decades there have been phone-ins, for decades before the internet there were fanzines with contrasting opinions and write-in sections .. the idea that is bandied about as if football was only discussed in little mini enclaves before first the "Sky generation" and more lately "Twitter generation" is a bit fanciful. Sure, some of the comments are more vitriolic and sensationalist now, but there was also plenty of vitriol in the public forum before ...

 

Henderson is useful against the sides that want to play on to us .. when he's given the ball for long periods of time against deep sides without any space opening up in front he doesn't really know what to do with it. He -- and Emre Can -- are both pretty big reasons for our poor recent record against United's Mourinho-football. But with Keita & Shaqiri at the club in a more adventurous capacity, hopefully those limitations don't surface too much this year. Of the first 11 though, Henderson is probably the least-important/most replaceable (that's not an inherent criticism, I'd just be interested to hear of any other player who people think is less important to balance of the side).

A cliché? Tell me about this worldwide method of mass communication you were using constantly to discuss footy with complete strangers thousands of miles away before 4G phones. 

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34 minutes ago, Paul said:

A cliché? Tell me about this worldwide method of mass communication you were using constantly to discuss footy with complete strangers thousands of miles away before 4G phones. 

 

I’ve been doing it since 3G. 

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1 hour ago, Paul said:

A cliché? Tell me about this worldwide method of mass communication you were using constantly to discuss footy with complete strangers thousands of miles away before 4G phones. 

 

Very touchy, aren’t you? Your assertion missed out a few decades, that’s all. Football fandom didn’t not leap straight from the working mans club to Twitter; fans didn’t become hyper-critical overnight. It has always been there in various guises.

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9 hours ago, TK421 said:

Paul's tirade against the Hendo haters is one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen on the Internet, and I've visited some pretty fucked up websites in my time.  Heh.  

 

I particularly liked his "too stupid to support Liverpool" quip from the PSG "Few Thoughts".  A superb definition of some of the regulars around here.  Well played, Natton. 

 

Internet gobshite bollocks bad beauts... is fucking right.

 

*goes back to lurking because you're all twats*

 

 

Genuinely put a smile on my face. Welcome back TK 124

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Henderson should

4 hours ago, Alex_K said:

 

He -- and Emre Can -- are both pretty big reasons for our poor recent record against United's Mourinho-football. 

Henderson should start against the Mancs for sure. He should be one of the first names on the team sheet against all of the top 6. 

I can see the argument for not starting him against some shit teams, but his performance in midweek was immense. I can't remember him having a game that wasn't a 7 or better against our closest rivals.

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17 minutes ago, TheBitch said:

Henderson should

Henderson should start against the Mancs for sure. He should be one of the first names on the team sheet against all of the top 6. 

I can see the argument for not starting him against some shit teams, but his performance in midweek was immense. I can't remember him having a game that wasn't a 7 or better against our closest rivals.

 

Liverpool 0 - Manchester United 0, Anfield 2016

Liverpool 0 - Manchester United 0, Anfield 2017

 

There's two for you as a starter for 10, both games characterised by slow drudgery from the midfield 2 of Henderson/Can. It is a mistake to think that "all of the top 6" play the same way and require the same personnel. They don't. City -- a team against which Henderson will probably excel on the 7th -- are a very different proposition to United. And besides, we took 2 wins from 10 games against the rest of the top 6 last season. That is not remotely good enough, and not remotely reminiscient of consistent 7/10 games.

 

The continued emergence of the full-backs will be a boon this year, but so will the new midfielders as the year goes on. There's a reason we invested so heavily there in the summer.

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Good read as usual, Paul.

 

The Henderson part is spot on. He is criminally underrated. For me he is a 8/10 player who deserves a 9/10 sometimes and never under 6/10. If he hadn`t got the red card against City in 2014 number 19 would have been sealed that year. 

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Wouldn’t wank them off himself though, would he? No. He’d spend all day pointing at pigs he wanted other people to wank off. 

 

Souness; now there’s a man who wasn’t afraid of a drop of pig spunk.  Proper leader.

 

 

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On 9/23/2018 at 1:47 PM, ZonkoVille77 said:

Hendo gets a lot of unnecessary abuse.

He's also not as good as his fans make him out to be. 6/10 player. If he was a biscuit he'd be a Rich Tea.

All that aside, he is a vital part of how this team works. He's an excellent pro who's influence likely extends beyond the football field. 

 

You don't know what you've got until it's gone. 

He’s always a 7/10 player for me and quite often an 8/10. Not sure I’ve ever seen better than that from him though. However, if that level of consistency is a bad thing then I just think that’s cloud cuckoo land expectations. 

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23 hours ago, Alex_K said:

 

Very touchy, aren’t you? Your assertion missed out a few decades, that’s all. Football fandom didn’t not leap straight from the working mans club to Twitter; fans didn’t become hyper-critical overnight. It has always been there in various guises.

Not touchy at all mate. Just thought your point was daft and said so. 

 

I see now that you’re making a different point though which makes more sense. However, that has nothing to do with my point about extreme criticism online which was that it is much louder and becomes received wisdom. If you doubt the veracity of that, check out the number of national newspapers that now report Twitter bollocks as news. I mean literally report what someone said on Twitter as a news story. There weren’t ever any news stories in The Echo about “pissed fella in ale house says Ronnie Whelan is shite” back in the 80s. 

 

Twitter makes this this shit far more pernicious. And the players are directly exposed to it too. 

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25 minutes ago, Paul said:

He’s always a 7/10 player for me and quite often an 8/10. Not sure I’ve ever seen better than that from him though. However, if that level of consistency is a bad thing then I just think that’s cloud cuckoo land expectations. 

He is our Captain though, Paul. If, like me, you think he’s just a dependable professional, I think it’s fair to say that’s not enough. But, that said, I don’t work with him every day. The manager does, and he thinks it’s right. I’m more interested about winning than Hendo to be honest. Up the reds. If mild disagreement about a good professional is as bad as it gets this season, we are in for a hell of a ride.

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10 minutes ago, Paul said:

He’s always a 7/10 player for me and quite often an 8/10. Not sure I’ve ever seen better than that from him though. However, if that level of consistency is a bad thing then I just think that’s cloud cuckoo land expectations. 

 

There's no doubting his consistency and we were worse off for him being banned when we finished 2nd under Rodgers. Every team needs a Hendo type player. I can't recall him ever letting us down, probably because he never takes a risk. 

 

I like the lad but a bit more bravery and adventure wouldn't be too much to ask for in an LFC captain. 

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I'm happy enough with him in the squad but wish he could find his shooting boots again. He used to chip in with a few goals now and again but has given up trying now it seems. 

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1 hour ago, Paul said:

 

 

Twitter makes this this shit far more pernicious. And the players are directly exposed to it too. 

Any sauce only carries as much weight as you are willing to give it. There may be a fair few folk who dont look at Twitter at all. 

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The stuff about no one voicing a negative opinion about Henderson at the match is utter tripe. Booked an appointment with my Doctor for tomorrow as i’ve clearly been hearing voices for years. A decent player, lauded wrongly by some and slaughtered harshly by others. Me included on occasion. 

If he was a car he would be a Fiat Grande Punto. Opinions aye!

 

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On 9/23/2018 at 1:47 PM, ZonkoVille77 said:

Hendo gets a lot of unnecessary abuse.

He's also not as good as his fans make him out to be. 6/10 player. If he was a biscuit he'd be a Rich Tea.

All that aside, he is a vital part of how this team works. He's an excellent pro who's influence likely extends beyond the football field. 

 

You don't know what you've got until it's gone. 

 

I wouldn't dispute most of that, but if he was a 6/10 player he wouldn't still be here, let alone as captain and a regular in the team. He's just been given a new contract too, even though eh still had a couple of years left to run. Klopp doesn't settle for mediocrity so he obviously rates Hendo a lot more highly than a lot of our fans do. You can tell whenever Klopp is asked about criticism of Hendo that he's just got complete and utter disdain for it and genuinely can't understand it.

 

I agree with Paul. Hendo is a popular player with the crowd. There will be the odd groan here and then when the game isn't going how we'd like and he plays a 'safe' pass instead of channeling his inner Stevie, but for the most part the match crowd like Henderson a lot.

 

Then you see the absolute agenda driven fucking nonsense posted about him on various social media platforms (twitter being the one I'm best placed to comment on as I frequent it the most). It just doesn't tie in with the reality of the situation.

 

Not fit to be captain. Bang average player. Shouldn't be in the team etc 

 

We've won every game, we're top of the league, and some people want to continually fucking bitch about the captain. It's bizarre. I mean fair enough if we had some dickhead manager who didn't know what he was doing, but that's not the case is it. To listen to some of our fans you'd think Hendo was Christian Poulsen.

 

So yeah, maybe you'll also get some who go a little bit far the other way, but I've never seen anyone (even his biggest fanboys) putting him in the very top echelon of our midfielders like Souness, Gerrard, Alonso, Mascherano & co so I don't think his 'supporters' are as extreme with their views as his detractors are.

 

There is a significant element of our internet fans who are just complete fucking whoppers. Those of you not on twitter will generally not to be too familiar with it, and you should consider yourselves lucky. You only have to look at a good number of the replies on any tweet from the official club account that mentions Hendo to see how bad it is. 

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40 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

The stuff about no one voicing a negative opinion about Henderson at the match is utter tripe. Booked an appointment with my Doctor for tomorrow as i’ve clearly been hearing voices for years. A decent player, lauded wrongly by some and slaughtered harshly by others. Me included on occasion. 

If he was a car he would be a Fiat Grande Punto. Opinions aye!

 

Of course you'll get that, I mean fucking hell I've even heard people giving Mo shit (the Main Stand is a tough crowd!) but for the most part the crowd is well and truly with Henderson.

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59 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Any sauce only carries as much weight as you are willing to give it. There may be a fair few folk who dont look at Twitter at all. 

and they aren't really missing much.

 

However, Paul mentioned earlier about newspapers reporting twitter comments as news stories. Its everywhere. Clickbait websites are taking random tweets from whoppers and creating 'news' items from them. They now go trawling for tweets ripping a player and turn it into bollocks like "Liverpool fans were not happy with the performance of this 28 year old star" to get people clicking on newsnow or twitter or wherever.

 

It's a bigger thing than those who stay off twitter realise. It's not an LFC thing either, its the same for all of the big clubs. 

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