Ketosis

[Cardie]

The idea mate is not to eat processed. Bacon and cheeses get a pass because they are bacon and cheese.

I know.

 

And if that's what people did then great, as I said fresh veg and protein then great go for it. But when you have to supplement that with shit processed food just to hit targets then it suggests maybe the diet isn't right for you.

 

[Cardie]

It's Atkin's!

 

Kinda showing your naivety there.

Or lazy typing in work.

 

 

[Anny Road]

No my original argument was processed cheese sandwiched between cheese is a fucking stupid way of going about any diet, even more so when done just to achieve a target.

 

Likewise the idea that you can eat as much pre brought salad dressings as you like just to hit a target is equally ridiculous.

 

The salt and sugar alone in some of them is enough to negate any benefits but then when people see health purely in terms of weight lost I'm sure that the ketogenic diet no doubt seems attractive.

The amount of calories and subsequent salt and sugar in salad dressing is minimal and has no bearing upon health whatso ever.

30g ( a good dolop of tesco french dressing has 3g of sugar) a can of coke has 39g.

Salt is not a problem. There aren't any in meat and veg and a little bit is needed.

If you ate bacon and cheese slices all the time you would not be too healthy but noone is suggesting that.

I hit my target with eggs mainly and whole earth peanut butter as a treat.

[Lario]

Or lazy typing in work.

 

Yeah, you lazy typed a longer word.

[Cardie]

The amount of calories and subsequent salt and sugar in salad dressing is minimal and has no bearing upon health whatso ever.

30g ( a good dolop of tesco french dressing has 3g of sugar) a can of coke has 39g.

Salt is not a problem. There aren't any in meat and veg and a little bit is needed.

If you ate bacon and cheese slices all the time you would not be too healthy but noone is suggesting that.

I hit my target with eggs mainly and whole earth peanut butter as a treat.

I wonder how many of your average bumpkins will be adhering to the 30g serving and not just taking the liberal approach of slapping it between two sticks of butter cos as long as it's not bread it's ok.

 

Fad diets, people never learn.

 

 

[Anny Road]

Its not a fad mate it is arguably what we have eaten more most of our existence. Fat based diets with periods of fasting.

Its only since we have been industrialized and farming grain based food stuffs that we have eaten a large  amount of carbs. This has coincided with the western obesity epidemic.

[Cardie]

Its not a fad mate it is arguably what we have eaten more most of our existence. Fat based diets with periods of fasting.

Its only since we have been industrialized and farming grain based food stuffs that we have eaten a large amount of carbs. This has coincided with the western obesity epidemic.

It used to just be called healthy eating (minus slapping newmans own all over a brontasauraus steak of course (a joke before that fella falls off his food pyramid))

 

No money in that though, slap a tag on it and paste it over a load of books and videos and you have yourself a money spinner with saps lining up for the next big thing.

 

 

 

 

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

It used to just be called healthy eating (minus slapping newmans own all over a brontasauraus steak of course (a joke before that fella falls off his food pyramid))

 

No money in that though, slap a tag on it and paste it over a load of books and videos and you have yourself a money spinner with saps lining up for the next big thing.

 

Its not a 'tag', its a state you can put your body into. Its not a marketing term, owned by a corporation, its a shortening of a scientific term. It has distinct effects on the body beyond fat loss, it just so happens people use it for fat loss too.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

No my original argument was processed cheese sandwiched between cheese is a fucking stupid way of going about any diet, even more so when done just to achieve a target.

 

Likewise the idea that you can eat as much pre brought salad dressings as you like just to hit a target is equally ridiculous.

 

The salt and sugar alone in some of them is enough to negate any benefits but then when people see health purely in terms of weight lost I'm sure that the ketogenic diet no doubt seems attractive.

 

Everything in moderation. As I have said, it is just a snack. And it tastes great. You seem to have assumed, somehow, despite my sentence about other fat sources directly above it, that processed cheese is my staple.

[Lario]

It used to just be called healthy eating (minus slapping newmans own all over a brontasauraus steak of course (a joke before that fella falls off his food pyramid))

 

No money in that though, slap a tag on it and paste it over a load of books and videos and you have yourself a money spinner with saps lining up for the next big thing.

 

Now you're saying that "fat based diets with periods of fasting" used to be called healthy eating? So keto is healthy after all?

 

Don't know if you're arguing for the sake of arguing, but you really should take some time out to read some stuff. Maybe start with Ancel Keys and the "Seven Country Study". The results of which were a lie, but the modern food pyramid is based on that.

Or maybe look at the Inuit diet, which is primarily whale meat and blubber, and yet they have little or no heart disease or diabetes.

[J-V]

Gonna try this, as I have mentioned I am a pure carb whore but will try to remain focussed.

 

Any sample meal plans? Don't want to drink shakes because I am sick to fucking death of them to be quite honest.

 

Absolutely nothing wrong with complex carbs mate.  I did a Keto diet many years ago.  Good for losing weight quickly but I much prefer If it Fits Your Macros (IIFYM) diet.  Obviously eating clean.

[Anny Road]

The Inuit throw the fillet to the dogs and eat the fat bits themselves. Complete reverse of our practices.

[Cardie]

Now you're saying that "fat based diets with periods of fasting" used to be called healthy eating? So keto is healthy after all.

What's not healthy about fruit, veg and lean protein?

 

 

[Cardie]

Or maybe look at the Inuit diet, which is primarily whale meat and blubber, and yet they have little or no heart disease or diabetes.

Not sure the temperature in the UK get quite as cold and you don't have to walk quite as far in Liverpool.

 

The Pacific Islands and Hawaii on the other hand....

 

[Lario]

What's not healthy about fruit, veg and lean protein?

 

Nobody's arguing that. You came in here saying the keto is unhealthy.

 

So the burden of proof is on you my friend.

[Lario]

Not sure the temperature in the UK get quite as cold and you don't have to walk quite as far in Liverpool.

 

The Pacific Islands and Hawaii on the other hand....

 

Ahhhh.

So it's the temperature and walking stops their mostly fat based diet from causing heart disease?  So they could turn to a diet of Papa John's and be ok?

 

You're making yourself look silly now fella. Think it's maybe time you sat the next couple of plays out.

[Anny Road]

What's not healthy about fruit, veg and lean protein?

I think you are misunderstanding the process of Ketosis. You need fat so lean protein sources are not that great. Rather than turning carbohydrates into glucose your body uses fat as a fuel source instead. Lean is no use you need fat.

[Cardie]

Nobody's arguing that. You came in here saying the keto is unhealthy.

 

So the burden of proof is on you my friend.

People's application of keto is unhealthy.

 

 

[Cardie]

I think you are misunderstanding the process of Ketosis. You need fat so lean protein sources are not that great. Rather than turning carbohydrates into glucose your body uses fat as a fuel source instead. Lean is no use you need fat.

Fad diets need an angle.

 

Three pounds if bacon fat is fine just don't eat that slice of bread or you'll die.

 

 

[Cardie]

Ahhhh.

So it's the temperature and walking stops their mostly fat based diet from causing heart disease? So they could turn to a diet of Papa John's and be ok?

 

You're making yourself look silly now fella. Think it's maybe time you sat the next couple of plays out.

Why would an Inuits fat heavy diet be ok for them yet the Pacific Islands fat based diet be a contributing factor in the massive rates of cardiovascular vascular disease?

 

 

 

[Bob]

I've not followed anything other than a general cutting of carbs, but I think it's the same.

 

I lost a load of weight quickly, then platoed, then have slowly fell into bad habits so need to kick on again.

 

Just interested in this carb day aspect; is it a necessity? Ie does the lack of carbs stop working after a while so you need to have a day of them, or is it just a way of saying you can still have the stuff you crave as long as it's just one night per week?

 

I ask, because if it's the former, and I will benefit from doing it, then I'll build it in, whereas of not, better off steering clear totally and avoiding getting the taste for the things I used to love eating.

 

Ta.

 

And Cardie, give it a rest.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Fad diets need an angle.

 

Three pounds if bacon fat is fine just don't eat that slice of bread or you'll die.

 

You assertions are exponentially more ridiculous than any posted in this thread. Or from anyone on keto that I have seen.

[Lario]

 

 

People's application of keto is unhealthy.

 

Examples?

 

Fad diets need an angle.

 

Three pounds if bacon fat is fine just don't eat that slice of bread or you'll die.

 

Christ on a bike. You must be trolling at this stage, and I'm probably worse for replying.

 

But the Keto isn't a fad diet. Humans lived like this for thousands of years. It's only the last few hundred years that we've changed things.

The actual "keto diet" was created over 100 years ago as a method of controlling epilepsy. I've a pdf downloaded of one of the first keto books that was published in the early 1900's.

 

Hardly a fucking fad.

 

As a matter of fact, I reckon history will look back on the food pyramid as a fad diet.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

Why would an Inuits fat heavy diet be ok for them yet the Pacific Islands fat based diet be a contributing factor in the massive rates of cardiovascular vascular disease?

 

Obesity is a huge contributing factor to their CV health. They eat too much. Too many calories and they put on weight. 

 

http://www.maxwell.syr.edu/uploadedFiles/moynihan/dst/curtis5.pdf

 

Subsequently, Ringrose and Zimmet conducted another follow-up study in which 77 of the 417 Nauruans were interviewed about their diet. They found that the Nauruan people had “irregular eating habits” consisting of three high-caloric meals per day, supplemented with frequent in-between meal snacking (1979, p. 1338). Few vegetables were eaten. The average caloric intake for males 20-39 exceeded 8,700 calories.

[Lario]

I've not followed anything other than a general cutting of carbs, but I think it's the same.

 

I lost a load of weight quickly, then platoed, then have slowly fell into bad habits so need to kick on again.

 

Just interested in this carb day aspect; is it a necessity? Ie does the lack of carbs stop working after a while so you need to have a day of them, or is it just a way of saying you can still have the stuff you crave as long as it's just one night per week?

 

I ask, because if it's the former, and I will benefit from doing it, then I'll build it in, whereas of not, better off steering clear totally and avoiding getting the taste for the things I used to love eating.

 

Ta.

 

And Cardie, give it a rest.

 

If you want to bang me on your email address, I'll email you on a pdf of the book.

 

Apparently it's the spike in insulin from eating the carbs that relights your metabolism, and then you kick on back into the fat burning.

 

Yer man puts it's more eloquently than that, but that's the jist.